Thread: Europa Barbarorum 2.08e is released!

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  1. #1

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by 4th Regiment View Post
    Solution for lack of culture spots, as as suggested long ago - Indian faction should go out.

    Natural border of the map are mountains of Afghanistan and harsh desert of Baluchistan - projection of force was and still is very difficult over those natural borders...and now we have map in plains of India already...I mean, why stop there now...should add whole India than...No current faction had real possibility to project power over India..

    And possible attack from powerful Indian king, (same can work in some other edges of the map, or bordering with big rebel territory) can be mimic by script...of rebel Indian stack with demands - give tribute, or province...or army will pop up there in next turn.
    Let's be absolutely clear about something: we are not going to remove any existing factions. I can state that categorically and emphatically, not going to happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by 4th Regiment View Post
    With that culture spot out, and possible "imperial" out too, we can gave two more culture spots...Let's say Traco-Illiran as one ...

    Speaking about that, borders of Ilyrian provinces are hilarious, to say it middy. If somebody knew anything about basic geography only, Adriatic coast due to very rough Dinaric Alps mountains was very isolated until recently from Panonian plains... I mean Segestica as capital of everything from northern Dalmatia, to what is now south west Hungary..or another one from south Dalmatia and Montenegro to north of modern Osiek...I mean, even noways, drive from Belgrade to the south Dalmatian coast or Montenegro is very rough ride...While Dinaric mountain and coast was Illyrian, southern parts of Panonian plain were mostly Celtic, or at least strong Celtic influence..Also, visible in entology and faces of the people even now days...

    So those borders MUST be changed ..with one or two provinces with north and south Dinnaric rim, and one which can be Segestica, representing south western rims of Panonian plain...In same time we have like 8, provinces for England and Wails..
    We don't need to remove a faction to change the culture mix, as someone suggested further down, there's a possibility there by re-assigning the existing ones. Not sure what that new one might be, yet.

    We're already planning to change the borders and provinces in Illyria. It is a non-trivial change, though, given the number of files it impacts. It has a high margin of error, too, so it isn't a change taken upon lightly. Indeed, in an ideal world, you don't change the provinces once you've begun to build a mod. We're not in that idea world, though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaj View Post
    The problem with culture is simple. The game only allows to have 8.

    Those 8 were chosen to be:

    -Western mediterranean polities
    -Hellenic polities
    -Forest tribalism
    -European tribal states
    -Eastern tribal states
    -Eastern imperial
    -Indian tribal states
    -Steppe noamdism
    -Arid nomadism

    So to not have European tribal states so spread you would need to be repalced with some other, but which?
    The cultures are so generic for a reason.

    If there was more slots I guess that all would be split up except hellenic, nomadism and maybe indians.

    I agree somehow that if something was to changeremoving indian seems the most logical as they are the one least important. Only been used by one faction and been present in the very edge of the map.

    Eastern imeprial I wont say so. While its presence at start its very small its an important part of several factions reform, repressenting the settled version of a eastern civilization going over the classical tribe administration.
    I think the most viable option is to re-assign the slot used by Indian Tribal States (replacing with Forest Tribalism in India, perhaps, as suggested below), then use that slot to introduce another culture to be inserted in opposition to ETS, to mix things up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barnabas View Post
    I don't mean offend anyone but I really see little point in having an indian faction..
    It's not a matter of taste for me but a matter of resources, by which I don't mean lack of history but rather manpower working behind the mod of EBII, 8 limited culture slots, how hard it is to create, skin, model units and how much time it takes..
    Why add an indian faction with it's obligatory provinces, culture slot, time consuming modeling time when the mod is extremely short on manpower. Many people are complaining with historical facts (which seems plausable although I cannot check) against lack of settlements in iranian peninsula, there is a confirmed (I think) talk of combining provinces in Britain to add more settlements to more logical(?) places and there is a culture representation/empire overstability problem related to game engine people are trying to overcome.
    Remove indian faction and get one culture slot to balance things out as you see fit, get an extra faction slot added to other free two slots and maybe have more than one or two rebel AI factions for improved gameplay, get some extra settlements that you can distribute, get rid of a script or more in the future which will take it's toll on the game engine to represent the indian factions independence from a gamewise nonexistent empire..

    I will play and support the mod nonetheless no matter what the team decides..
    As above, we're not removing Taksashila, so best to drop this particular line of conversation. There may be a way to recover the slot without meaningfully impacting the faction.

