Download Morning Sun Version 3.3

[uanime5]

Suwon castle is a great show, I've been to others mountain-side/built castles and you can see why anyone would have a lot of trouble siege them.. Siege implies surrounding, many only have one side you can effectively hit at once.

Unfortunately I can't make castle where you can only attack from one side.

On top of that the local population would often go to the castle and help defend it, something not seen in MANY places. (but not unknown).
- On top of that constant guerrilla warfare, and mallita/monk armies appearing and fighting also.

I can't implement this because Shogun 2 doesn't not allow me to. If I make a huge garrison spawn when a city is attacked then this garrison will spawn for every faction, so if the Japanese capture a city and a Korean army attacks it a huge number of Korean monks and guerillas will defend the Japanese.

I know you know this as I read what you wrote, but bows/out ranging and being determined not to give in is how they beat the mongolians... and most others that came along.

They didn't beat the Mongols, which is why the Mongols conquered them. Also these bows didn't protect the Koreans from the Mongol siege technology.

They fell and submitted to become a tributary state but only because their country was on fire.

You mean because the Khitan refugees destroyed the Korean army before the Mongols even arrived, the Mongols destroyed much of northern Korea, or the wako attacked the south of Korea.

You could also blame weak leadership both monarchy and advisers.

What are you talking about? During most of this time the Korean monarch had no real power and Korea was ruled by the Choe military dictatorship.

Other than that it wasn't practical to control/fight/cost effective.

What are you talking about? The Mongols did fight the Korean army, defeated them, and Korea had to provide tributes to the Mongols in exchange for the Mongols not burning the country to the ground.

They even moved the capital at one point knowing the horsemen couldn't do anything lol.

Which resulted in the Korean government being exiled to an island, while the Mongols effectively ruled the rest of Korea.

(not it only became a tribute state, most other nations china to iraq and egypt were forced to bow down weirdly... they couldn't submit korea the same.)

China effectively became part of the Mongol empire. The same happened to Korea due to the Mongol princes and princesses marrying the Korean royalty. This is why the last of the Mongol rulers of Korea sent an army to fight the Ming dynasty and restore the Yuan to power.

Iran was ruled by Mongols as the Il Khanate.

Iraq (Baghdad) was destroyed by the Mongols.

Egypt was never conquered by the Mongols. The Mamluk Sultanate famously destroyed the Mongols at the Battle of Ain Jalut.

Think about it if they outranged Koreans with those bows they would have just equip everyone with a bow and sit 25m out or range while showering them... (ironically this is exactly what happens in the game) But they didn't, 1m chinese army failed, Jurchen failed.. and they only gave in once their country was burned.

The Mongols succeeded because they ignored the forts and burned the rest of the country down. Something that can't easily be represented in this mod.

Also the Mongols conquered many Korean fortresses by standing out of range of the arrows and using siege equipment.

Moving strait onto the actual VS japan yeah, weak leadership /no standing army/few idiot choices. ( I feel like you actually said some of this)
national hero Admiral Yi with 13 ships utterly raped the japanese fleet that was 10x as big.

Which is why the Korean navy is stronger than the Japanese navy.

Sure it's known I know, but it makes you wonder they throw general Admiral Yi Sun-sin out of office despite his wins O_O Clearly there was a problem with leadership/government apposed to the ACTUAL armed forces. Giving office to morons and taking people out that actually know what they're doing.

It was mainly due to politics. One political party would hinder the generals of another party to prevent their rival gaining favour with the king.

I don't know, I can understand you want to make them all different and you want to show numbers (despite unit cap by number by making them cheaper etc). So having them all alike isn't 'okay' BUT, for one unit for 200 range korean soldiers you may as well just hire 9 units of juchan Flood your enemies with cheaper more effective units. when two stacks attack your castle and you have a fairly mid-range 60% archer heavy army to defend it. and those two stacks are 75%+ archers who all outrange you... you get raped. Yet in history this never happened despite many more than the 2 stacks represent.

