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Thread: Warhammer cartography and maps

  1. #1

    Default Warhammer cartography and maps

    Some threads have popped up detailing Warhammer lore for the Total War fans interested about the new game. But a Total War game has always been about maps and lands right? So I felt a thread detailing the cartography of the Warhammer world would interest some people in this forum new to the universe!

    First of all, I invite all of you to go check this insanely detailed map about the Warhammer Old World:

    http://www.gitzmansgallery.com/shdmotwow-full.html

    For your information, the "Old World" would correspond to Europe during the Middle Ages in the real world. It is where most of the factions of the Warhammer Universe live, and it is where we will be playing in Warhammer Total War if I'm not mistaken (at least for the first game).

    But the Old World is only part of a bigger world, of which we still don't know a lot of things:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    In this map, the Old World is in the top right corner. As you can see, the world of Warhammer strangely resembles the Earth, with cotinents that clearly look like Africa, the Americas and Europe.

    The continent corresponding to Africa isn't named in the lore, although its northern half is called Araby, while its mysterious southern jungles are called "The Southlands".
    The continent corresponding to South and Central America is called Lustria.
    The Continent corresponding to North America is called Naggaroth
    And finally the small circle-shaped continent in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean (called the Great Ocean or World Pond in the lore) is called Ulthuan.


    But while we know some details of Ulthuan, Naggaroth and the other continents described above, we know next to nothing of the lands east of the Old World:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Cathay, Nippon, Khuresh and Ind are very mysterious places in the Warhammer lore. Games Workshop has never released any miniature for these lands nor published a book about them. Their very geography is still a matter of debate among fans, as several contradictory maps of the Eastern Lands have surfaced over the years. Since games workshop has never really developed this part of the Warhammer Lore, it is highly unlikely we would see them in a Total War Game.


    Now you might be thinking, what is the map for Warhammer Total War going to look like. Well, it's been confirmed that the playable races in the game will be the Empire, the Dwarfs, the Vampire Counts and the Orc and Goblins.

    From this bit of information, I suppose we will be playing in the lands of the Empire and its immediate surroundings:
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    The maps above feature the Empire in more detail. In these lands, the Vampire Counts are mainly found in the Province of Sylvannia (look at the Empire's Eastern border). The Dwarfs would be mainly located in the World's Edge Mountains (the huge mountain range in the East) and the Grey Mountains (the mountain range to the South). While greenskin tribes (orcs and goblins) are found pretty much everywhere uncivilized (cursed forests, mountains, evil lairs, ruined fortresses, caves, etc), a bit like rebels in previous TW games.

    Now that we've seen the lands we will most likely be playing in the upcoming game, how about the lands we might play in future expansions and titles?

    Starting up with Bretonnia, the largest human nation in the Old World after the Empire:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    As you can see, Bretonnia is located right next to the Empire. This leads me to believe that we might see part of it in the upcoming game. But since it isn't part of the playable factions so far, it will probably be introduced in a future expansion (or we will have to buy a DLC to play it in the first game )


    If you want a more detailed map of Bretonnia, check this link (watch out, huge image): http://windsofchaos.com/wp-content/u.../Bretonnia.jpg

    The lands South of Bretonnia (Estalia and Tilea) are also human nations, but have rarely been mentioned in the lore published by Games Workshop. It is unlikely they will make an appearance in the TW games. For those curious about them, they are basically warhammer versions of Renaissance-era Italy and Spain.
    Last edited by Aikanár; May 10, 2015 at 02:54 PM. Reason: consecutive postings; please use the "edit post" button.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Warhammer cartography and maps

    I believe all that is one month away from becoming obsolete

    I've heard that the world gets shattered by the End Times events and that there is no map anymore, but some sort of "reality bubbles" that clash with each other from time to time (and that's when battles happen). Don't know how much of that is true though.


    That said, the detailed map is pretty cool, but I believe it's based in fan-made content (for instance I'm told that the vast majority of the names you see in Estalia are never mentioned in the official fluff). There are many of them with which I don't particularly agree, since they are names of real, iconic places that some people might connect with completelly unrelated stuff and could be immersion breaking. I've already discussed in other threads the inclussion of names such as Sitges (famous for their film festival), Ubrique (only known as the hometown of a tacky torero singer of the 90s) or even Nerja, but just to make it easier and faster here, I'll point out that some of the town names in Estalia such as San Pedro or San Luis (literally Saint Peter and Saint Louis) are clearly related to christianity and I don't think they fit Warhammer at all.


    By the way, one of your maps says:
    The Empire of man under empress Magritta, the one true heir of Sigmar
    I was wondering, what's the relationship between that empress and the city in Estalia with the same name? Why would Estalians name their city after an imperial empress?
    Last edited by HigoChumbo; May 08, 2015 at 05:43 AM.

  3. #3

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    Another land that might make an appearance in the upcoming game is Kislev:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



    Kislev is situated on the Northern border of the Empire, and is a frequent invasion route to the Empire, which leads me to believe it might make an appearance in the coming game (as expansion or dlc maybe?). You've probably guessed it, it's basically a warhammer version of medieval Russia.