    Besides there are a number of units coming Taksashila's way, including some tribal levies that will round out the base of their roster, and regionals too.

    As mentioned, changing the map is also not something we're willing to countenance except out of extreme necessity.

    Quote Originally Posted by parthian8 View Post
    It does seem odd to argue BOTH that a veneer of Greek culture at the top of society in Massalia is a poor reason to change the cultural settings their but that a thin veneer of Celtic overlordship in Thracia and possibly even Germany makes them...well...Celtic.
    They're two completely different models of conquest, and different places. In Massalia, the city itself was Greek, most of the inhabitants were Greek. Meanwhile, the surrounding countryside was predominantly Celtic/Celto-Ligurian/Ligurian. In Tylis, the majority of the elites in all the significant places were Celtic, while the ordinary people were Thracian. They're scattered all over the place, not concentrated in just one place. In Massalia, they are separate and distinct. In Tylis, they're integrated after a fashion.

    Quote Originally Posted by parthian8 View Post
    AS H/M 20 turns.

    Economics. I felt I had to get rid of my elephants (blub) and fleets immediately to balance the books and made much use of the free upkeep in minor settlements to shave off more expense.
    Nor did I think I would be able to hold all of the settlements that began on red, and so carried out a scorched earth policy to boost my treasury in Tarsos, Asaak, Antiocheia-Margaine and Harmozeia, using the withdrawing troops to bolster nearby cities. This got some of them into the blue.
    It has been difficult thus far to built my economy as the emphasis has been absolutely on using temples and games' fields to stave off more lost cities. At this stage a successful saboteur can set you back years, so investing in spies early instead of troops is a sensible precaution.

    I am feeling my way around the government buildings and haven't changed anything. They give a more than satisfactory range of factional and native troops for myself, who isn't too fussed about battlefield eye candy and pockets-full of elites.
    It allows you to assemble balanced garrisons with sufficient punch to venture out if you need to. The high state of unrest and the shortage of money means offensive armies led by FMs will have to wait for another decade or maybe two.
    I have my eye on Ephesus, but it may as well be on the moon for now. Around me, The Ptolemies are just starting to gather round Tarsos. I do think the AI factions undergo a step change of aggression after about 20 turns. All over the map they have switched on and started really going for nearby rebel settlements. Diplomacy has not been too fraught, with minor sweeteners thrown in by me to oil the wheels.
    I have been besieged by rebels a couple of times, though I have made a lot of use of watchtowers, meaning I have seen them coming. The rebel armies lurking along the trade lanes have been quiet small.

    BAI. I too have seen more evidence of units charging front line only in this game. AI rebel armies (all I have faced) have been small but not ill-formed. They skirmish and flank particularly well. They always seem to have twice as much ammunition as me and keep pelting away long after my guys are out.
    I have twice seen Eastern slingers take a rear charge from 38 bodyguard cavalry with few sent flying, after which they turn round and start swishing away with their penknives until I am forced to withdraw.
    The only other oddity has been the sight of three different rebel generals charging their Hippeis straight into phalangists from the front at the start of battles.

    It will be interesting, now the AI factions are ramping up, to see how the next 20 turns go and how much the violence accelerates.
    While the elephants are certainly (intentionally!) extortionate to keep hold of, the fleets shouldn't be doing too much damage to your treasury. Upkeep is only 1/10th recruitment.

    Sounds like you're having fun with changing things up, though, and the regional recruitment pools are working well. Have you deal with the four "bandit" stacks roaming around your territory yet?

    AI units have the same amount of ammunition as the human player.

    On cavalry, if you're expecting a single charge to drive off even skirmishers, you're mistaken, I'm afraid. Repeated charges are necessary, even with heavy cavalry. You should be charging, withdrawing, re-ordering and charging again. Not only that, the impact itself has a significant hit on enemy morale, making it more likely you'll break them than simply leaving your cavalry in melee. The balance is very deliberately in favour of the charge, not staying in contact.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaj View Post
    More things I have noted playing with Bosphorans.

    First, I had some problems with cavalry when fighting a battle in a camp. The enemy outnumbered me but it was mostly infantry (strange for a camp of nomads but well) so I used a lot my cavalry to charge and itnercept the units trying to flank my infantry.
    Most times it worked fine but a few my cavalry went like crazy. One time they were running towards the enemy perfectly and suddenly when quite close to them they swiftly tuned to the right. THey went away from the objective turned back in a circle and got to it just walking.
    Two or three times happened that when ordered to atack a unit instead of heading directly towards it they directly took a weir circular path, and no charge was triggered when this happened.
    Also when the battle advanced I ordered a few units on my line centre to advance and they just spreaded, some left others right, breaking the line and going running like crazy.