How will reducing the range by 25 change anything? You'll still be outnumbered 9 to 1.

Also when did the Jurchens attack with an army equivalent of 2 stacks?

Finally historically soldiers had many ways to avoid arrows, such as building a roof over the soldiers. Something I can't add to this game.

The inability to defend with your own national castles with your national units when they are famed for their castles and archers is hilariously out of place.

In a mod about a war where the Koreans were unable to defend their own national castles with their national units.

The northern invasions by the nomadic peoples in history/mongolians later turned out to be vietnam on crack a horrific disaster for everyone because they nearly coined guerrilla and peasant warfare.

Which battle are you referring to? You seem to have made a lot of claims that are historically wrong.

Maybe I'm beating a dead horse, but it seems so off... No a nation with heavy armour and one of the best bows in history would have better stats.. even if they did cost more... to limit range is crazy. under the guise of balance. While totally crippling them and making them worthless/stupid to buy.

I already explained that the Koreans have poor stats because the army was in poor condition at this time. This is nothing to do with balance.

Wiki (although not great) is fairly correct. Look up Mongolian invasions of korea and the red-turban invasion, if you care to know more about how they fight and what they resisted.

Why are you telling someone who has done a huge amount of research regarding the military of Korea at this time to look at an invasion that happened 3 centuries before the Imjin war and a Chinese rebellion that occurred 2 centuries before the Imjin war? Wouldn't it make more sense to look at wars closer to this time period?

I'm not going to change my mod because of your constant whining about how terrible it is that that during this time period the Korean army was poor quality. If you want me to make changes provide some sources from this time period to back up your claims about the abilities of various armies. Information about armies from centuries ago is not useful.

[[N2]Kami]

Is it normal that I can't upgrade from Tusi farm level 2 to Tusi farm level 3? My farms stop upgrade-able at Improved Irrigation.

[uanime5]

Is it normal that I can't upgrade from Tusi farm level 2 to Tusi farm level 3? My farms stop upgrade-able at Improved Irrigation.

You may not be able to research the technology required for this upgrade. Some playable factions have their own tech trees but the non-playable ones use the Japanese tech tree. I believe you need to be using the Ming tech tree to be able to upgrade Tusi farms.

You may need to make a new tech tree in order to upgrade these farms. Alternatively edit the building_level_required_technology_junctions to remove the tech requirement.

[[N2]Kami]

I did change them to shogun 2 tech tree in my file but it seems that it still won't work. Do I need to start a new game to make it change?

[uanime5]

I did change them to shogun 2 tech tree in my file but it seems that it still won't work. Do I need to start a new game to make it change?

I would recommend doing that as many things aren't changed if you don't start a new game.

[jinkein]

How can i install this mod with Shogun 2 crack ( it doesn't have steam)

[BulletProof Monk]

Simply put, It took them six invasions 27 years. And unlike those other countries never fully incorporated.
Also, as the mod is based on the war, yet before it without the powers in play. Simply history doesn't repeat itself after turn one. So those inequalities should show, but not be so hilariously detrimental.

"How will reducing the range by 25 change anything? You'll still be outnumbered 9 to 1."

Gives people (normally fortified) positions with equivalent bows a standing chance, if 9 guys run at you it's better to go down swinging and knocking as many out as possible. At the moment it's a crippling mess, you said it yourself you can't recreate such defences so you further make them useless? O_o

"While totally crippling them and making them worthless"
As I said before.

"Khitan refugees destroyed the Korean army"
You're leaving out the part where the southern korean army defeated and pushed them north of pyongan. Then with join opperation with mongolians finished them.

