blockading ports useful in EB2?

**Thuycidides** · September 21, 2014, 07:38 AM

In EB1 it was pointless to blockade enemy ports because AI factions could not run out of money. Has this changed in EB2? Thanks!

**V.T. Marvin** · September 21, 2014, 09:13 AM

AI will still get money by the script IF they drop into negative treasury so if they are afloat despite the blockade it DOES reduce their freely usable money. Also blockades cause unrest so they need to watch their blockaded settlements more so no. Therefore in sum, it 's not totally pointless to blockade them. And it is a good role-play anyway.

**Thuycidides** · September 21, 2014, 03:27 PM

Good role play, but expensive, too. Thank you for our help.

**QuintusSertorius** · September 21, 2014, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Thuycidides

Good role play, but expensive, too. Thank you for our help.

Not as expensive as it was in EB1, given ships have upkeep of around 1/4 of what it was there.

**mr mojo risin** · September 21, 2014, 08:22 PM

it would be wise not to disregard the sea in eb2.

**Rad** · September 22, 2014, 12:35 AM

You should definitely invest in your navy. I played a few VH/VH campaigns as Carthage against Rome in order to learn how to "tame the beast". Rome and probably other big factions tend to build a lot of ships and use them properly, which is awesome. If you can't keep up with them, you'll get blockaded, invaded by them and your troops will be lost at sea. Now I block almost all Italian ports and the AI really seems stopped dead in its tracks.

**Kull** · September 22, 2014, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by Rad

You should definitely invest in your navy. I played a few VH/VH campaigns as Carthage against Rome in order to learn how to "tame the beast". Rome and probably other big factions tend to build a lot of ships and use them properly, which is awesome. If you can't keep up with them, you'll get blockaded, invaded by them and your troops will be lost at sea. Now I block almost all Italian ports and the AI really seems stopped dead in its tracks.

Unfortunately you seem to have found a way to "break the AI" with this strategy. Don't fault you for doing it, but it's not something we playtested during the design phase, probably because it simply wasn't a strategy that one could actually employ during this time period.

Would be interested in thoughts (from anyone) as to how this could be countered without breaking a portion of the game which seems to work exceptionally well in all other areas.

**mr mojo risin** · September 22, 2014, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by Kull

Unfortunately you seem to have found a way to "break the AI" with this strategy. Don't fault you for doing it, but it's not something we playtested during the design phase, probably because it simply wasn't a strategy that one could actually employ during this time period.

Would be interested in thoughts (from anyone) as to how this could be countered without breaking a portion of the game which seems to work exceptionally well in all other areas.

depends what he means by 'dead in its tracks'...iv blocked many an AI factions ports but never seen it become crippled by it.

**Kull** · September 22, 2014, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by mr mojo risin

depends what he means by 'dead in its tracks'...iv blocked many an AI factions ports but never seen it become crippled by it.

Need confirmation, but I think the AI will not build navies in a blockaded port. So if you are facing an aggressive faction with a powerful navy, one solution is to defeat them at sea and then use less costly ships to blockade and stop it from building more ships. Not historical, certainly.

**V.T. Marvin** · September 23, 2014, 03:47 AM

Not completly unreasonable though. For instance there has nt always been enough ship-building material available locally - for instance almost all Athenian timber in the classical period was imported from Macedonia so one can see a scenario where a faction that lost control of the seas once was subsequently unable to rebuild or only with difficulty. And that's what happens.

BTW in RTW AI did occasionally build a new ship/fleet in a blockaded port so it may do so in M2TW:K as well...

**Rad** · September 23, 2014, 04:11 AM

Originally Posted by Kull

Unfortunately you seem to have found a way to "break the AI" with this strategy. Don't fault you for doing it, but it's not something we playtested during the design phase, probably because it simply wasn't a strategy that one could actually employ during this time period.

Would be interested in thoughts (from anyone) as to how this could be countered without breaking a portion of the game which seems to work exceptionally well in all other areas.

Originally Posted by Kull

Need confirmation, but I think the AI will not build navies in a blockaded port. So if you are facing an aggressive faction with a powerful navy, one solution is to defeat them at sea and then use less costly ships to blockade and stop it from building more ships. Not historical, certainly.

