Easterling/Rhun experiences & advice

**Ivniciix** · November 10, 2006, 07:53 PM

I've been through about 10, relatively short, games as Rhun. All were at Bullroaring/Bullroaring settings. I have one game still in progress. Here's my thoughts and comments so far:

1) Their starting army, units fight pretty well. I've done well against both other races in the early stages of a game.The only real annoying thing is the pathing on the Leader wains, particularly going through gates.

2) The postive effect of being a horde is the ability to stage your units to either conquer or pillage several cities in the same turn. This is negated by the fact that they start with one city. After three trys, I finally succeeded in taking the three or four closest towns without going into negative wealth...and in gnerating a modest income.

3) Unfortunately, I was rapidly overrun by both other sides, who declared peace and raped me instead...repeatedly...almost like it was scripted.

4) I'm now trying a game where I return them to horde status by purposely losing my starting city so I can pillage and, more importantly, go take away some towns from the Harad's in hopes of lessening their power enough to survive. Unfortunately, I suspect the MEZOR system will thwart this by limiting what units I can build until I return to my original homelands and conquer some of the cities I've bypassed before. I tried this approach against the Reuniteds with the specific goal of taking Minas Ithil as soon as possible, which I did. It however was a huge negative income producer (-2900) so I'll need to retry that approach again...perhaps by dumping all my settlers into it and seeing how I fare with just the one town initially but the reuniteds now isloated outside Mordor. It will really depend on what units I can build how fast.

In conclusion, I'm enjoyin playing as Rhun but they have, so far, ended up too weak to last very long.

**MasterOfNone** · November 11, 2006, 04:37 AM

Thank you for your detailed feedback.

The Easterlings are of course intended to be difficult to win with but, having said that, may need a boost to their strength in some regards. I am playing around with making population distribution (and growth) more accessible in Fix Patch 1.1.

We wanted to start them off as a horde but tests showed that when the AI controlled them they simply did not expand much beyond the rebel regions. They would never attack Minas Ithil no matter what we did.

Do keep us informed of your progress, this kind of feedback is invaluable to us.

**Amroth** · November 11, 2006, 05:44 AM

Perhaps some of the guys who have played as Rhûn can give some survival tips (Tittils, Alpaca)? My own Rhûn campaign has not progressed far enough for me to be able to give specific advice.

**Ivniciix** · November 11, 2006, 12:50 PM

My latest Rhun campaign ended in a bottomless pit of debt. I had "gone horde" again by purposely losing the starting city and then headed south and west. I sacked & pillaged Athancaras, the SE Haradrian Minor City...my spies found out it had a -2900 income making it a bad place to restart my kingdom. I also pillaged the large town of Caras Agar as well as Parchereb, a town recently taken by the Haradrians.

I then headed West. aloing the way, I ran into several small 5 unit Haradrian armies that were easily swept aside and one nearly full stack with two Mumakil (elephants) that wer not so easy. It too was defeated but at great cost especially to my non-horde units. My spies had informed me that the next three cities in my path were all defended only by a leader unit, apparently each had been the starting point for one of the smaler armies I'd defeated. I divided my forces into three armies and three settler columns and simultaneously beseiged Anorith, Caranabad & Arthadr. As per my plan, all were taken in one season and I was now resettled.

As stated at the start however, even with 23,000 in reserves, I was broke in about 10 turns and it went down hill from there. I might have extended that time a bit by a better plan for destroying Haradrian buildings and building my own (like don't make fighting pits to raise town morale as the recurring cost is a trap). All my towns had only 2-4 units plus a leader as defenders. Fortunately the RK's and Hadrians were completely wrapped up in each other and left me totally unhindered as I was easy pickings. The RK's however had advanced into all the towns above the lake as far East as possible.

My conclusions:

Regardless of whether they start with a town or as a horde with none, Rhun is too poor and too weak to survive. A larger starting force, if they were strictly nomads, would allow them to raise more cash by pillaging before settling. Otherwise, they just need to be a settled community in possession of more towns. Still fun playing them as the units are decent fighters.