    I guess theres some issue with pathfinding in camp maps.

    The other issue is mroe design wise. I dont see the point of Subject Clan goverment in camps. Allied clan costs the same, its faster to establish, gives better recruitment, better public order, more trade income and it converts culture.
    So, whats the advantage of Subject clan? Because I cant see any.
    Camp battles are sieges, siege pathfinding is bugged. Camp battles have invisible walls as mentioned by MisterFred downthread.

    Subject Clan governments have a much longer conversion bonus - it goes to 50% where Allied Clan only goes to 20%. Thus it's a necessary step to upgrade to any of the more Hellenic government buildings.

    Quote Originally Posted by 4th Regiment View Post
    My suggestion is to use two spots, for 2 "Rebel factions". One can represent strong Greek cities which were somewhat friendly and related to each-other anyway (let say Syrakuse, one province of Epirus (should not have two at all), Massalia and Synope..and maybe one, or two more. They would be separated enough from each other in order to prevent some kind of empire AI tendency). Another one could be European barbarian with strategically placed few provinces over the map, where we need bit more buffer.

    And I think we will have much more balanced and more historically accurate game .
    As above, we're not removing Taksashila, it's not even up for debate.

    One "Rebel faction" was a stretch, two is not an option. We've just had a discussion about the two remaining slots, they're very likely to be new playable factions. Which means a dedicated Rebel faction separate from the Eleutheroi is now unlikely.

    Quote Originally Posted by MisterFred View Post
    Yeah, the camps thing is pretty unavoidable. There's basically invisible walls with holes in them in the corners. If the AI is besieging you, they'll actually use their ram. Eventually you get a feel for where the pathfinding issues are. Just pretend they put up spiked pits or stuck spears in the ground in anticipation of your attack.

    I've often thought that opening up a culture slot by making Indians Forest Tribal (given how unlikely it'll be to have Germans migrate to India, I don't anticipate a problem there). How to use the extra slot, well that's a problem. Add an Illyrian-Thracian-Getae slot? An Iberian slot? Punic? Italian tribal? I'd probably pick Iberian. But it's not a huge deal, in my opinion. There's only so much you can do with the engine. Like the Massilia kerfluffle, no one is really disagreeing all that much on the history, just on how the game represents a settlement vs a region.

    What I'd like to know is how to build farms in a camp/small town! I took Asanka as the Boii noting it was 45% Euro tribal, destroyed the elite herds there and... shoot, no farms. Oh well. (Actually, the problem here is probably that only allied government is possible, no factional.)
    I think re-tasking Indian Tribal, and re-classifying them as Forest Tribal is a good idea. I'll raise it with the team.

    Not sure what to re-use the slot as, but it needs to be applicable to a bigger area than Spain alone, I'd say.

    Quote Originally Posted by jordiebenardus View Post
    Hello guys, it's been awhile since I tried any patches and just started using 2.04a and I noticed something wrong.

    I started a Koinon Helenon campaign, I move Areus back to mainland and gathered my forces to besiege the city of Korinthos. I built siege weapons and wait for a turn. In the turn-change period a Makedon army closes in mine and suddenly the siege was lifted immediately. This happened 3 times before and after I reinstall everything. I tried besieging the city again and the makedonians tried to attack me to relieve the siege, I lost Chremonides in the battle receiving only 1 report. After the battle however all my family members except Areus (The other 2 FM in mainland and Chremonides) died. I tried besieging the city again since after the battle the siege is relieved. Then the enemy forces from Knossos sallied out in a battle and I got to fight a battle of Knossos of which I do not besiege.

    Anyone knows what is going on? are there any solution?
    I have absolutely no idea what to make of that. Do you have an error log?

    Quote Originally Posted by delra View Post
    Can't we allow recruitment of at least a skeleton skirmisher armies from Roman Province governments? At the moment if you want to build anything high level, you must convert the whole of Greece and Carthage from Free City to Provincia Romana. And that stops all recruitment, forever. That province's recruitment pool will just remain empty.

