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Thread: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

  1. #21

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    I am still working on ironing out the Armenian custom missions, they are giving me some issues. However, hopefully I can get them working soon and we can also include this in the mod Will be a nice Armenian update.

    ----> Website -- Patreon -- Steam -- Forums -- Youtube -- Facebook <----

  2. #22

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Quote Originally Posted by Dresden View Post
    I am still working on ironing out the Armenian custom missions, they are giving me some issues. However, hopefully I can get them working soon and we can also include this in the mod Will be a nice Armenian update.
    Great news! I'm appreciated


    Now I'm working with new Armenian high nobles. As for now they are pretty similar to Azats.
    As I sad at previous page, I'm point at left guy in this render (it looks historically pretty accurate):



    What i made is a new armour texture (in fact there are 4 textures but very similar), mace is from OSP, thanks for those guys

    So, what we have now:
    SHOW


    First two pictures are the same Nakharar cavalry, just dismounted to better view of armour. 2/3 of them armed with maces and rest - with axes (mounted they have spears as primary weapon offcourse)




    I want to say, close cavalry combat with maces, axes and swords looks much better then with spears




    What do you think mates?


    p.s. If I'll make some helmet models in 3Ds Max, could someone make the rigid_model for me?
    Last edited by Avetis; September 30, 2014 at 03:52 PM.

  3. #23

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    I'm rather busy but if you make the 3dsmax helmet, position it properly and so on, I can do the conversion for you. Or tell you how to achieve it yourself.

  4. #24

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    OK, thanks man

  5. #25

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Ok, I figured model conversion by myself.
    But I'm steel poor in modeling. In 3D I only work with motion graphics, so don't judge me to much

    New Nakharars (dismounted for better view) with new custom-model helmet, coif from OSP and facemask from original CRoC mod:


  6. #26

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    That looks like a pretty good helmet to me. I take it you were trying to do the Iranian ridge helmet? The coif business you got going looks good too. How's it look in motion?

  7. #27

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Iranian helmet which is basicly image at this picture I think




    I tried to copy this shape, but it's imposible for RTW2. So i have to make it wider to fit the ears, nose and hair.

    Coif is good, i just make new textures for it (to make them simillar with CRoC facewrap).
    Here are in-action screenshots:
    SHOW






    Last edited by Avetis; October 03, 2014 at 10:53 PM.

  8. #28

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Some news, guys:


    AnthoniusII suggested about not only Roman influence but Persian too.
    At first this applies to cataphract lancers and archers.

    There are some good reconstruction (this one for example) pictures I found, and they inspire me to do Sassanid style reskin for this type of units.

    Now we got new custom model helmet (I was lucky to fit it with CRoC crests form the first try ), new armour texture and, as result, new skins for Armenian Cataphracts and Cataphracts archers:





    As you can see, archers have little lighter armor. Seriously, it's ridiculous to see horse archers with plated arm armour.

  9. #29

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Quote Originally Posted by Avetis View Post
    Some news, guys:


    AnthoniusII suggested about not only Roman influence but Persian too.
    At first this applies to cataphract lancers and archers.

    There are some good reconstruction (this one for example) pictures I found, and they inspire me to do Sassanid style reskin for this type of units.

    Now we got new custom model helmet (I was lucky to fit it with CRoC crests form the first try ), new armour texture and, as result, new skins for Armenian Cataphracts and Cataphracts archers:





    As you can see, archers have little lighter armor. Seriously, it's ridiculous to see horse archers with plated arm armour.
    Jesus those look beautiful man

  10. #30

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Thank you!

    Last one for today is a spoiler for tomorrow

    Complete custom helmet-n-coif model. Still need some additional rigging (and maybe texturing), but the model is ready



    Here is Variant Editor screenshot:


  11. #31

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Impressive work, we might have to use that helmet and coif for the Sassanids too. Also good idea about the Iberian disc armor for that straps worn by the Sassanids. I might see if I can shrink the disc in size to fit the references, but I hadn't thought of that.

  12. #32

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Yes, that disk is too damn big. Will be great, if you make it smaller. But it needs new model, alpha doesn't solve.

  13. #33
    Maximus183's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    This looks great! Good job man!

  14. #34

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Helmets-n-coif ready.
    There are two new models - one for Nakharars and one (with two textures) for both Cataphracts:





    New skins for this units (added some new textures and chest disk based on iberian chest disk):




    new links:

    http://www.mediafire.com/download/gn...NoDefault.pack
    http://www.mediafire.com/download/pu...nia_0.2.1.pack

    First post updated
    Last edited by Avetis; October 05, 2014 at 08:31 AM.

  15. #35

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Really great work.

    I am running into a wall getting the Armenian custom missions up and running but I will continue working on it this week. If I can't get them working properly we can always include this without them.

    ----> Website -- Patreon -- Steam -- Forums -- Youtube -- Facebook <----

  16. #36

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    There are some things (which intersects with Sassanid faction by the way) i'm working with.
    So I think we can wait

  17. #37

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Let's have a talk about cataphracts.
    Allmost every source, from Wikipedia to Hans Gottlieb Leopold Delbrück talking about universalism of Sassanid period eastern heavy cavalry. Every cavalryman had lance, bow and close combat weapon.
    So I remade cataphracts to fit the historical facts.

    Also I made a simple model for equipment which I was very missing




  18. #38

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Lol, I'm being put out of a job. Really great work. I assume they use lance on the charge, bow at a distance, sword in melee?