"The Mongols took Anju; however, they were forced to retreat after the Siege of Kusong. Frustrated by siege warfare, Sartai instead used his armies' superior mobility to bypass the Goryeo army and succeeded in taking the capital"

And yet you made korean hilariously trash defending castle

"The Siege of Kusong which occurred in 1231 was a decisive Goryeo victory against the Mongol Empire. After the Mongol army crossed the Yalu river, it quickly captured almost all of Goryeo's border defenses. The Mongol army however ran into stiff resistance both at Anju and the city ofKusong, commanded by General Park Seo.
To take Kusong, Sartaq used a full array of siege weapons to bring down the city's defenses. Lines of catapults launched both boulders and molten metal at the cities walls. The Mongols deployed special assault teams who manned siege towers and scaling ladders. Other tactics used were pushing flaming carts against the city's wooden gates and tunneling under the walls. The most grisly weapon used during the siege were fire-bombs which contained boiled down, liquefiedhuman fat.
According to an old Mongol general who, toward the end of the siege said:
"...I have never seen [a city] undergo an attack like this which did not, in the end, submit."^[1]Despite the fact the Goryeo army was heavily outnumbered and after over thirty days of brutal siege warfare, Goryeo soldiers still refused to surrender and with mounting Mongol casualties, the Mongol army could not take the city and had to withdraw."


- Point being "
"...I have never seen [a city] undergo an attack like this which did not, in the end, submit."^[1]Despite the fact the Goryeo army was heavily outnumbered and after over thirty days of brutal siege warfare, Goryeo soldiers still refused to surrender and with mounting Mongol casualties, the Mongol army could not take the city and had to withdraw."

Yet this mod makes korea a joke in defending, mostly due to massed range units against them having magic range power./no cost even 200 years later, their(northern peoples) bows didn't just get better. Also it's the MOST up to date thing we have in regards not northern invasion/warfare and opposition. tech wise. It's about the only way to level them against each other.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Kuju

[Jay the Byzantine]

How can i install this mod with Shogun 2 crack ( it doesn't have steam)

Get legal version. Modders can't and won't support pirates.

[uanime5]

Simply put, It took them six invasions 27 years. And unlike those other countries never fully incorporated.

That's because the government retreated to an island and it wasn't until the Choe administration fell that Korean king surrendered. During this 27 years the Mongols could do whatever they wanted in Korea and the Koreans could not stop them.

Also after submitting many Korean princes and princesses married Mongol princes and princesses, so they were incorporated.

Also, as the mod is based on the war, yet before it without the powers in play. Simply history doesn't repeat itself after turn one. So those inequalities should show, but not be so hilariously detrimental.

That's because more than 300 years passed since the battles with the Mongols. As I said you need to look at sources closer to the time period to determine the state of the Korean army during this time period.

Gives people (normally fortified) positions with equivalent bows a standing chance, if 9 guys run at you it's better to go down swinging and knocking as many out as possible. At the moment it's a crippling mess, you said it yourself you can't recreate such defences so you further make them useless?

Even if I give the Jurchens a similar range to the Koreans many battles will end the same way due to the difference in numbers.

You're leaving out the part where the southern korean army defeated and pushed them north of pyongan. Then with join opperation with mongolians finished them.

The Mongols were the ones who demanded that the Koreans provide them with supplies and men.

"The Mongols took Anju; however, they were forced to retreat after the

Siege of Kusong. Frustrated by siege warfare, Sartai instead used his armies' superior mobility to bypass the Goryeo army and succeeded in taking the capital"

And yet you made korean hilariously trash defending castle

So because one Korean castle was able to defend against the Mongols and all the others fell to them this means that all Korean castles should be able to defend against Mongols? Surely this show that the majority of Korean cities were not capable of repelling invaders.

- Point being "

"...I have never seen [a city] undergo an attack like this which did not, in the end, submit."^[1]Despite the fact the Goryeo army was heavily outnumbered and after over thirty days of brutal siege warfare, Goryeo soldiers still refused to surrender and with mounting Mongol casualties, the Mongol army could not take the city and had to withdraw."