1. After I defeated their navy and blocked their ports, as if they stopped paying attention to me pillaging southern Italy. They just went north. I had Rhegion, Arpi and Capua... absolutely no interruptions from them. However, I left Tarentum alone because I thought it wasn't worth taking... troops did amass there and maybe that was the cause of it all.

2. They did build more ships after I blocked their ports... they would also leave the blockaded port *they could do that in 2 turns, 1 to wiggle away from the blockade the second to actually move*, but I sank them as soon as they were on open sea.

**Thuycidides** · September 23, 2014, 04:45 AM

Originally Posted by Kull

Need confirmation, but I think the AI will not build navies in a blockaded port. So if you are facing an aggressive faction with a powerful navy, one solution is to defeat them at sea and then use less costly ships to blockade and stop it from building more ships. Not historical, certainly.

The AI will build navies in a blockaded port. I've seen it firsthand.

**mr mojo risin** · September 23, 2014, 06:02 AM

Originally Posted by Rad

1. After I defeated their navy and blocked their ports, as if they stopped paying attention to me pillaging southern Italy. They just went north. I had Rhegion, Arpi and Capua... absolutely no interruptions from them. However, I left Tarentum alone because I thought it wasn't worth taking... troops did amass there and maybe that was the cause of it all.

2. They did build more ships after I blocked their ports... they would also leave the blockaded port *they could do that in 2 turns, 1 to wiggle away from the blockade the second to actually move*, but I sank them as soon as they were on open sea.

how many turn in to the campaign are we talking here?

**dogukan** · September 23, 2014, 06:47 AM

Is it possible then to limit the amount of fleets/ships a faction can build?

**QuintusSertorius** · September 23, 2014, 07:05 AM

Originally Posted by dogukan

Is it possible then to limit the amount of fleets/ships a faction can build?

They're still subject to the usual limits on pool refresh, and indeed access based on port buildings.

**Rad** · September 23, 2014, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by mr mojo risin

how many turn in to the campaign are we talking here?

Most of the action was between turns 40-50. Rome attacked in 264 BC... like clockwork, I liked that. After the Celtiberians attacked, I decided to end the war with Rome. Gave them some gold and Arpi back, and sailed west... but I got a weird freeze after a big battle against the CBs... When I have more time, I'll load a save and play some more.

**mr mojo risin** · September 23, 2014, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by Rad

Most of the action was between turns 40-50. Rome attacked in 264 BC... like clockwork, I liked that. After the Celtiberians attacked, I decided to end the war with Rome. Gave them some gold and Arpi back, and sailed west... but I got a weird freeze after a big battle against the CBs... When I have more time, I'll load a save and play some more.

yes this is still early in campaign, there is an imbalance to rome... the rebel settlements to rome's north are weak and they see that taking them is a better option than fighting you, {even to there detriment}
i would not start a proper war with rome or iberia until all the rebel settlements have been swallowed up then the AI turns its focus to matters in hand so to speak ..

**Rad** · September 23, 2014, 10:53 AM

I loaded the save game, it was turn 58. The war with Rome was over, I turned towards Spain. I guess I have the habbit of trying to destroy enemies as soon as they declare war. The whole draw out the game concept is new to me.

**Kull** · September 23, 2014, 11:43 AM

Originally Posted by Rad

2. They did build more ships after I blocked their ports... they would also leave the blockaded port *they could do that in 2 turns, 1 to wiggle away from the blockade the second to actually move*, but I sank them as soon as they were on open sea.

OK, that is working at least.

**mr mojo risin** · September 23, 2014, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by Rad

I loaded the save game, it was turn 58. The war with Rome was over, I turned towards Spain. I guess I have the habbit of trying to destroy enemies as soon as they declare war. The whole draw out the game concept is new to me.

yes the AI needs to build up , i can wipe a lot of factions out {or into horde} within 20-30 turns if i want to regardless of CAI{but then whats the point im always gonna be smarter than the AI},...but if you let them build the rewards are better you will get some nice stack battles that can be very epic,.... so the house rule is slow build = better game latter on.