View Poll Results: Do you care if

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  • I wouldn't care

    19 30.16%
  • I would care, but I wish I wouldn't

    6 9.52%
  • I would care: I have a problem with transexuals

    31 49.21%
  • I don't know

    7 11.11%
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Thread: Would you date a transexual?

  1. #241

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    No.

  2. #242

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by fkizz View Post
    Real gender change would only be possible in old school way if said person was born as a legit Hermaphrodite. Then that would make case for real debate on biological standpoint. And that's it. Sorry if my opinion triggered you hard, but I had a few biology classes for something.
    You also seem to still believe 'Gender' and 'Sex' are interchangeable terms. They aren't. Gender is NOT genetically defined, it is socially defined. What we consider to be masculine in this day in age is not what the ancient Greeks considered to be masculine. Nor is it what the Romans considered masculine, or the what vikings considered masculine, or what the Spanish considered masculine, or Apaches considered masculine. You catching my drift?
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  3. #243

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    You catching my drift?
    No. Either born as Hermaphrodite or any talk of changing/choosing sex is mumbo jumbo.
    It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else.

    -George Orwell

  4. #244

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by fkizz View Post
    No. Either born as Hermaphrodite or any talk of changing/choosing sex is mumbo jumbo.
    No one is talking about changing sex. You just seem to be in denial that sex=/=gender.
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  5. #245

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    You're the one cussing, dramatizing and etc because I don't acknowledge transsexuals as a real gender change, or that transgender is a real gender.

    Real gender/sex change would only be possible in old school way if said person was born as a legit Hermaphrodite. Then that would make case for real debate on biological standpoint. And that's it. Sorry if my opinion triggered you hard, but I had a few biology classes for something.
    What you are talking about? i think you dont know what Gender means...lol
    No. Either born as Hermaphrodite or any talk of changing/choosing sex is mumbo jumbo.
    That is what you seemed to belive, but you have been showing ignorance in the matter.

    You also seem to still believe 'Gender' and 'Sex' are interchangeable terms. They aren't. Gender is NOT genetically defined, it is socially defined.
    Actualy it is both. It just doesnt resume it self to a biological nature only, but every characteristics related to the issue, and context of course. Socialy, morphologicaly, and yes biologicaly too. In this particular case, biologicaly it is not a factor, but everything else is.
    Last edited by Knight of Heaven; November 05, 2015 at 05:18 PM.

  6. #246

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Not only is sex not equal to gender, for gender is dynamic by anthropology within cultures, locations, and varies by time, but sexual orientation doesn't equal gender either. If confused, take some classes and open some psychology books.

    At least consider a model of a long continuum, not a binary choice, for all of those categories, and coupled with masculine to feminine along that continuum.
    Last edited by RubiconDecision; November 05, 2015 at 05:43 PM.

  7. #247

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by RubiconDecision View Post
    Not only is sex not equal to gender, for gender is dynamic by anthropology within cultures, locations, and varies by time, but sexual orientation doesn't equal gender either. If confused, take some classes and open some psychology books.
    I am aware. Being transgender has to do with gender identity, though, not sexual orientation.
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  8. #248

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    I am aware. Being transgender has to do with gender identity, though, not sexual orientation.
    Being transgendered can be both/and along the psychological maturation process of the patient. It is incredibly complex. Not to mention some transexuals in prior pre-op relationships who attempt to maintain that. I know of a case where the patient attempted to reverse the change due to reticence and guilt from their children.

    A person born a man, got married, loved their wife, had a sex change, stayed married, etc. It can be remarkably different say if a child or a teenager who's developing sexual identity.

    That situation is enormously demanding on spouses who are heterosexual but supposed to essentially become bisexual.

    This is why it takes a unique individual to marry them, and why it's cruel to not seriously meditate upon entering that relationship...for breakups are devastating to them. That's the source of suicidal ideation in transexuals and why persistent trust issues arise.
    Last edited by RubiconDecision; November 05, 2015 at 05:57 PM.

