Freedom of Movement between the UK, Australia, Canada and New Zealand should be a given - but it's not.

[Sharpe]

Freedom of movement between the UK, Australia and New Zealand (possibly Ireland, Canada) should be in place given the ties between the people and ease of integration, yet has taken a backseat to the EU freedom of movement (which I support FYI...mostly). I have many, many friends and some family from Down Under and was reading up about how loads have to reluctantly go home after their 2 year visas expire, despite literally being the same people as us with a funny accent, yet some Latvian plumber can bring his entire extended family.


Thoughts?

Considering that so many Britons go Down Under each year and Aussies/Kiwis come here and integrate instantaneously it should be a no-brainer, what is stopping it really?

[removeduser_487563287433]

Freedom of movement between the UK, Australia and New Zealand (possibly Ireland, Canada) should be in place given the ties between the people and ease of integration, yet has taken a backseat to the EU freedom of movement (which I support FYI...mostly). I have many, many friends and some family from Down Under and was reading up about how loads have to reluctantly go home after their 2 year visas expire, despite literally being the same people as us with a funny accent, yet some Latvian plumber can bring his entire extended family.


Thoughts?

Considering that so many Britons go Down Under each year and Aussies/Kiwis come here and integrate instantaneously it should be a no-brainer, what is stopping it really?

You're seeing this from a completely British perspective. Canada and Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies and wide open beauty - it's the British, not them, who have everything to gain from such an arrangement. Frankly that Latvian plumber has skills Australia might need more than some British bricklayer who wants to earn his dollars and maybe become a sparky.

[Sharpe]

You're seeing this from a completely British perspective. Canada and Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies and wide open beauty - it's the British, not them, who have everything to gain from such an arrangement. Frankly that Latvian plumber has skills Australia might need more than some British bricklayer who wants to earn his dollars and maybe become a sparky.

Yet there are still Aussies and Kiwis being sent back home due to expired visas, from what I would argue is their own motherland no less.

As for a sparky or a bricky - they can be home grown and there is a trend of forgoing uni to learn a trade, it's a big step for a sparky to go down under and not a typical move. Typically it's 18-35 year old graduates. There are still huge numbers of Australasians coming over every year and Brits going abroad. Employment and prospects is a valid point but generally any Brits, Kiwis or Aussies going abroad are either travelling or young professionals - no slouchers. Generally.

The recent billboard campaign got me thinking about this a lot, plus I dated a Kiwi for a few months

Have a butch at these, they're illustrative but you get the point. There is polarity.







I honestly don't think it's a case of good for one, bad for the other rather mutual give and take.

Perhaps I'm looking at this from an ideological mindset at the moment, but you must understand where I'm coming from, I just think it's a shame that formality prevents people with intrinsic ties from becoming fully integrated. The thought of estrangement is actually kind of sad to me, my closest friend is a Briton who moved to NZ.

I'm of the mindset that even if it isn't used - it should be there anyway. There are no other nationalities on earth as close as the Brits, Aussies and Kiwis. I guarantee if this was suggested in either three of the countries in question it would receive huge support. There are factors beyond fiscal gain that should be considered, and honestly even if this policy was put in place - I doubt the numbers would increase a great deal. Most people who want to visit any of the nations in question can do so with reasonable ease - but that should be that assurance that you really do have a home away from home halfway across the globe - especially if you have family or close friends there. As it stands the Commonwealth is words, if Britain really wants to stand up on its two feet and rub shoulders with France and Deutschland on the EU stage this is a great asset.

You're well traveled mate - what are your personal thoughts on this? Beyond what might be beneficial for any of the countries. I personally believe further integration would only yield good things, and that isn't because I want to work in Aus, though I will very likely spend a year there at some point.

[Cope]

You're seeing this from a completely British perspective. Canada and Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies and wide open beauty - it's the British, not them, who have everything to gain from such an arrangement. Frankly that Latvian plumber has skills Australia might need more than some British bricklayer who wants to earn his dollars and maybe become a sparky.

"Canada, Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies..."

Oh, they are?

Na, they're just not retards who let in any old tossers because they're too lazy and or incompetent to properly educated their home grown citizens.

[Stavroforos]

"Canada, Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies..."

Oh, they are?

Na, they're just not retards who let in any old tossers because they're too lazy and or incompetent to properly educated their home grown citizens.

I don't know what Australia's like, but Canada has had until recently a very open immigration policy.

[Dr Zoidberg]

"Canada, Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies..."

Oh, they are?

Na, they're just not retards who let in any old tossers because they're too lazy and or incompetent to properly educated their home grown citizens.

23 years of uninterrupted economic growth and the only developed nation to avoid recession during the GFC.

We've also a very broad immigration policy, with almost 30% of Australians having been born overseas.

But please, continue to sprout complete bollocks.

[Cope]

23 years of uninterrupted economic growth and the only developed nation to avoid recession during the GFC.

We've also a very broad immigration policy, with almost 30% of Australians having been born overseas.

But please, continue to sprout complete bollocks.

Austrailia has a broad immigration policy - lol. Been to Europe recently?

[Dr Zoidberg]

Austrailia has a broad immigration policy - lol. Been to Europe recently?

Yup. Been to Australia... ever?

[removeduser_487563287433]

"Canada, Australia and New Zealand are the ones with the booming, balanced economies..."

Oh, they are?

Na, they're just not retards who let in any old tossers because they're too lazy and or incompetent to properly educated their home grown citizens.

