Scrw the Pope?

[warchief_ryan]

What's the worse that can happen if I don't listen to the pope at all?

[a8686]

Also curious about this... Hes been very leaniant with the creatons who have been sacking my towns without mercy..

What happens if you decide to capture Rome?

[Syntax Error]

You get excommunicated from the Catholic faith, which in turn increases religious unrest due to the fact that to the Vatican's eyes, your peoples' faith is heretical and therefore going to hell. Remember, it's the Middle Ages, people are very religious and superstitious about what their church leaders tell them, so if big-man Pope up in Rome tells your people that you are not a true representative of the Catholic Church and not legitimate as a King, then you're gonna have a lot of unrest.

Oh yeah, you're also eligible to be Crusade'd upon.

[Sher Khan]

At the very worse, he'll excommunicate you, and almost all the catholic nations will be downright cold to your diplomacy - and most will probably take this chance to declare war on your heathen souls. From what I've seen, your cities are then considered viable targets for a crusade, and of course simply waging war on you will cause the other catholic nations to gain lots of favor with the pope.

Of course, the opposite is now true. You are now free to exterminate your foes without the shadow of the il papa's hat looming over your shoulder.

Perhaps excommunication has a negative effect or trait for your faction leader on population influence and public order? I am unsure about that.


Also, I think you become free from the wrath of the Inquisition, although someone may correct me on that.


Really, I never had that much of a problem with the pope. Of course, this is probably because 16 of a total 20 popes I've gone through in my English campaign have all been English. I didn't even have to get a majority of the cardinals English, just one would suffice (I build enough churches and burn enough heretics yearly, every cardinal was 'living saint' level).

Really, getting perfect relations with the pope is actually very fun to do, and the benefits are great. Sure, you may feel restricted with the 'don't be fighting other catholics' bit, but once you gain enough favor and clout, and once you manage to get attacked by a nation that has abysmal relations with the pope, you can get the other guy excommunicated.

Now, while it may seem no different than being excommunicated yourself and attacking 'heretics' freely, you can now call a freaking crusade right to the excommunicated nation's capital (seiging and sacking along the way of course). I've wiped out the French, the Milanese, and the Danes this way, and there's just no stopping my Crusade war machine.

But, I guess playing rogue Catholic could be fun too... but then there's the Orthodox/Muslim factions for that role.

[the Eternal Cocoon]

playing as France within 5 turns of my excommunication all three of my former allies, the holy roman empire, Denmark, and Milan, attacked me. A little later the pope called a crusade on Toulouse (the biggest castle in France); Portugal and Sicily decided to join in on the fun and joined the crusade ( along with all the other factions that first attacked me). So now I have to fight not only the previous mentioned factions, but also crusader armies ( they can recruit many very cheap units on the spot). Keep in mind this is only 30 turns after the start of the game, so I don't have much of an advantage over any one of the other bigger factions, not to mention 5 of them.

getting excommunicated will always result in almost every catholic faction declaring war on you ( and every faction, even if they arent at war with you, will have abysmal relations with you).

But it also depends on which faction you play as. When I played as venice I attacked and killed the pope for rome and was excommunicated. But since I controlled italy, there wasn't anything anyone could do as I was protected by the Alps and had a very small attackable perimeter. As france however, I have to defend an enormous perimeter which I simply cant man which results in one faction always digging deeper into my territory while I try to fend off another faction.


edit: all your catholic cities get a big hit to public order with excommunication.

[a8686]

I sorta consider it like the senate in rome.. Its all well and good to protect you in the earlier game but later on the chickens come home to roost and the old mans power trip must come to an end.. I think I know what I'm going to be doing as soon as I get back home...

Oh, so you CAN call crusades while controling rome? Also does the pope keep poping up in the rome region or what? I guess I'll find out when I get to my computer at home but just curious

[Lionel-Richie]

The public order hit is what keeps me scared of excommunication, so much that I'm going to lose my England campaign because of time restraints

When you are excommunicated the Pope stops all sacraments and holy rites in your empire. The Church in your kingdom listens to the Pope on this. The people become upset because their children cannot be baptized and their confession becomes useless.

This is realistic though...I forgot which king it was, but in the Middle Ages the Pope excommunicated an English king for refusing (the new archbishop of Canterbury maybe? Those archbishops cause problems galore, don't they?) something and the English people began to rumble and complain and revolt due to this, forcing the English king's hand.

But yeah...I got excommunicated once and it sent my cities into yellows, blues, and red happiness across the board...it was terrible. I immediately dispatched a diplomat to Rome, bags of florans in tow.