  9. #249

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by RubiconDecision View Post
    Being transgendered can be both/and along the psychological maturation process of the patient. It is incredibly complex. Not to mention some transexuals in prior pre-op relationships who attempt to maintain that. I know of a case where the patient attempted to reverse the change due to reticence and guilt from their children.
    It is complex, but what counts somebody as being 'transgender' is their gender identity does not match their sex; sexual orientation itself doesn't have implication on whether someone is transgender or not. What is the point of your anecdote?
    They give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then it's night once more.

  10. #250

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by The spartan View Post
    It is complex, but what counts somebody as being 'transgender' is their gender identity does not match their sex; sexual orientation itself doesn't have implication on whether someone is transgender or not. What is the point of your anecdote?
    First, I'm trying to clarify some nonsense fkizz spouted off.

    Second, even when people think they've got a handle on a complex medical issue like being transexual, it's not uncommon for complicated confusing sexual experimentation to occur while the patient attempts to cope. They've got new anatomical equipment, try to maintain prior relationships, attempt new ones, and this can be with either males or females. It's largely about acceptance, stability, economic security, and hopefully love.
    Last edited by RubiconDecision; November 05, 2015 at 06:07 PM.

  11. #251
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    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by RubiconDecision View Post
    Not only is sex not equal to gender, for gender is dynamic by anthropology within cultures, locations, and varies by time, but sexual orientation doesn't equal gender either. If confused, take some classes and open some psychology books.

    At least consider a model of a long continuum, not a binary choice, for all of those categories, and coupled with masculine to feminine along that continuum.
    Don't we usually disagree? I'm going to get in trouble with my Liberal reptilian masters if I keep this up.

    That's a very helpful model. you can have several bundled continua, not exactly intersecting but giving multiple axes to sexual/gendered/physical/evolutionary/performative identity. The simple binaries inherent in historical feminism are as binding as perceived historical "patriarchy" in many ways, albeit less brutally and thoroughly enforced.

    A lot of people get crushed in the machinery of simple black/white conceptual models.
    Jatte lambastes Calico Rat

  12. #252

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclops View Post
    Don't we usually disagree? I'm going to get in trouble with my Liberal reptilian masters if I keep this up.

    That's a very helpful model. you can have several bundled continua, not exactly intersecting but giving multiple axes to sexual/gendered/physical/evolutionary/performative identity. The simple binaries inherent in historical feminism are as binding as perceived historical "patriarchy" in many ways, albeit less brutally and thoroughly enforced.

    A lot of people get crushed in the machinery of simple black/white conceptual models.

    Disagreement doesn't mean disrespect. Himster and never agree but nearly always I respect his posts.
    https://books.google.com/books?id=Gy...gender&f=false
    Nietzsche Dionysian/Apollonian and Gender

    https://books.google.com/books?id=Zv...gender&f=false
    Or this from a feminist anthropologist

    That's part of a paradigm for what we're discussing and gender studies.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollonian_and_Dionysian
    Paglia's usage

    American humanities scholar Camille Paglia writes about the Apollonian and Dionysian in her controversial 1990 bestseller Sexual Personae.[7] The broad outline of her concept is borrowed from Nietzsche, an admitted influence, although Paglia's ideas diverge significantly.
    The Apollonian and Dionysian concepts comprise a dichotomy that serves as the basis of Paglia's theory of art and culture. For Paglia, the Apollonian is light and structured while the Dionysian is dark and chthonic (she prefers Chthonic to Dionysian throughout the book, arguing that the latter concept has become all but synonymous with hedonism and is inadequate for her purposes, declaring that "the Dionysian is no picnic."). The Chthonic is associated with females, wild/chaotic nature, and unconstrained sex/procreation. In contrast, the Apollonian is associated with males, clarity, celibacy and/or homosexuality, rationality/reason, and solidity, along with the goal of oriented progress: "Everything great in western civilization comes from struggle against our origins."[8]
    She argues that there is a biological basis to the Apollonian/Dionysian dichotomy, writing: "The quarrel between Apollo and Dionysus is the quarrel between the higher cortex and the older limbic and reptilian brains."[9] Moreover, Paglia attributes all the progress of human civilization to masculinity revolting against the Chthonic forces of nature, and turning instead to the Apollonian trait of ordered creation. The Dionysian is a force of chaos and destruction, which is the overpowering and alluring chaotic state of wild nature. Rejection of – or combat with – Chthonianism by socially constructed Apollonian virtues accounts for the historical dominance of men (including asexual and homosexual men; and childless and/or lesbian-leaning women) in science, literature, arts, technology and politics. As an example, Paglia states: "The male orientation of classical Athens was inseparable from its genius. Athens became great not despite but because of its misogyny."[10]
    This explains multiple phenomena like situational homosexuality in prisons, fops or dandys in European history, Japanese samurai homosexuals, Spartan homosexuals, and none alike. Smilarly the wide breadth of bisexuality and lesbianism too.