**Fondor_Yards** · November 11, 2006, 12:52 PM

Horse Archers, lots and lots of Horse archers. Your infantry isn't good enough to stand up to either RK or Harad without a lot more, which you don't have the population for nor the money for. Your foot archers are decent, but no where near as strong as Harad's and Rk's. So an army made of 1-2 Generals, 6-10 HA, and 2-3 meele cavalry *Raiders are decent enough, Riders of Rhun are very good* is enough to hold them off, if your good with HA. But expanding is still a problem, so I took an army once it got enough exp and burned a couple RK cities to the ground. Gave good money.

**Professor420** · November 13, 2006, 12:37 AM

I just finished my Gondor campaign, I will try out Rhun now I guess, I am up for a challenge. If I find the campaign unwinnable, I think it truly is unwinnable. However I never had much luck playing as Hordes, so maybe not.

The goal, I think, would be to get to Gondor's lands, between Dol Amroth and Pelagir. These are some very poorly defended but rich areas. Linhr and Pelagir especially... the only question, is can I hold Gondor off if I were to take these areas, but more importantly, how can I even get to these areas?

One thing I don't want to do, is get between Gondor and Harad. Harad starts off with very powerful armies who stake out all along the Poros, which means crossing south of the Mountains, and sweeping up through Ithilien, is risky... Mumakil would be far too devastating to deal with, and why not let Gondor deal with them instead?

Mordor and Nurn are not very wealthy... I will try taking Gorgoroth and the Nurn areas, and keeping to the traditional Eastlands, until I can sustain myself... I guess I will have to throw all my troops at the chokepoint of Minas Ithil, where I can afford a lengthy seige... fighting Gondorian infantry on walls is not something I am keen to do. Once I take it, holding onto it will likely be a problem, but it provides an easy defense, and a springboard into Ithilien and Pelennor.

Lots of watchtowers and small horsearcher armies will be my defense against Harad... entice them to attack, then harrass them with my horsearchers, and after they lose or the time expires, they'll have no choice but to return home and resupply. I definately can't stand up to the might of Harad.

I cannot see hope in taking on Harad, simply because it will take a while to get my economy and military going... Gondor has a beautiful economy and structure from the getgo, but no military, which means Minas Ithil will be the equalizer. As long as I can keep from being invaded by Harad, I think I'll have a fighting shot. Hell, if I could dominate with Parthia and their financial problems, I think I should be able to deal with Rhun.

Anyway, the RK campaign was cake, I will keep you all informed how I fair with Easterlings.

**Professor420** · November 15, 2006, 12:03 AM

I have taken Minas Tirith, my economy is producing an income of 3000 mirian/turn, and I just trained the first troops since my first couple turns. Unfortunately Harad is at about full strength, but just resumed their war with Gondor. There are still some tough battles ahead, while I consolidate Gondorian lands... the highways let my armies move fast, so that's a plus. After that, I may likely be crushed by Harad... they will likely take Ithilien (they are beseiging it now), so I'll have to hold them off at Osgiliath bridge, and bolster my defenses at Minas Ithil and catch them in a pincer if they beseige it. I am building my first Muster Fields, so being able to actually produce troops is still a ways away, but infinitely closer now.

I am thinking in my head how to deal with Harad... I had assumed that once Gondor was defeated, Middle-earth was as good as mine, but the huge number of Haradrim, and the control of the seas (meaning, no amphibious assaults at Umbar), worry me. In a few days, Gondor will be mine, but I don't know if I will have time to get things rolling before they attack with their numerous armies. In any event, as soon as Gondor is defeated, and I can get a real army together that I think can make it from Pelagir to Umbar, I'll likely hop down the coast, finishing my turn on land but travelling by sea. I'll need to, in order to avoid the Poros.

So to all those people who said Rhun was impossible (including me as late as a couple hours ago), its not. The 21k mirian from Minas Tirith is what turned things around, and single-handedly almost brought me out of debt.