Um... ok. The UK has robust education but nevermind that. New Zealand, Canada, Australia do indeed let in immigrants. 28% of Australia's population was born abroad, 26% of New Zealanders, 21% of Canada and... 12% of the UK.

But you know... never let facts get in the way of an ignorant comment drooled out the corner of your mouth.

[Cope]

Um... ok. The UK has robust education but nevermind that. New Zealand, Canada, Australia do indeed let in immigrants. 28% of Australia's population was born abroad, 26% of New Zealanders, 21% of Canada and... 12% of the UK.

But you know... never let facts get in the way of an ignorant comment drooled out the corner of your mouth.

Robust education lol. Funny that white people are ethnically the least likely to go to university (roughly 25%) in the UK when they constitute just short of 90% of the overall population. Your entire position is a contradiction - we need an open door policy to Europe to fill our skilled worker deficit though we also have a robust education system. Explain to me how one of the most densely populated countries in the world has a great education system when it needs to import skilled foreign workers on mass?

You also contradict yourself by applauding Australian immigration and then disliking UKIP's view on immigration since that party wants to model the UK's immigration policy around Australia's.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Robust education lol. Funny that white people are ethnically the least likely to go to university (roughly 25%) in the UK when they constitute just short of 90% of the overall population. Your entire position is a contradiction - we need an open door policy to Europe to fill our skilled worker deficit though we also have a robust education system. Explain to me how one of the most densely populated countries in the world has a great education system when it needs to import skilled foreign workers on mass?

You also contradict yourself by applauding Australian immigration and then disliking UKIP's view on immigration since that party wants to model the UK's immigration policy around Australia's.

You just lie through your teeth, don't you? Not only did I not defend Australia's immigration policy, on this page I posted an article detailing the horrors that its outsourcing asylum to Papua New Guinea. I mean... lying is one thing. Lying so lazily is stupid and that's the greatest sin.

Anyway, you claimed that the UK "lets in any old tosser" and Canada, NZ and Australia does not, and I proved you wrong, inevitably, again, by showing the UK has approximately half the foreign born proportion of its population vs. any of those three countries. If you wanna keep on lying, try to lie a tiny bit more intelligently. Because this is easy.

As for your education claim - you miss the point. The education of this country, thankfully, does not ethnically discriminate. You're talking about application rates, by the way, and you're right: white state school students in England (note those details) apply the least of any ethnic background:

https://www.ucas.com/sites/default/f...ort-dec-14.pdf

Page 90, by the way, God help you.

So you're totally wrong to compare it to population - you implied 25% of applicants are white when 90% of the population is (although the teenage population may not reflect that proportion, by the way). This is wrong. The fact is actually that about 25% of all white English state school students apply. Not that 25% of all applicants are white.

But again... why let facts get in the way of lying.

[Simon Cashmere]

Anyone from New Zealand can move to Australia and vice versa (although why you'd want to move from Australia to NZ, who would know, and almost no one does). Canada is a horribly cold inhospitable place. Britain was once a great nation, but is not any longer. The only place I'd ever really want to go to is the US, everywhere else kind of really is the sux0r. Ireland is a miserable place, always rainy, always cold........ There is a reason why the Irish have moved all over the world. I dont want people like Anjem Chaudry claiming 'muh human rights' and relocating to Australia based on some treaty, I'm glad he's the UKs problem.

So I'd be recommending, if anyone asked, er No. Having people come in open door from NZ is bad enough, especially as they have an open door immigrant policy, so people do the NZ shuffle - refused entry Australia, go to NZ for a few years, get NZ citizenship come to Aus.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Love how Simon managed to get Anjem Choudary in a thread even like this.

[mongrel]

Love how Simon managed to get Anjem Choudary in a thread even like this.

It takes a particular talent to do this, particularly as he is TWC's equivalent of the man.

On topic, I never understood why the English-speaking peoples are treated this way, and yet we have freedom of movement from EU nations.

[Simon Cashmere]

It takes a particular talent to do this, particularly as he is TWC's equivalent of the man.

On topic, I never understood why the English-speaking peoples are treated this way, and yet we have freedom of movement from EU nations.

In a topic about, people freely moving from the UK to here, I say, one person (and many others) like him that I wouldn't want to move here..and that's off topic apparently. To me that's the complete answer, you cannot keep people like that out without the border checks, so don't remove them.

[Sharpe]

On topic, I never understood why the English-speaking peoples are treated this way, and yet we have freedom of movement from EU nations.

Likewise, though I support the latter.

I thought it was called British Commonwealth.

The Commonwealth means very little. There is a certain potential among the nations of it, but in it's current stance it's just a title.

[hellheaven1987]

The Commonwealth means very little.

Yes, and it is largely British's own fault.

[Sharpe]

Yes, and it is largely British's own fault.

And it can be rectified. Policies like those in the OP would actually give it some meaning.

[Stavroforos]

Don't see why it should be a given, tbh. Why should Canada and Australia have to accept Britishers above any other immigrants to their countries?

[SorelusImperion]

Because Empire !!!1!1!

There is *some* truth that Canadians and Australians have much in common with British but so have Americans or in fact even Indians. Its's farily obvious that Canada and Australia are singled out because of Imperial nostalgia. SA might have been in the list as well but there are to many brownies down there as it is plus it refuses to accept her Majesty Elizabeth II as rightfull God-Queen-Empress.