    In the teen development of sexual identity, it's not uncommon to meet such a strong compelling mentor of the same sex that one has a crush on them specifically and no other person of the same sex. That fits on a continuum, isn't binary, and why mentors develop strong boundaries to protect an obsequious youth.
    Last edited by RubiconDecision; November 05, 2015 at 11:08 PM.

  13. #253
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    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by fkizz View Post
    You're the one cussing, dramatizing and etc
    Cursing is my primary ethnic trait.
    Stop being such a racist.

    Real gender/sex change would only be possible in old school way if said person was born as a legit Hermaphrodite.
    A biological sex-change: well yes. Current technology cannot change biological sex.
    But gender re-assignment surgery is quite different, gender is a cultural construct and is subject to the whims of that culture. A component, or rather a rapidly growing component of our culture supports the ability for individuals to redefine themselves.

    Then that would make case for real debate on biological standpoint. And that's it. Sorry if my opinion triggered you hard, but I had a few biology classes for something.
    That's nice.
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are so certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.
    -Betrand Russell

  14. #254

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    Cursing is my primary ethnic trait.
    Stop being such a racist.
    O-ok


    Quote Originally Posted by Himster View Post
    A biological sex-change: well yes. Current technology cannot change biological sex.
    But gender re-assignment surgery is quite different, gender is a cultural construct and is subject to the whims of that culture. A component, or rather a rapidly growing component of our culture supports the ability for individuals to redefine themselves.
    Well I do agree that efeminate males and masculine females exist, but it's a matter of time before "I was born with the wrong sex, trapped in the wrong body" starts appearing.

    The definition of Gender starts getting used as a gateway to justify "sex changing operations".

    That's why there's some mistrust and sex/gender gets to be seen as a wordplay by some in several cases. Current surgeries can't change the sex they were born with biologically, they can only give illusion it's more female or male.

    The DNA is the same, the Chromosomes are the same. Ironic the modern left has so much hate for the double helix, while it gets propaganda that it bothers religious people instead.
    Last edited by fkizz; November 06, 2015 at 01:13 PM.
    It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else.

    -George Orwell

  15. #255

    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    And when examining chromosomes to determine whether someone is a potential date or not becomes a thing, then we can start worrying about not being able to change them. Sexual attraction is based on phenotype, not genotype.

  16. #256
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    Default Re: Would you date a transexual?

    Quote Originally Posted by fkizz View Post
    Well I do agree that efeminate males and masculine females exist, but it's a matter of time before "I was born with the wrong sex, trapped in the wrong body" starts appearing.
    Good, so we agree that there's no problem.

    The definition of Gender starts getting used as a gateway to justify "sex changing operations".
    So? It's their body, they can do what they want with it.

    That's why there's some mistrust and sex/gender gets to be seen as a wordplay by some in several cases.

    Current surgeries can't change the sex they were born with biologically, they can only give illusion it's more female or male.
    The DNA is the same, the Chromosomes are the same.
    We have established that the only people who think biological sex can be changed are crazy fringe group fanatics. The left's equivalent of Neo-Nazis.

    Ironic the modern left has so much hate for the double helix, while it gets propaganda that it bothers religious people instead.
    The double helix bothers the extreme right and the extreme left. That's perfect for my purposes.
    The old notion of left versus right doesn't really apply any more, the current struggle is between authoritarians (who are both left and right) and libertarians (who are both left and right).
    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are so certain of themselves, but wiser people are full of doubts.
    -Betrand Russell

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