Fans suggestion thread for future releases

[Rad]

Thureopherontes Hippeis - could you give those guys proper spears and tweak their helmets a bit? They deserve it
The mailed Thorakitai, Thorakitai Epilektoi and other units that use the same torso model - could the belt be changed? It looks very rough and simple compared to the unit.

[alex33]

Thorakitai Epilektoi

Thorakitai Epilektoi are still using a placeholder model so this appereance is not final.

[Roma_Victrix]

Thorakitai Epilektoi are still using a placeholder model so this appereance is not final.

I'm definitely going to pee or poo my pants when I finally see the finished model for Thorakitai Epilektoi. Might need an adult diaper from that point forward. It gonna be good.

[Rad]

Thorakitai Epilektoi are still using a placeholder model so this appereance is not final.

The belt remains.
I know that the Epilektoi aren't final, but the stuff I point out has a bad habbit of festering into other units

[LusitanianWolf]

I do have an suggestion to make the late game more interesting for the "barbarian" factions, inspired by the Lugian "Celtic Overlord" concept:
A new government called Gallic/Lusitanian/Celtiberian/Germanic Overlord that could be used on provinces outside of the traditional sphere of influence of these factions and would allow some conversion, slow recruitment of factional elites and professionals/mercs (starting with very slow refresh and increasing a but after the culture assimilation), some locals with the drawback of causing hight unrest.
This could be used to.simulate the establishment of a small ruling elite over an hostile native population and would allow barbarian factions to recruit some of their iconic units away from their homeland.

[COMIS -3- ΠΑΝΙΩΝΑΡΑ]

I don't know of it is possible but can you make basilike patris available in the three Hellenic capitals to be built without script?Alexandreia, Seleukeia and Pella?

[Tactics Mayers]

Is the Indian Unit roster really complete?

I don't expect the Indians to match the heavy infantry and cavalry of Greeks but current roster doesn't exactly match the advances the Indian military made in terms of armor and weapons duting Asoka's reign. The only native elite unit they have are chariots

[QuintusSertorius]

Is the Indian Unit roster really complete?

I don't expect the Indians to match the heavy infantry and cavalry of Greeks but current roster doesn't exactly match the advances the Indian military made in terms of armor and weapons duting Asoka's reign. The only native elite unit they have are chariots

They still have a few units to go, there's some mercenary infantry and Indo-Sakan cavalry. Indo-Greeks are the heaviest native units.

They have lancers as well, though they replace the chariots.

[Tactics Mayers]

They still have a few units to go, there's some mercenary infantry and Indo-Sakan cavalry. Indo-Greeks are the heaviest native units.

They have lancers as well, though they replace the chariots.

Those Indo-Greeks aren't exactly "native" in the strictest terms. They are basically Iranians and other native people influenced by Hellenic military tactics and arms.

I meant by actual native Indians. Besides the Indian Macemen, the Indian Bodyguards and the Chariots, are these the only native Indians with armor? Are the Indian Guild Warriors from EB1 still in concept or are they just fantasy units?

[QuintusSertorius]

The EB1 units are fantasy, we already have the guild units in the urban roster - Macemen, Spearmen and Archers.

[Rad]

By the way, Quintus - I maxed out another war temple.
The extra +1 exp bonus to cavalry from it works just fine. It just doesn't stack with other cavalry exp boosts.

[Aper]

By the way, Quintus - I maxed out another war temple.
The extra +1 exp bonus to cavalry from it works just fine. It just doesn't stack with other cavalry exp boosts.

About temples, are you planning to revise them? Because currently I have some doubts about their balance, I think governor is much better than the others, followed by fertility, that is not different enough from farming (at least for barbarians), while battle, happiness and forge seems inferior choices (again, especially for barbarians). TBH, I extensively modded them in my installation. Any thoughts?

[QuintusSertorius]

About temples, are you planning to revise them? Because currently I have some doubts about their balance, I think governor is much better than the others, followed by fertility, that is not different enough from farming (at least for barbarians), while battle, happiness and forge seems inferior choices (again, especially for barbarians). TBH, I extensively modded them in my installation. Any thoughts?

Not really; we're limited by the small number of relevant capabilities that buildings have.

[Aper]

Not really; we're limited by the small number of relevant capabilities that buildings have.

I understand, but what I meant is that each temple tier bonus need a rebalance. For example IIRC (I didn't keep a backup of the original files ) the tier 4 of the FUN temple due to the law malus actually grant a smaller net public order bonus than the other temples, plus the corruption increase; and the smaller upkeep cost doesn't make much sense IMHO, it would be better tied to a more management focused temple, or I'm wrong?

Since this thread is meant to contain suggestions, I suggest the changes I made in my files : the general guidelines are slower happiness bonus progression but increased unique benefits.