    By the way, for those of you more interested in the lore of the game, I highly recommend that you check out the thread started by Rogal Dorn here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...s-inteoduction

    Quote Originally Posted by HigoChumbo View Post
    I was wondering, what's the relationship between that empress and the city in Estalia with the same name? Why would Estalians name their city after an imperial empress?
    It is unknown if there is any (probably none IMO). The city of Margritta in Estalia was founded long before Empress Margritta was ever born. It's probably just a coincidence that the Empress hapened to share the same name as this Tilean town.

    And you're right that some details about Tilea and Estalia were probably written by fans. I should have mentioned it before. The problem is that these lands were never really described in detail by Games Workshop, which led some fans to add some details about their geography (like towns, fortresses, etc).

    However, the general outline of the nations themselves, the mountain ranges, the coasts, etc are all canon.
    Last edited by Aikanár; May 10, 2015 at 02:53 PM. Reason: consecutive postings; please use the "edit post" button.

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    HigoChumbo's Avatar Definitely not Jom.
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    Default Re: Warhammer cartography and maps

    Quote Originally Posted by frenchyvinnie View Post
    However, the general outline of the nations themselves, the mountain ranges, the coasts, etc are all canon.
    Yupp, nothing against that. I think that the part of the Old World that corresponds to Europe (Estalia, Tilea, Bretonnia, the Empire, Norsca, Kislev, etc. even Albion) is somewhat well done and different enough from its real world counterpart to be immersive. It has an interesting shape with a geography that supports the feeling of each faction, mostly because they are directly related to the nations that inhabited the equivalent lands in real life, but without being too evident.

    The entirety of the rest of the Warhammer map looks, in my humble opinion, like a lazy, cheap afterthought.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Warhammer cartography and maps

    Quote Originally Posted by HigoChumbo View Post
    The entirety of the rest of the Warhammer map looks, in my humble opinion, like a lazy, cheap afterthought.
    Completely agree.

    Now let's talk about another land with a huge importance in Warhammer lore: Ulthuan, home of the High Elves.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    For your information, the High Elves Kingdom is itself divided in several semi-independent nations, which are listed on the map.


    The High Elves are a massively popular faction in the world of warhammer. their history is highly detailed, and many campaigns and battles have been fought in Ulthuan. Therefore, this land is highly suitable for a future TW game or expansion. However, since Ulthuan is located quite far away to the West of the Empire, in the middle of the Ocean, it will probably not be included in the first game.

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    Default Re: Warhammer cartography and maps

    As you indicated in your first post, it's most likely that the first game covers only the empire and its borders and it'd make sense that the second one is centered around Bretonnia (with the Wood Elves and some extra factions, like the Skaven), that would leave the High and Dark Elves as strong (if not the strongest) contenders to be the main dish of the final game in the trilogy.

    Now it's pretty clear that Ulthuan presents plenty of inconvenients from a game-design perspective (yet another of the countless consequences of the cheap, uninspired general design of the Warhammer map), so I don't know how they might portray that. I wouldn't be surprised if they modified the proportions and locations of the map. It wouldn't be the first time they do that, check Medieval 2's map, for instance:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Last edited by HigoChumbo; May 08, 2015 at 08:04 AM.

  7. #7

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    Yeah, they could go with the M2TW map idea. Or they could also re-use the ETW map, with multiple theaters that you could travel to with ships.

    Anyway, let's continue with Lustria, which roughly corresponds to South and Central America in the real world. Lustria is populated by the Lizardmen, a confederation of different half-human/half-reptilian species with a culture reminiscent of the real-life aztec tribes (stepped pyramids, sacrifices to the gods, etc).
    Lustria is covered in lush jungles and is also home to a variety of nasty, hungry dinosaurs (which the lizardmen ride into battle because why the not ).

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    In the timeline of the Warhammer world, Lustria has only been discovered relatively recently by explorers from the Old World. It has since come under invasion by greedy explorers and looters of all kinds (think of the New World campaign in M2TW kingdoms).
    Some geographic details in Lustria are still a matter of debate and the exact location (or name) of some cities has changed over the years, but the overall shape of the continent is canon.

    And finally, the last great continent that might make an appearance in a TW game: Naggaroth, home of the Dark Elves.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Keep in mind that most of Naggaroth is uninhabited. The Dark Elves' kingdom is located around the Sea of Malice (the inner sea in the middle of the continent). All the other lands south and west of their kingdom are deserted.
    The Dark Elves' only neighbors are the High Elves of Ulthuan directly to the east and some human tribes of Chaos in the North. As a result, Naggaroth by itself would not make a very interesting location for a game. It would be nice to see a combined Naggaroth/Ulthuan map though, with the Dark Elves and High Elves fighting as usual.
    Last edited by Aikanár; May 10, 2015 at 02:54 PM. Reason: consecutive postings; please use the "edit post" button.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Warhammer cartography and maps

    Actually, in Naggaroth, there are Beastmen, Orcs and Goblins. Also High Elves have (or had) colony. It can be interesting. Warriors of Chaos attacking from north. Lizardmen trying to retrieve stolen artefacts by Dark Elves. Skaven could invade, while they would be doing their mission - conquering all world. High Elves finally trying to eliminate for good their dark kin. I believe it's all about scripting proper events.

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