    At least in EB1 we had those white-robed police-like guys we could recruit from these. :-(
    No, I'm afraid not. Government buildings without recruitment are that way on purpose - either because they're temporary/transitional, or because you get troops another way, or they are to force a tactical choice between recruitment and development. In the specific instance of the provinc, the way you get troops is through the military colony building.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post

    I have absolutely no idea what to make of that. Do you have an error log?
    I'm not relly sure but I've repeat the installation twice today and it still shows the same error, no crashes but I always break a siege when an enemy army engages or next to my besieging army I haven't tried with any other faction but it persists in my Koinon Helenon campaign.

    http://www.megafileupload.com/97iO/M2TW.system.log.txt

    I uploaded my system log there

    I'm thinking it's probably related with the "force siege on Knossos" script, approximately 4 turns after the start of my campaign the Knosso Garrison sallies out and I met them in a battle with any army led by Hegemon Areus that much is consistent in the errors.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    No, I'm afraid not. Government buildings without recruitment are that way on purpose - either because they're temporary/transitional, or because you get troops another way, or they are to force a tactical choice between recruitment and development. In the specific instance of the provinc, the way you get troops is through the military colony building.
    But you can't build military colonies outside of Italy. Or will this change at some point in the future?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by jordiebenardus View Post
    I'm not relly sure but I've repeat the installation twice today and it still shows the same error, no crashes but I always break a siege when an enemy army engages or next to my besieging army I haven't tried with any other faction but it persists in my Koinon Helenon campaign.

    http://www.megafileupload.com/97iO/M2TW.system.log.txt

    I uploaded my system log there

    I'm thinking it's probably related with the "force siege on Knossos" script, approximately 4 turns after the start of my campaign the Knosso Garrison sallies out and I met them in a battle with any army led by Hegemon Areus that much is consistent in the errors.
    You're correct, it was something missed in the second part of the forced siege script which didn't exclude KH when it's the player. Updated for 2.04b.

    Quote Originally Posted by Poppis View Post
    But you can't build military colonies outside of Italy. Or will this change at some point in the future?
    Correct, not with the current military colonies. The post-Marian colonies will be. For the time being, it's an infrastructure/recruitment choice, which is intentional. The Camillian and Polybian rosters are comprised of Italians, you have to ship them there if you want to garrison them. You have the civlib to get your initial garrison, or you use an Allied Government.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    I meant to add that I do not believe the AS bodyguard cavalry are underpowered. I have seen them do some real damage on impact. My query is about the ease with which an already greatly depleted unit of Eastern slingers shrugged them off. It was like watching a truck bounce off a pram. It seemed counter-intuitive to the eye.
    The rebel bodyguard Hippeis I mentioned earlier actually inflicted similar impact casualties in a frontal charge on Makedonian phalangists.

  6. #6
    Biarchus
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    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Playing Pritanoi for the first time in 2.04a. I just had a FM come of age and he's 16. But this is the Teutonic system with no Family Tree, how is this possible? It doesn't make much sense to me...

  7. #7

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hummer View Post
    Playing Pritanoi for the first time in 2.04a. I just had a FM come of age and he's 16. But this is the Teutonic system with no Family Tree, how is this possible? It doesn't make much sense to me...
    All factions have scripted starting families, even factions using the Teutonic system. If memory serves, Teutonic systems will crash without a basic famiy tree defined at game start. Don't quote me on that, though.

    Once all FMs in the starting family tree grow up, you will not get any more FMs coming of age for the rest of the game, only adoptions.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    I believe Forrest Tribal in India represents the Forrest tribes that the urban Raja did not have control over. Some of them were not part of the caste system and spoke a foreign language, I believe it could be replaced with Eastern Imperial instead to represent the Urban rule.

    Here is an example of the province make up

    ----Total Political control-----

    Player -Mauryan style Raja in the Urban Societies and towns and villages
    Indian Tribal states - Replaced with Eastern Imperial

    ----Limited Political control-----

    Nomadic and sedentary tribes with their own Rajas that subscribed to the caste system and understood the Rig Veda and the Epics.
    Forrest Tribal
    Eastern Tribal
    (Tribal Government Can help here)

    ----No control-----

    Forrest Tribes that are outside the caste system and spoke a foreign language
    Forrest Tribal
    (Tribal Government Can help here)

    Romila Thapar's Early India has detailed information about these type of societies.

    The spare can maybe be used for 'Le tene style' celts Boii, Aruernoi, Aedui while the rest of the tribes can get ETS?
    Last edited by Mantaprey; August 07, 2015 at 04:23 AM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quintus,

    I have run across the stacks with my patrols. I am very keen that my Seleucid Empire should be ordered and have a strong civil service. In areas with vast tractless wastes, travel between cities should be fraught with risk and keeping the arteries of empire open is an enjoyable and rewarding task for any leader.

