These new Roman Reform requirements needed.

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

The Roman reforms are happening too early.
Regardless of the debate about how to dictate their inception, when playing a historical campaign at 1tpy, we should be seeing the reforms happen at the same point in history in which they happened (or thereabouts). So, for instance, the Marian reform occur exactly one imperium level too early (based on conquest requirements), and many turns too early. I've edited the requirements to better suit the intended playthrough, which I recommend being implemented into the mod. This way, it wont make much of a difference if you're playing on 4tpy, but if you want an accurate historical campaign, you dont have to pretend the reforms havent happened for 50 years.

Player: 3, 40, 6, 130, 9, 250
Global: 50, 140, 260

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

For those who are interested, the above numbers are the imperium level (low numbers (for player only)), and turn numbers [respectively] that are required for each Roman reform.

[KAM 2150]

We had a poll on average campaign time. Current turn requirements are the best gameplay/realism combo. Even now players have problem reaching last level of Roman reforms before campaign ends (and miss awesome work on Roman auxiliary units from Diego).

[rjacko10]

I would hate to miss out on the last reforms because I was too successful.

What is the reason for not having reforms solely linked to imperium level?

[FlashHeart07]

I would hate to miss out on the last reforms because I was too successful.

What is the reason for not having reforms solely linked to imperium level?

If they were only tied to reform lvl experienced players would reach them pretty fast and start complaining that they are getting the reforms waaay too early. So by also needing a specific turn time the reforms can get a little bit closer to reality. Or something like that. Im just guessing

[rjacko10]

If they were only tied to reform lvl experienced players would reach them pretty fast and start complaining that they are getting the reforms waaay too early. So by also needing a specific turn time the reforms can get a little bit closer to reality. Or something like that. Im just guessing

Fair enough, but then these advanced players would be missing out on the great units as KAM said. Perhaps these advanced players should put the difficulty up, or use mods to make mega legendary mode (if there is one!)

Actually thinking about if it was solely linked to imperium level then: if you expand really fast at the beginning you will get better troops than the enemy, and then expand faster as the game becomes easier. Snowball effect and it'll be too easy.

So extra turn time clause does make sense

[Linke]

Someone should make a submod though.

[Eurolandish]

While a submod for more 'historically accurate' reform requirements might be a good idea, DeI's current reform requirements are so easily altered to personal preference already by using the Pack File Manager. This thread could be a good guide for those after such a thing if a submod is never made.

To be honest, I've changed the reforms to happen a bit earlier on my current game since my first playthrough on normal DeI, the reforms still felt very long to achieve, as I prefer a slower pace for expanding than some others might do. (plus I also wanted to get those great looking Marian Legions into action). I think my current ones, while certainly not historically accurate are quite reasonable for all factions.

[DesMarekle]

DeI's current reform requirements are so easily altered to personal preference already by using the Pack File Manager. This thread could be a good guide for those after such a thing if a submod is never made.

I'd really like such a guide I think i read one somewhere in this forum, but i can't find it now and this thread is the most relevant thing that turned up when i used the search function. Sadly, there's no guide here yet

[FlashHeart07]

I'd really like such a guide I think i read one somewhere in this forum, but i can't find it now and this thread is the most relevant thing that turned up when i used the search function. Sadly, there's no guide here yet

Try using the PFM and look around for it. I believe it will be located in the scripts. Quite easy. Otherwise I might be able to help you out later this day when I get a chance to look at it.

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

SOooooo.... Like my OP said, the IMPERIUM LEVEL should be upped. That way if players reach that imperium level earlier than historically, they would still at least match up to historical development of the Roman Empire. Nothing at all to do with campaign length.

[XIIICaesar]

KAM 2150 is trying to say it takes awhile to reach Imperial reform era in Roman campaigns. I have a difficult time reaching it before my campaigns end. I normally have to slow down to reach Imperial levels before I end the campaign. And granted your are right. The current reform requirments are off a lot from historical times if one was playing 1 turn per year but 1TPY is a submod. BASE DEI comes at 4 turns per year not 1 TPY.

[Chuck The Hammer]

I'm a fan of turning DEI to 1 turn per year. I know it has its drawbacks, like unrealistic movement rates - a couple years to cross the Med - and lower character development. But, on the other hand, the reforms 'historically' line up with well if you're concious about expansion. Additionally, not all Roman commanders ended up as top generals. There are plenty of examples of terrible Romans leading armies that were not so lucky like Varus in Teutoberg or Carbo against the Cimbrians. Additionly, the good ones you do develop are the grizzled, battle-hardened veterans of years of campaigning and battle like Sulla, Marius, Caesar, or Marc Antony. Natural-born leaders like Hannibal, Augustus, or Vercingetorix are only born once in an empire. My two cents.

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

As an aside, how many of the 4PTY fanboys have ever seen Scipio Africanus, Scipio Aemilianus, Caesar, Pompey, Vergingetorix, Crassus, Marius, Sertorius, Catilinus, Sulla, and Mithradates in their campaigns? I am playing 1tpy, and I've had all of them and more in a single campaign. It's scripted that way, so you DO miss out on a lot if you dont play it through.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

As an aside, how many of the 4PTY fanboys have ever seen Scipio Africanus, Scipio Aemilianus, Caesar, Pompey, Vergingetorix, Crassus, Marius, Sertorius, Catilinus, Sulla, and Mithradates in their campaigns? I am playing 1tpy, and I've had all of them and more in a single campaign. It's scripted that way, so you DO miss out on a lot if you dont play it through.

I'm on 12 turns per year and I've still seen all of them.

Maybe you should try a different approach other than insulting the majority of the player base?

[xisheng]

If the great leaders of Roman Empire would have anyhthing but their names in the grand campaign it would be worth playing 1tpy i guess. I love 4tpy because of how realistic the seasons are, the movement, and most importantly the life span of my generals, agents, governors and champions, 1tpy is stupid, your characters die off without any achievements and so on, i actually get attached to my generals, and when my faction leader dies i get all sad because i invested so much time making him to the best possible politician or commander. All the generals and such have like 2-3 textures, whats the difference if its Caesar or someone else. Also, changing the reforms to your preferred time takes 10 seconds with the help of pfm, i lowered the Imperial reforms to occur when i hit imperium level 5 and 150 turns, happy with that, i always hit the Imperial Reforms when im already in control of Africa, Egypt and Asia (provinces) so the Imperial reforms are for actual Empire and dont happen when im just outside Italy.

[Eurolandish]

Not having a famous or infamous general's name pop up in my game is a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

[zombieflanders]

I think there are added abilities in CiG for Caesar and the major Gallic generals (or at least they're available in custom battles), but that seems to be it. Otherwise, it's a concept CA dropped entirely. If there were special abilities or something with all of the named generals, I'd be bugged about it, but as it stands now I don't care. I'm much happier with generals and agents that last long enough to be actually useful. After all, I'm creating my own history, so I like being able to create my own Caesars (and Mithridates, and Vercingetorix, etc), too.

[Linke]

I got Scipio

[BassiveMollocks]

Huh I usually hit last Roman reforms as I push north across the Alps, after I've conquered Syracuse and all of North Africa. Seems well timed to me.