One city being able to defend themselves from the Mongols does not mean all cities could beat them. This city was the only one that was able to repel the Mongols and after the war ended the Koreans tried to give the general leading this city to the Mongols because they disliked his harsh rule.

Yet this mod makes korea a joke in defending, mostly due to massed range units against them having magic range power./no cost even 200 years later, their(northern peoples) bows didn't just get better.

I'm fairly sure 200 years of improvements would have made their weapons better. Especially since they were constantly involved in warfare and tribes that didn't improve their weapons would be defeated by those who did.

Also it's the MOST up to date thing we have in regards not northern invasion/warfare and opposition. tech wise. It's about the only way to level them against each other.

A battle more than 3 centuries before the start of this mod is not the most up-to-date thing regarding Korean combat. The Koreans regularly fought the Jurchens and there are plenty of accounts closer to this time period. One example is the 1583 invasion led by Pon-ho chieftains that was defeated by Shin Rip.

[BulletProof Monk]

My point is that siege would have depended heavily (apart from strait equipment like ladders/rams/other) on missile units. And when the whole thing is dragged back to the actual point of the matter, a half-trained unit of archers can hit the same ranges as anyone else. (sure the accuracy will be off)

Seems weird to just be like oh these guys who would be using the exact same bow that happened to be trained in the capital can just fire 50/25 further. because..... err ????? 'flavour' ? in combination with being wildly outnumbered (and AI archer spam issues) due to cheap raising cost, cheap maintenance

It's a shame the game is so dated, the range should change with elevation of buildings or ground. - really that's it's own issue. But archers getting out-preformed on range by similar equipped units is just weird, you could take accuracy into account if that's the argument of training but the range?... eh

Basically you put korea in, spent a load of time on it... then crippled it for lols? Sure trying to recreate the setting JUST before the imjin war is the aim, but those mistakes made. That morale lost, and bad decisions, are in the hands of the player, not the history book at turn one. - Meaning some, many or all of those things may have/may never happen. Or happen in reverse.

I don't know man, I really like this mod but korea may as well hire nothing but jurchens and spam.. it's like the old first few weeks of shogun 2 issues before CA tried to balance it where people would just levy armies of basic peasant spear or bow and overrun them with numbers.

[DeanE555]

Hi everyone,thanks for the mod and all your hard work. I don't know if it has been answered yet but I can't seem to play Shogun 2 after I uncheck the mod boxes. I tried to remove the files from the data folder but I still can't play. Can you help me?

[uanime5]

My point is that siege would have depended heavily (apart from strait equipment like ladders/rams/other) on missile units.

Unless the Mongols had the Chinese use siege equipment, as was mentioned in the source you quoted. Then the Mongols could have fought from a distance.

And when the whole thing is dragged back to the actual point of the matter, a half-trained unit of archers can hit the same ranges as anyone else. (sure the accuracy will be off)

Seems weird to just be like oh these guys who would be using the exact same bow that happened to be trained in the capital can just fire 50/25 further. because..... err ????? 'flavour' ?

From these sentences it's clear you know nothing about archery. The distance you can shoot an arrow in archery is based on the archer's physical strength because the stronger you are the further you can pull the bow string back, allowing you to shoot the arrow further.

Soldiers from the capital are professionals and can shoot further due to better training and more physical strength.

in combination with being wildly outnumbered (and AI archer spam issues) due to cheap raising cost, cheap maintenance

And how does this differ from what happened in real life?

But archers getting out-preformed on range by similar equipped units is just weird, you could take accuracy into account if that's the argument of training but the range?... eh

In real life many archers were able to outperform other archers with the same equipment due to their training and physical abilities. You can't just pick up a bow and be able to fire as far as a trained archer.

Also skeletons of English longbowmen can be distinguished from other skeletons due to their enlarged left arm, which they got due to the amount of training they had to endure.

Basically you put korea in, spent a load of time on it... then crippled it for lols?