    With regard to the cavalry charge. In my unusual career I was once lucky enough to be invited to stand in the path of a charge by heavy horse. There were only around ten riders, but I can tell you that the ground shook even at some distance. Had they impacted with us, the sheer weight of horse flesh would have flattened us, as the historian in charge gleefully explained.

    I do understand that impact is key in a cavalry charge, and the even heavy lancer type troops are better used in multiple charges. However, what I am describing is a perfectly executed charge to the rear of unarmoured light troops armed only with a thong of leather or twine. I used the cavalry to their optimum purpose against the optimum troop type. It bounced off. This would not happen in life.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by parthian8 View Post
    However, what I am describing is a perfectly executed charge to the rear of unarmoured light troops armed only with a thong of leather or twine. I used the cavalry to their optimum purpose against the optimum troop type. It bounced off. This would not happen in life.
    On the plus side, this can be easily remedied with a submod — if it becomes necessary — by increasing the overall mass of cavalry. For example, notice the cavalry charge in this video I made, also in M2TW engine but with a different mod, from 3:02 to 3:09. The enemy cavalry tramples over an entire unit of arquebusiers head-on instantaneously.

    However, this presents a delicate gameplay balancing situation for EBII. Keep in mind that most cavalry units in EBII include upwards of 100 horsemen, while the largest infantry unit is only around 250 men due to engine limitations. If cavalry charges were suddenly made even more powerful than they are now, a single unit of cavalry could easily take down an entire AI army of 1500+ infantry in short order by simply charging each infantry unit in succession. If charges were to become more powerful, the size of cavalry units would have to be decreased proportionally.

    In fact, even in the present stage, I often think cavalry are slightly "overpowered" simply because of their disproportionately large unit sizes (a unit of 100 horsemen, even horse archers, can win against nearly any unit of 250 infantry if using charges properly). In many other M2TW mods, heavy cavalry in particular are limited to around 50 or 60 horses per unit due to the aforementioned infantry size cap.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    There's a bug with the M2TW engine (and also the RTW engine, I think). Basically, charges stop when the charging unit considers itself to have impacted the unit. Against units that are skirmishing or running away from charging cavalry, the charge basically touches the back of the unit, killing a few men, then terminates the charge. This means that the best defense against a charge is actually running away from it. A rather bizarre and annoying quirk of the engine.

    I'm not sure if it can be fixed through modding alone, since most of this behaviour seems to be hardcoded. You'll have to ask z3n about that. In the meantime, however, I recommend pinning the skirmishers with your medium/heavy cavalry, then flanking them with some light cavalry. Skirmishers mostly have poor morale, so this is generally enough to break them. It's not ideal, but it's the best we can squeeze out of the engine for now.

  12. #12
    z3n's Avatar State of Mind
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    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylon View Post
    There's a bug with the M2TW engine (and also the RTW engine, I think). Basically, charges stop when the charging unit considers itself to have impacted the unit. Against units that are skirmishing or running away from charging cavalry, the charge basically touches the back of the unit, killing a few men, then terminates the charge. This means that the best defense against a charge is actually running away from it. A rather bizarre and annoying quirk of the engine.

    I'm not sure if it can be fixed through modding alone, since most of this behaviour seems to be hardcoded. You'll have to ask z3n about that. In the meantime, however, I recommend pinning the skirmishers with your medium/heavy cavalry, then flanking them with some light cavalry. Skirmishers mostly have poor morale, so this is generally enough to break them. It's not ideal, but it's the best we can squeeze out of the engine for now.
    Right, it cannot be fixed at present. CA put a work-around which is the 'pursuing' state that they often enter shortly after a failed charge and while effective is rather less effective than an actual charge.
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  13. #13

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Sylon,

    Thank you for your explanation. That corresponds with what my eye is telling me. The animation for the slingers on impact is redolent of them having been slightly roughly jostled from behind on a rail platform rather than being hit by a lot of charging horses. Could that also explain why some infantry charges become a matter of wary shuffling forward once a handful of individual soldiers have become engaged?

  14. #14

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    If you're referring to the bug where the front line of a unit charges forward while the rest stay behind, I think that's mostly not related. This bug mostly occurs when the charging unit either a) lacks sufficient distance to charge properly or b) has another unit between itself and its target. This is why 1v1 infantry charges tend to be clean, with both lines impacting each other properly; but when you're in a large battle with many units or attacking an enemy's flank, units start overlapping which causes this to happen more frequently.

