Restart: The Saga

[Zeus Almighty]

This is not to say it will be happening anytime soon or expeditiously, but it seems to me we have three ideas popping up as far as possible Restart Era or Situation.

The Era's:
Invasion- The Andals sail from Andalos to take what they perceive theirs, Westeros. This setting is a make what you want, be who you want, and create what you want, setting. Some things could be scripted to help a loose guide to the Invasion, but most of the RP would be free range. Would require creativity by Role-players, and patience because it would be mod demanding.

Conquest- Aegon descends with his sister wives and who is to say what lore we keep and/or change. With the lore of this is much more stable than the Invasion, one could get....inventive -----------ADDITION-----Seemingly Ruled out.

The Situation

Single Kingdom- Any Kingdom (but we all know it would likely be the Reach, North, Westerlands and MAYBE the Vale), time period yet to be solidified.

ADDITION---- The Hoare Kingdom (time period to be determined)

Poll to follow, but lets discuss

[Lucius Malfoy]

Gonna have to say no to the Conquest because, as said before, unlike the smaller dragons of the Dance, we would have castle-burning and army desolation dragons such as the Black Dread. I would rather we do a setting without dragons this time. Plus, honestly, I feel you have to do lore Conquest (Aegon lands and conquest begins). Can't really make anything up. Just doesn't make sense.

And you forget to bring up the Riverlands as a single kingdom! Come on, Zeus! The rivalry among the Riverlander nobility always ensures someone becomes king and then falls apart only for another to rise.

[Pontifex Maximus]

I don't feel like the conquest would have to follow lore at all. People have what they have and then we have a war. If someone with a dragon came knocking on my Arryns' door they would be invited to go themselves.

[Lucius Malfoy]

Last I checked, according to lore, a dragon actually flew into the Eyrie, Ponti. They didn't knock. The regent at the time walked in to find Visenya and her dragon in the Eyrie with the child Vale King on Visenya's lap, staring at the dragon.

Again though, if we did the Conquest as a restart, it would have to start off with the lore approach (Aegon lands and declares war on the Seven Kingdoms). Then let it go on from there. Makes no sense otherwise. Its also the fact that the three dragons would have to be seriously buffed up. I mean we are talking about Belarion the Black Dread. Making that dragon weak doesn't make sense for an rp.

Which is why I suggested lets do a setting without dragons. I just don't want to deal with them after the Dance. Reason why I suggested Seven Kingdoms period before the arrival of the Targaryens.

[Pontifex Maximus]

Last I checked, according to lore, a dragon actually flew into the Eyrie, Ponti. They didn't knock. The regent at the time walked in to find Visenya and her dragon in the Eyrie with the child Vale King on Visenya's lap, staring at the dragon.

Exactly, what sort of moron doesn't set a watch?

[Zeus Almighty]

LM: I am better than that man my bad

I agree with LM's take on the conquest. I feel like you can change the names, you can change the players and some of the flow of it all, but it will inevitably turn out the same. Even with lore amendments if we are going to go conquest then there is no reason for the Targs not to win, else we could just use any time period before hand and if RP staggers, introduce the Conquest to stimulate the RP.

[Pericles of Athens]

Belarion the Black Dread is an uber powerful dragon, but that doesn't mean he's invincible. Theoretically he could be killed and if the Black Dread died the conquest would be undone, he was both the bread and butter of the Targ strategy.

[Lucius Malfoy]

You still got Vhagar and Meraxes to deal with. And lets not forget that Meraxes was killed by accident. The Black Dread was already over a hundred years old too, doubt it would be easy to take such a dragon that pretty much the Cannibal with black scales. We are talking about when dragons were still massive, powerful and feared, unlike the dragons of the Dance who were stinted in growth because of the Dragonpit.

And thank you for agreeing with me, Zeus. There is no reason that the Targs not to win and no reason to just change the Conquest from the Targaryens. You can change the names and players, but that's about it.

I just would rather not have to deal with the uber dragons of the Conquest or any dragons for that matter. Lets either go for a setting before the Targs arrived or later on after Aegon III.