I'm not going to tolerate you being abusive towards me because you don't like that the Korean army was weak during this time period. The next time you're abusive to me I'm reporting you to TWC's mods because I have no intention of putting up with your constant abuse any longer.

Sure trying to recreate the setting JUST before the imjin war is the aim, but those mistakes made. That morale lost, and bad decisions, are in the hands of the player, not the history book at turn one. - Meaning some, many or all of those things may have/may never happen. Or happen in reverse.

The purpose of this mod is to accurately represent the various nations during this time period. This means that if the Korean army was in poor condition at the start of this war they will be in poor condition at the start of this mod.

I don't know man, I really like this mod but korea may as well hire nothing but jurchens and spam.. it's like the old first few weeks of shogun 2 issues before CA tried to balance it where people would just levy armies of basic peasant spear or bow and overrun them with numbers.

Well if I could implement a script that would cause the Jurchens to be more likely to rebel against Korean generals and start looting I would. Unfortunately I can't do this so Korea can have larger Jurchen armies than they would have been able to field in real life.

And how is this inaccurate? During the sengoku period ashigaru armies became commonplace because they were cheaper than samurai armies.

[uanime5]

Hi everyone,thanks for the mod and all your hard work. I don't know if it has been answered yet but I can't seem to play Shogun 2 after I uncheck the mod boxes. I tried to remove the files from the data folder but I still can't play. Can you help me?

You have to check the mod boxes and put the files in the data folder.

[[N2]Kami]

I think he means uninstalling the mod.

[uanime5]

I think he means uninstalling the mod.

If you want to uninstall the mod you just need to delete the pack files.

[cheburashka307]

Hi, i recently started Shibata campaign. However, there is no castle or town icon on the campaign map, it is just name and blank (like literally no castle on the campaign map, like clicking in a blank space)

Is this a bug?

[nguyenmaithu]

can i use Morning Sun with Master of Strategy mod? i think castle model in that mod look great,

I think you can ask him about making new castle model in battlefield for Morning sun mod

[Jay the Byzantine]

can i use Morning Sun with Master of Strategy mod? i think castle model in that mod look great,

I think you can ask him about make new castle model in battlefield for Morning sun mod

Those are two separate mods and won't work together.

[mhawari]

Unfortunately u cannot use ming mod with M.O.S mod, bcoz i've already tested, and its really not complitable with each other.

[szsh55291904]

Hello,long time no see.

I had check your camping map last friday, and now, I would like to tell you the result.
The suffix of the provinces or cities such as "fu", "wei" and "dusi" just mean the popularity of them, and you can choose to delete them.

Here are the correct names of the cities in ancient times(I mean the Ming Dynasty) of China:
Dandong to fuzhouwei, Dunhua is not a city, I cannot find it in the maps,
Shenyang to Liaodongdusi
Haizhou to Gaizhouwei
Ningyuan to Guangningwei
Beijing to Jingshi
Shanhaiguan to Yongpinfu
Xiongxian,changzhou,dezhou,I cannot find them, but their position is Hejianfu
Chengteh to wanquandusi
Jiaozhou to dengzhoufu
Guangping to shundefu
Lingqing to dongchangfu
Jining to yanzhoufu
Bozhou to fengyangfu
Hefei to luzhoufu or anqingfu(this is my hometown!)
Jindezhen to huizhoufu
Jiujiang to yuezhoufu
Hengyang to hengzhou
Longyan to chaozhou
Sanming to Zhangzhou

I just find these problems, and I think the borders of the cities are not very correct, but this is not a big probiem.
And I suggest you adding the southeast China including the DongfanIsland (Taiwan) and Qiongzhou(Hainan province) in to the camping map, then you can add the Portuguesa faction and Netherland into the game.Sino-Japanese War
At last, I want to use your map in my mod which is about the Qing Dynasty of China ,and I plan to make it about the first Sino-Japanese War .
I am looking forward hearing from you.