**MasterOfNone** · November 15, 2006, 03:34 AM

I always knew it was not impossible

In fix 1.1 the Pelennor (and surrounding regions) have been decreased as to both population growth and trade wealth but the Easterlings have been given some boost in resources and now require less army upkeep. I have been testing them and one can start making a small profit 5-10 years into the game, with a modest profit of about 2000 Mirian per turn thereafter (which is the point I am about at). I have taken all the Rhûn and Khand area, plus central and eastern Mordor. I intend to launch an attack on Minas Ithil but I am not sure at what point to do it yet. In 1.1 Minas Ithil starts with a higher-level barracks even though RK unit sizes for militia, elites and superior class units have been decreased.

I would be very interested in anyone's campaign with RK under the 1.1 Fix; I think it should be alot different from 1.0 (please start another thread if want to respond to this challenge).

Thx Prof & All!

EDIT: Gah, now Harad and RK have formed an alliance and Harad has attacked me in Khand wresting my Variag chief city, Acharn, from me.

**Professor420** · November 19, 2006, 05:57 PM

Let me give an update.

I have taken MT, Emyn Aryn (Ithilien), Lossenarch, and Pelagir. My economy is producting about 8000 Mirian/turn.

Harad has finished taking most of the rebel settlements, and is now at my border with Khand. I began a tremendous military buildup in the homeland, and have a full stack ready, and 3 generals just arrived from the west, to lead them again Harad. I will soon begin my campaign to take Khand, which will surely be difficult, as my spies tell me Harad has many, many troops there. Fortunately, it is close enough to my homelands, which means I can manufacture high-quality troops.

Ithilien is another matter. A large Harad army snuck past my army that was going to seal off the Poros. I decided to take this army (mostly archers, and some Blackland Mercs, and a general, perfect for river defense), and make a beeline for the River Harnen. As Harad can produce more, and better, troops, I need to cut them off somewhere.

Gondor is proving quite a problem. They are still producing a number of high quality troops from Dol Amroth. Furthermore, my quality troops are spread thin. I have acess to nothing better than hillmen, and Mercs, and for the first time, I am afraid to engage Gondor with the might of my faction leader and his army. This is largely due to the number of archers they have, and the few I have (all went with another general, towards the Poros). Without archers and wains (damn the bug!) to wear down the enemy, I cannot hope to hold up to Gondor in melee. Furthermore, I cannot even defend a city... it will be too easy for Gondor to take the stone walls of Pelagir, so I will stage my defense on the bridge. They have refrained from attacking so far, though.

For the first time, my campaign is on the edge of destruction, after having come this far. If my army in Gondor is wiped out, I have no chance of holding Gondor's momentum and counter attack. If my army in Haradwaith is whittled down, surrounded, and destroyed, nothing will stop Harad from heading north through Ithilien with all their might. If I lose Gondor, I will not have enough money to support my campaign in Khand.

**Amroth** · November 19, 2006, 07:15 PM

Great report, Prof. Do keep us posted on your progress!

**Professor420** · November 22, 2006, 09:05 PM

If this will be our end, then let us make such an end as to be worthy of remembrance!

Well I pulled through against Gondor, but things aren't going well otherwise.

Gondor is about to lose their last king, and Dol Amroth. However, from my entire starting army, I have about 6-7 units remaining, mostly at half strength. The war has been extremely lopsided in casualties, but then again, Gondor could afford them more than I could.

The real problem comes from Poros and Ithilien. I had a small army there, mostly of archers, to defend the Poros. Well, they finally got their chance, and fought bravely against staggering (3:1) odds, and were barely victorious. The 4 units of heavy cavalry against me fought bravely to the death and killed many men. However, another royal army followed up, and my now-wafer thin defenses cracked. I have lost the Poros, my only army in Ithilien, and a Chief Captain. My closest troops are my extremely weak army near Dol Amroth... the citizens of Minas Tirith will once again find the scarlet banners of Harad outside their walls very soon.