    EDIT: To get around this bug, try to manuever your flanking infantry in compact blocks, more squarish than rectangular, which lessens the chances of stragglers in the unit or the attack pathfinding messing up. Hope this helps.
    Last edited by Sylon; August 07, 2015 at 05:32 AM.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Sylon,

    I which case I don't see this as anything that requires fixing. I really don't mind battles being a bit messy and not going exactly to plan. I rather like it when young men appear to think twice about impaling themselves on spearpoints at my behest. I always play my battles in real time and do not pause to micro-manage for this reason. And people do get detached from their units. Cohesion does break down in battles and city assaults because people become disorientated and get lost. It wouldn't want a certain level of chaos ironed smooth.

  16. #16
    delra's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    This is why 1v1 infantry charges tend to be clean
    One custom battle 1 vs 1 infantry unit is enough to prove that stament wrong.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by delra View Post
    One custom battle 1 vs 1 infantry unit is enough to prove that stament wrong.
    Furthermore, 1v1 custom battles aren't really a useful signifier of anything at all in the engine. A single unit might stay still in response to another single unit, or it may move towards. It won't tell you anything.

    You need an actual army vs another actual army to perform meaningful tests of the battlespace. That doesn't even have to be half a stack, but it does need to be at least 5 units on each side.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by delra View Post
    One custom battle 1 vs 1 infantry unit is enough to prove that stament wrong.
    Oh, I see now! Units with only a single weapon perform charges properly (Hoplitai, Pantodapoi, etc) while units with two weapons pause before charging. The Medieval II engine has a 'quirk' where units have to pause to switch weapons and tend to not properly charge because of that. In the case of infantry with javelin precursors, this results in soldiers switching from their empty javelin slot to their swords/spears before charging, causing the charge to be fragmented. You can also see this behavior on missle cavalry units.

    Thanks for correcting me.

    EDIT: Er, not meant to come off as sarcastic. I apologise if it seems like that. I'm genuinely grateful for the clarification.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylon View Post
    Oh, I see now! Units with only a single weapon perform charges properly (Hoplitai, Pantodapoi, etc) while units with two weapons pause before charging. The Medieval II engine has a 'quirk' where units have to pause to switch weapons and tend to not properly charge because of that. In the case of infantry with javelin precursors, this results in soldiers switching from their empty javelin slot to their swords/spears before charging, causing the charge to be fragmented. You can also see this behavior on missle cavalry units.

    Thanks for correcting me.

    EDIT: Er, not meant to come off as sarcastic. I apologise if it seems like that. I'm genuinely grateful for the clarification.
    Ah I was surprised because I saw that hopliite charges worked perfectly fine in 1vs1. that explains it. However during campaign I have seen logades charging pretty nciely soemtimes after launching their javelin so it may depend on situation.

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius
    Subject Clan governments have a much longer conversion bonus - it goes to 50% where Allied Clan only goes to 20%. Thus it's a necessary step to upgrade to any of the more Hellenic government buildings.
    Thanks a lot for the info. That makes sense now. I thought it had to be soemthing like that related to progression as you can still build it after you built allied clan. At the start I thought it was building wise but I tested and it didnt changed anything so I felt a bit frustated.

    For situations like this is why I insist (sorry I dont wanna be irritating but it feels important) that the caps for conversion should be specified in the building characteristcs. Because the average player wouldnt know this and womt be able to make decisions properly.
    Its true that the description says something of this kind odf direct control helping the conversion more but isnt clear stated at all and all you see is that in the characteristics the difference isnt reflected.

    Thanks again and keep up the good work.

    PS: ¿Theres something specifically that you would like to be tested?

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  20. #20

    Default Re: Europa Barbarorum 2.04a is released!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sylon View Post
    Oh, I see now! Units with only a single weapon perform charges properly (Hoplitai, Pantodapoi, etc) while units with two weapons pause before charging. The Medieval II engine has a 'quirk' where units have to pause to switch weapons and tend to not properly charge because of that. In the case of infantry with javelin precursors, this results in soldiers switching from their empty javelin slot to their swords/spears before charging, causing the charge to be fragmented. You can also see this behavior on missle cavalry units.
    FYI, you can get around this (and execute a perfect cavalry charge) with these units by holding down ALT and double right-clicking on the intended enemy target. Your unit will move in a run (or gallop in the case of cavalry) toward the enemy wielding their melee weapon and will initiate a full charge shortly before impact. Hopefully this addresses your issue...

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