Saruman's death or immortality

[MUA]

hello, is it possible to change it somehow to saruman be immortal and only him? i like playing isengard and want it more realistic to the book. i know that they can be immortal or just die of age because of game original writers but maybe there is a solution to this somehow just for him?

[Ngugi]

It's possible to create a respawning character-script, as the Immortal Nazgul-script and Immortal Heroes-script do (both found in MOS currently and perhaps in other mods too).
Either someone find this interesting to by seeing this, but if not don't be afraid to try out modding yourself (scripting is advanced, but in this case you should have inspiration from earlier works that may help out).

Good luck


Sources:
Nazgul: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...n-1-2-Released
Heroes: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...ortal%20heroes

[Tar-Falassion]

I admit that I've always found weird that Saruman's death was so ... definitive in the Lord of the Rings, where in comparison Sauron survived the destruction of two bodies and each time rose back to supremacy. It would have made some sense imo that Saruman had managed to recreate a body to haunt Middle-Earth again during the Fourth Age.

But then again, the issue of Gandalf's death needed the intervention of Eru Iluvatar himself

[Nariac]

I admit that I've always found weird that Saruman's death was so ... definitive in the Lord of the Rings, where in comparison Sauron survived the destruction of two bodies and each time rose back to supremacy. It would have made some sense imo that Saruman had managed to recreate a body to haunt Middle-Earth again during the Fourth Age.

But then again, the issue of Gandalf's death needed the intervention of Eru Iluvatar himself

If I remember correctly when Saruman died in the Shire he did become a spirit, but when he looked back towards the West where he had come from with the other wizards, a wind simply dispersed his spirit into dust rather than ressurecting him.

Punishment for being a naughty Wizard I guess. Maybe he does linger on as Sauron did, but without any kind of One Ring to anchor his spirit, I doubt he would be able to do anything.

[alreadyded]

PCP has respawn scripts for Saruman, Gandalf, and the Balrog, as well as the Nazgul and Sauron. You could probably just copy and paste the Saruman script it into vanilla if you do not know how to edit scripts.

[MUA]

ok thanks Ngugl. i'll download baron but there is a problem with bug fixer's-links are not working. what's the difference between 3.1 and 3.2 tatw? i'm using 3.2.

true but in game, playing isengard, evil wins so bassically saruman shouldn't die of age especially if he is like gandalf. only in battle. in new tw should be script about him and evil factions. he shouldn't be resurected but should live to the end no? gandalf said that he lived thru second age? i was reading book two times but it was 10-15 years ago.

[Infidel144]

The engine does not allow singular characters to be immortal.

[MUA]

@alreadyded u got screen from some fourth age-i will try that pcp with fourth age and mos 1.6.2 because new [1.7] has mew map and recruitment is weird with retraining for whole the time. i don't have a problem with editing and changing script but i would have to know what file i would have to change and what line and to what exactly

[MUA]

alreadyded - is it in :Third_Age_3/data/unit_models/_units/heroes? i installed pcp and have it i think. is it that MESH file - "saruman_lod0"? will it work with old save file for tatw 3.2?

so how to change all characters to be immortal then [or just these named before]?

[no post editing option or i'm blind?]

[regnak999]

alreadyded - is it in :Third_Age_3/data/unit_models/_units/heroes? i installed pcp and have it i think. is it that MESH file - "saruman_lod0"? will it work with old save file for tatw 3.2?

so how to change all characters to be immortal then [or just these named before]?

[no post editing option or i'm blind?]

You need 25 posts before you can edit your posts.

[Aringtoit]

I wish they'd do this with DaC, because Saruman always seems to get whacked early, usually by AI controlled Ents. I want to kill Saruman! Never seem to get the chance as the Northern Dunedain though.

[Ric_TW]

To be closer to lore, the ideal should be something like:

The Maiar Sauron, Saruman, Gandalf and the Balrog (I'm not sure if there are some more) should not die of age, only in battle. All of them should be hard to kill in battle, especially Sauron. Sauron would be respawned every time the ring was taken again to Mordor, unless you destroyed the ring. The others would die in battle for good, perhaps only with the possibility of respawning Gandalf if you achieved some goal to be stipulated, to simulate the intervention of Iluvatar;

The Nazgûl should not die of age, only in battle. They should be hard to kill in battle, although not as hard as the Maiar. After dying, they would be respawned automatically. When you destroyed the ring, they would die instantly;

Elven heroes should not die of age, only in battle, without the possibility of respawning them;

Heroes from other species would die of age or in battle, without the possibility of respawning them.

I know all of this is very tricky, because the engine does not allow some things, so these are just some ideas. Perhaps with some more scripts, producers could trick somehow the engine. Is there someone with other suggestions, which would bring this even closer to the lore?

[Withwnar]

...should not die of age...

Simply not possible. The only way is to make them age so slowly (more turns per year) that they'll never reach old age before the campaign ends. But that will make all characters of all factions immortal* and also take ages for children to come of age.

* A workaround would be for script to kill those who should not be immortal, when they reach a certain age, but it would be a massive script (very probably adding a lot of lag) and because names are not unique there's no guarantee that the script would be killing the right person. e.g. You have two characters named "Bob" in your faction: the script might kill the 24 year old Bob instead of the 80 year old Bob.

[MUA]

thanks withwnar. does anyone know which file [and from which mod] should i copy to tatw 3.2 to make all characters [or just saruman] immortal?

[Titus le Chmakus]

And what if you set the age of the already created generals to 1 year old ?

[Withwnar]

does anyone know which file [and from which mod] should i copy to tatw 3.2 to make all characters [or just saruman] immortal?

campaign_script.txt - not the whole file, just the relevant part of it needs to go into your campaign_script.

alreadyded and Ngugi both gave suggestions of which mods. Or did you mean, "which of those mods"? alreadyded suggested PCP, which is his mod, so he's saying "here, have mine"; it would almost be rude not to.

And what if you set the age of the already created generals to 1 year old ?

Not sure what the hardcoded minimum age is but I think it's 16. And there needs to be a minimum number of years difference between fathers and sons, so having all characters start as young as possible (e.g. 16) will make it impossible to have family trees set up at game start.

[Titus le Chmakus]

Hum not sure, they've downed it to 14 in Europa Barbarorum II ... Maybe ask there ...

[MUA]

i found mos 1.6.1 with that script but map is new [on youtube is almost original 3.2 with dunland added near saruman] i'll try earlier mos with original map and install pcp later on and find that script. thanks Withwnar. does anyone know how to change or delete new extended map from earlier mos or new [1.7] to have vanilla or almost same from 3.2?

[King Brian]

speaking of Saruman's death, I wouldn't mind a cut-scene every time you kill him where you see him fall off the tower and impale himself(even if it isn't according to lore)