Things are faring better in the East. As soon as I started turning a profit, I began a huge military buildup. I have almost two full stacks of very raw troops, who have been waiting for a powerful Harad army to sally forth from a a city in Khand. I cannot dare attack it, as they simply have too many troops. The battle will be decisive; it will deal a crushing blow to Harad's forces in the East, and open the Khandian heartlands to my campaigning armies. On the other hand, a loss would crush my empire, by setting me back countless turns. I am racing in the East against a countdown in the West.

Taking Khand will give me, perhaps, a fighting chance, even if I lose MT and Gondor. I have started, and will continue, to build up a large horsearcher army, and use it to spear as deep into Harad as I can. Their large numbers of footmen will be mincemeat, and the idea is to wear them down... usually wars of attrition aren't won by the vastly inferior side, however!

As soon as I gain control of Khand and have confidence in my forces there, I can send troops West. However, this trip is many turns in duration, and sending reinforcements now would never arrive in time to make a real difference or mount a counter-offensive. I will try to reinforce Minas Ithil.

The problem is, I can only produce quality troops in Rhun. Gondor allows me to train Hillmen, Warbands, Skirmishers, and on the highest level, I think axemen. However, even Darkhelms and Great Axemen can barely stand up to Harad... what am I to do? Mercs can only go so far. Harad, AFAIK, still has half of its starting armies... one I destroyed at the Poros and one I have holed up in Khand. Hopefully it lost a couple troops here and there, but I likely have 2-3 full strong armies against me, and an ungodly number of Footmen as well.

Without the ability to counter-attack, or even defend, Gondor, I fear that its loss will cripple my economy. Furthermore, I would have to regain Dol Amroth and MT in order to achieve victory... I cannot raze everything to hell and retreat into Mordor.

**MasterOfNone** · November 23, 2006, 03:17 AM

Great stuff, Prof. Hopefully players will not be struggling quite so much with the Easterlings in 1.2 and there is a more sure and fast victory!

**Professor420** · November 26, 2006, 11:11 PM

I have destroyed Gondor, and let Anfalas rebel (the distance penalty was too high).

Harad has taken Emyn Aren with a royal army... my garrison of Hillmen and Men of Mordor fought bravely, and eliminated more than 200 Haradrian troops, including an entire unit of Scarlet Shields.

Minas Tirith is loaded with as many troops as I can muster, constantly retraining Hillmen and sending them off to other cities, as well. My conquering Gondor army flies east to reinforce the garrisons. Things are at somewhat of a standstill near Gondor, and I can't hope for much better with the cards I'm given.

The east is another story. I've broken through Harad's frontier armies with my main army, and I have two horse-archer armies going deep into the hearland, towards Umbar. I am going to move west, along the mountain border with Mordor, cross the River Haradwaith, and seal it off, then consolidate between Haradwaith and Poros Rivers. Once that is complete, I will go via ship and try to take Umbar. Hopefully, my horse-archer armies can whittle down Harad that they will not be able to make any serious offenses at the river or against my lands.

Things have swung favourably, as long as I can hold onto Minas Ithil and Minas Tirith, and the longer Harad waits to beseige them, the harder it will be for them.

**Amroth** · November 27, 2006, 03:09 AM

Hah, I knew the tide would turn

Good read.

**MasterOfNone** · November 27, 2006, 07:34 AM

I must admit, I had doubts the Easterlings could triumph in such a way pre 1.1. Excellent. Or are you patched up? If so, still doing better than I ever did!

**Professor420** · November 27, 2006, 01:47 PM

I patched up right after I took MT, because of the Easterling Wain bug... I tried patching to correct it.

Regardless, though, it didn't make much difference. In fact, the relatively meager amount of ammo my generals have has probably hurt me overall (and hurt them the most, often having to melee= many dead generals), compared to 1.0 when it was almost limitless. Gondor's back was already broken when I patched, and I was turning a small profit.