    The one thing I'd note is that from what I've read the rank and file Sassanian (and I assume Armenian) cavalry didn't have metal barding - just leather/cloth or none. The elite contingents of true cataphracts rather than grivpan rank and file would have metal barding.

    p461
    8 The Persians opposed to us serried bands of mail-called horsemen in such close order that the gleam of moving bodies covered with densely fitting plates of iron dazzled the eyes of those who looked upon them, while the whole throng of horse was protected by coverings of leather. The cavalry was backed up by companies of infantry, who, protected by oblong, curved shields covered with wickerwork and raw hides, advanced in very close order. Behind these were elephants, looking like walking hills, and, by the movements of their enormous bodies, they threatened destruction to all who came near them, dreaded as they were from past experience.
    http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/...mmian/24*.html

    If you want to go ahead on the Sassanids, you definitely can. I would say since they are one of my favorites that I do plan to work on them myself, but you're clearly a great texturer/designer and your work would be welcome on them. The roster I had in mind for them was going to be this:

    Levy Archers - I've got this handled.
    Levy Spearmen - I've got this handled.
    Levy Slingers - I've got this handled.
    Levy Javelinmen - I've got this handled.
    Eastern/Iranian Hillmen - The unit is already basically done. I'm inclined towards a more broad term than just "Kurdish hillmen", because that limits them to the actual Kurdish territories - else you get Kurdish hillmen in Khorasan or in Bactria.\

    "Semi-Professional" Spearmen - probably a mixture of no armor and soft armor. I'm not really sure of any evidence for soft quilted armor being used in this period, but I'm going with the benefit of the doubt.
    "Semi-Professional" Archers - Same deal.

    Possibly a Royal Archers/Spearmen unit. Very small in numbers if not also unit capped. I'm leery of either as I think they were later Sassanian inventions. I'd rather not have these, and simply make the North Iranian AOR units I mention below be fully mail/scale armored - not elite, but rather solid infantry of the line.

    Some sort of Elephant Archery unit.

    Nomadic (Saka/Iranian mainly) Horse Archers
    Nomadic (Saka/Iranian mainly) Jav-Cav.

    Medium cavalry (At least right now would be titled "Savârân-î Dehqān"). Light mail/lamellar/scale shirts, no leg armor and limited arm armor. Modest helmets. Bow/Lance/Sword.
    Heavy Cavalry (At least right now titled "Savârân-î Asâwira"). More legit cataphract panoply save for the barding, which would be leather/cloth, half-barding, no barding, maybe a few metal ones mixed in)'
    Superheavy Cavalry (Savârân Grivpânvâr). True blue Cataphracts. At least from some of my wargaming resources they are cited as having only the lance in the old fashioned Parthian style.


    Then AOR wise I wanted to avoid a complex, dizzying array of different units filling the same purpose for Northern Iran (daylami, Gilani, Mazandarani, ect.) as well as the . So I thought of a few units titled: _________-î Adurbadagan. My wi-fi is crap right now so I can't really dig up the references, but those I could gather illustrate Adurbadagan was the administrative district that housed Armenia (or what of Armenia the Persians held), Media Atropatene, Azerbaijan, and south of the Caspian. Areas which historically had more infantry fighting traditions than elsewhere for the Iranians, and which (I would have to dig down the source I recall it from) the Cavalry were remarked as favoring melee weapons over the bow, I think? The question is when Adurbadagan was used as a term and a district - if it was late Sassanian then it doesn't work for us.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...urbadagan1.jpg
    http://www.ancientworlds.net/aw/Post/153653&authorid=90

    You'd have three or so AOR units in the Adurbadagan region. Based off the Arch of Galerius depictions as well as some other sources.
    Paighân-î Adurbadagan Northern Iranian Spearmen - probably a mixture of soft armor and mail/scale armor. Oval scutums, spears.
    Arteshtâr-î Adurbadagan Northern Iranian Infantry - Probably a mixture of soft armor and mail/scale armor. Oval scutums, swords/axes/javelins.
    Savârân-î Adurbadagan Northern Iranian Savaran - I have no real evidence for it, but I am kind of partial to make them shield and short spear (not kontos lance) cavalry, for variety's sake.

    You could also then have in Armenia proper the Sassanids able to recruit Armenian legionaries and 1-2 Armenian cavalrymen (one more middling, one more elite). And in turn in Iran proper the Armenians could recruit Savaran-i Dehqan, maybe Savaran-i Asawira.
    Last edited by Ahiga; October 05, 2014 at 05:34 PM.

  19. #39

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahiga View Post
    Lol, I'm being put out of a job. Really great work. I assume they use lance on the charge, bow at a distance, sword in melee?
    Yes they actually are Cavalry Missile unit, but Alt+attack doing lance charge, and axes/swords in melee of course.
    In fact I think all eastern cavalry must carry the bow
    Funny, even vanilla game has man_lance_bow_cavalry animation, but no units to use it

    As for Persians, I can make some of those units. We can just divide the rest of rooster if you want

    As for barding: I read about leather/padded armour of heavy cavalrymen, but at earlier period.
    At Russian Wiki (I don't know if it's the same text in English Wiki) I read that most of Sassanian cataphracts had mail armour, some of them - lamellar. Horse - scale or mail armour.

    Also I'm working with Armenian unit names.
    In next subversion I maybe will make some changes with this.
    Of course "cataphract" is false name.
    What I found at the moment:

    Aspatak is light/medium cavalry.
    Azat and Nakharars are heavy nobles
    Ezela or Ezelak - medium/heavy cavalry archers
    Vostanik - royal guard
    Mardpetakan - court guard

    It's too many heavy cavalry as for me, but it' good if there will be army caps

  20. #40

    Default Re: [SubMod] Armenian Faction. v0.2

    This is beautiful

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