I am all for rping in a single region before it was united under the Great Houses; North, Riverlands, Reach and Westerlands.

[Pericles of Athens]

Vhagar and Meraxes are not the Black Dread, in fact the Black Dread is the only dragon we know of to have such power or have power anywhere near it. The Cannibal may be on par with him for power but we never get a direct statement from GRRM about that.

[Lucius Malfoy]

Meraxes was still larger than Vhagar and able to engulf the entire vanguard of the Storm King at the Battle of the Last Storm (and prior to that, engulfed much of the Kingswood to burn out a Stormlander army there).

Vhagar burned the fleet of the Vale when the Targaryens moved to invade the Vale by sea and capturing Gulltown.

Black Dread did burn the great keep of Harrenhal, yet the other two dragons were able to accomplish just as much damage as Aegon's dragon. Belarion had the more fearsome appearance.

Doesn't matter if they are not the Black Dread, they are still the three great dragons of the Conquest, the most powerful dragons of House Targaryen

[Pericles of Athens]

Meraxes died in Dorne and Vhagar died in a battle with Caraxes(after a century of growth after the conquest), not to mention Vhagar fought in the Dance and wasn't burning up entire armies in dragonfire. Both the Field of Flame and the burning of Harrenhal were perpetrated by the Black Dread, if someone had managed to kill him the conquest wouldn't have been. Could they theoretically have gone on without him? Yes, I suppose. But they faced thousands upon thousands of Westrosi and without the Black Dread I question the ability of the other two dragons to deal with them.

Edit
Just for scale Meraxes was said to swallow a horse whole while the Black Dread was able to swallow a mammoth whole.

[Lucius Malfoy]

Correction; Field of the Flame was done by all three dragons.

[Zeus Almighty]

I see where you are going peri, and what you're trying to say. What I'm saying is this: even if you redid the entire thing and the Targs lose, then why start here in the first place

[Lucius Malfoy]

^What Zeus says exactly.

Reason why I just wanna start either before the Targs or after they have lost their dragons.

[Lucius Malfoy]

Honestly, I wanna see a Seven Kingdoms setting where one of the Great Houses or perhaps some random guy manages to unite the Seven Kingdoms as Aegon the Dragon did and we create an alternate timeline for the GoT universe.

[Oznerol]

Again you're discussing the minor details and losing the whole scale, the concept itself. Again you're glancing the branches and forgetting the forest itself. The question is: What are we going to play? Discussing such details about one of the options is senseless, right now. And an Andal invasion is a worthless idea, still many of the families haven't been created, we don't even know the frontiers, the province boundaries or who controls what. It would be a huge mess that would require loads of work that nowadays we cannot do, considering our moderation and playerbase are depleted.

I vote for the one realm option. And the Riverlands isn't that interesting in my opinion.

Anyway, if you continue posting like this we'll end no-where and playing nothing. Focus, for the Seven's sakes, focus on PICKING a setting, not ranting about dragons! For the 10000000000th time!

[Pinkerton]

Let's take a break anyone?

[Pericles of Athens]

Let's take a break anyone?

[Zeus Almighty]

Oz I literally chuckled, about the dragons. Anyway, I'm for any setting that is without dragons.
I do however have to disagree that the Andal setting is useless. No families means we can be completely original. COMPLETELY. If people can't handle that, then we can rule it out. As for boundaries and etc, if we want to go easy, we can always use the provinces we have as a basis for the held lands of First Men, clans and barbarians. That's if you want to make it easy to do.

Note: I obviously know that the province line would HARDLY be reflective of how it was then. And that it would be ignorant to say that there would be NO change in the thousands of years from Invasion to Conquest, but it WILL give us something to work with.

i can do single Kingdom, I am just preferable to the Andal Invasion


Vernon Roche: we can take plenty of time for a break, in the meantime we can slowly shape our next RP

[Lucius Malfoy]

I vote one realm option as well with the possibility of creating a united Seven Kingdoms by said realm and thus by someone different. Would be cool if a Crownlander house becomes the Lord of the Seven Kingdoms.