TEMPLE OF BATTLE: +1 exp is too weak, I would never build them in vanilla EBII, removed cavalry exp bonus because doesn't make much sense for infantry based factions.
BATTLE TIER 3: HAPPINESS +2, +1 EXP
BATTLE TIER 4: HAPPINESS +2, +2 EXP
BATTLE TIER 5: HAPPINESS +3, +3 EXP

TEMPLE OF FARMING: I see this priests as really good at managing local economy, so increased farming level and reduced upkeep costs. Removed pop increase because it robs fertility temple of its uniqueness. Good for smaller and more isolated factions that need cash.
FARMING TIER 3: HAPPINESS +2, +1 FARM, 100 UPKEEP
FARMING TIER 4: HAPPINESS +2, +2 FARM, 100 UPKEEP
FARMING TIER 5: HAPPINESS +3, +3 FARM, 150 UPKEEP

TEMPLE OF FERTILITY: focused on pop growth
FERTILITY TIER 3: HAPPINESS +2, +1 POP GROWTH
FERTILITY TIER 4: HAPPINESS +2, +2 POP GROWTH
FERTILITY TIER 5: HAPPINESS +3, +3 POP GROWTH

TEMPLE OF FORGE: this is very tricky, because you put very different deities here, and what makes sense for one doesn't for others. In the end I just stole the construction time bonus from governor temples and put it here, rebalancing it to have a real effect on most buildings. It makes somewhat sense and make the temple worth of its price.
FORGE TIER 3: HAPPINESS +2, CONSTR TIME -20%
FORGE TIER 4: HAPPINESS +2, CONSTR TIME -25%, RETRAIN BONUS 1
FORGE TIER 5: HAPPINESS +3, CONSTR TIME -35%, RETRAIN BONUS 2

TEMPLE OF FUN: focused on, duh, fun. Big happiness bonus, good for troublesome regions.
FUN TIER 3: HAPPINESS +3
FUN TIER 4: HAPPINESS +4
FUN TIER 5: HAPPINESS +5

TEMPLE OF GOVERNORS: this temple reduce corruption and promotes trade, emphasizing the "lawgiver" aspect of divinity. Stern justice reduce happiness, though (PO net bonus at each tier is the same of most other temples anyway). Good for big sprawling factions.
GOVERNORS TIER 3: LAW +3, HAPPINESS -1
GOVERNORS TIER 4: LAW +4, HAPPINESS -2, REMOVED TRADE MALUS
GOVERNORS TIER 5: LAW +5, HAPPINESS -2, REMOVED TRADE MALUS

That's it, I hope it was worth of your reading time.

TL; DR: please make temples more balanced to each other at each tier, and make their bonuses more relevant.

[Rad]

Although I support the increase of the number of available +EXP bonuses, I do not think that tying them to the war temple building is the way to go.
I'd much rather see bigger, better, more organised drilling grounds to do that. Naturally, they should be expensive to maintain.
From what I can see in my campaign, the AI does build a lot of war temples and drill grounds, so it would positively affect it as well.

[Aper]

As Quintus said, there is a limited number of available effects, so since I wanted to make tier 5 temples more useful (right now in unmodded EBII I would just skip them) I had not many choices but to give their specific bonus a flat increase. Honestly I also wanted to keep things as simple as possible. My biggest concern anyway was to make each tier of any temple equally useful (actually, low tiers of GOVERNORS are still slightly better) but more unique, unlike in unmodded EBII IMHO.

[Rad]

All I am saying is that if you want more effective troops, you train them better. Warmongering only gets you so far. That's why I prefer drill grounds over temples.

[LusitanianWolf]

All I am saying is that if you want more effective troops, you train them better. Warmongering only gets you so far. That's why I prefer drill grounds over temples.

I agree that it makes more sense for drilling grounds to give experience than temples.

In the other hand battle temples could provide:

- recruitment and retraining cost reductions to represent the population being more cooperant with being drafted for war
- morale bonus, to represent religious fanaticism and the will to please the war deities.
- ancillaries giving morale bonus to troops or command to the generals

[Aper]

I agree that it makes more sense for drilling grounds to give experience than temples.

In the other hand battle temples could provide:

- recruitment and retraining cost reductions to represent the population being more cooperant with being drafted for war
- morale bonus, to represent religious fanaticism and the will to please the war deities.
- ancillaries giving morale bonus to troops or command to the generals

I gave battle temples retraining cost reduction, but then I realized many "forge" temples are actually dedicated to healing gods, so it makes more sense to leave this bonus to them as it is.
About morale bonuses, AFAIK exp points give 1 morale bonus each level and 1 attack bonus every 3 levels, so in reality battle temples mostly enhance morale already.
Recruitment cost reduction is a good idea, I didn't think about it because I wanted to stick as much as possible with the original bonuses chosen by the EB team for the official release.
I thought temples already gave unique ancillaries and traits, am I wrong?

[Sarkiss]

was trying out the banners from Alternative Battles submod by YourMadDoc. his decr_banner_new.xml seems to be compatible with 2.35 and i was wondering if they could be included in the main EB?
these banners look neat and are a nice middle way between the outsized bouncie vanilla ones and going custom no banners. they look rather realistic whilst not causing potential control/visibility difficulties of 'no banners'.
here is their description:

Banners (only decr_banner_new.xml is required for changes)
- Much smaller banners to look more as real flags and less as UI elements. Somewhere between having them enabled/disabled.
- Banners will not "bounce" , only wave in wind.