Hypocrisy

[Farnan]

Am I the only one who sees the hypocracy in this forum? Its okay to bash America, but if you bash France you're an ignorant redneck hick who does it because its popular.

[Tom Paine]

I see no bashing of America. I see a lot of people who think that "bashing" Bush, or even Bush's policies, is the same as bashing America. I also see a lot of tolerance of bashing other countries (I advise we take a look at some "older" threads, such as the strongest EU army one) by members. So...

[Sidus Preclarum]

"Hypocracy" ? "low governement" ? is that a subtle attack on the mods ? :p
More seriously, what TGS said: bashing a governement's actions (resp some individuals' behaviour) is different from bashing a country, though the line is difficult to draw (especially if someone doesn't pick his words carefully) when, for exemple, such actions are supported by (resp said individual's are ) a majority in said country...

[Miraj]

Am I the only one who sees the hypocracy in this forum? Its okay to bash America, but if you bash France you're an ignorant redneck hick who does it because its popular.

Well its not the fact that one bashes a country its WHY they bash a country.

For example:

Reason Americans are bashed:
Illegal invasion resulting in 500,000 Iraqi civilians killed and a nation utterly destroyed

Reason French are bashed:
NOT JOINING an illegal invasion resulting in 500,000 Iraqi civilians killed and a nation utterly destroyed


You see there is a huge difference between why the two are bashed.

[Farnan]

The only thing America obtains information by geography(which their obviously bad at it) is by war.

Here is an example that I noticed, but there are many occassions when Americans are called stupid or ignorant and the like, especially on the geography thread.

I have nothing against bashing our government, but when you bash Americans based on a comic's interview of people then I have a problem.

Edit: This is not about mods but about how people react to the bash of each nation in a completely different way.

[RZZZA]

The only practical answer is to make Farnan a mod and let him crack down on America bashing. Theyre already expanding on moderators, many times theyre even noobs in the community, and Farnan is surely no noob.

Farnan for mod! He's no noob.

[LoZz]

yer when people bash france on these forums, its directed at its people and culture, which you shouldnt bash,
when people bash america their not bashing its people or the country itselfs, 99% its of its goverment and policys, and bashing someones goverment is ok, after all its part of democracy isnt it to talk about goverments and isnt that was america stands for, democracy? now thats hypocracy! I am not gonna lie, sometimes bashing of america's culture or people does happen but that happens to every nation now and again and to be fare if you can't take it, dont dish it out

Here is an example that I noticed, but there are many occassions when Americans are called stupid or ignorant and the like, especially on the geography thread.

I have nothing against bashing our government, but when you bash Americans based on a comic's interview of people then I have a problem.

Edit: This is not about mods but about how people react to the bash of each nation in a completely different way.

right and how many times have we seen americans post equaly stupid facts about europe and other nations? dont give what you cant take

[Farnan]

Here it is, as I said if anyone bashes France, 20 people jump them from different countries and talk how France is good and they shouldn't bash it, but on the other hand if people make fun of Americans than the only people defending them are a few Americans. I don't mind if you make fun of Americans if its also okay to make fun of France and other countries...

Edit: Just so you know I don't make fun of France or any other nation or culture.

[RZZZA]

....it is okay to make fun of other countries, but what country other than France, the U.S. (and sometimes Canada) do people get the urge to make fun of? None. Go ahead, make a joke about Africa thats funnier than it is offensive, I dare you. You can't do it.

edit: and btw, the word is Hypocrisy, you stupid American.

[Farnan]

Sorry, spelling is not my forte...

As I said, the problem is that its not okay to make fun of France according to some people, who consequently believe its good and fine to make fun of America...

[RZZZA]

Well I think it all depends on context, what are you making fun of France/the U.S. for? As always I think if you manage to make it more funny than it is offensive, itll go over well.

Americans actually like people who poke fun at us, look at Stephen Colbert. Look at Sacha Baron Cohen.

[LoZz]

Sorry, spelling is not my forte...

As I said, the problem is that its not okay to make fun of France according to some people, who consequently believe its good and fine to make fun of America...

Who? can you actualy quote more then 1 or 2 guys who have bashed america in one topic and defended france in another. and not in self defence of france, in diffrent topics

[Farnan]

Saying "French rifle for sale never been fired, dropped once" will many times illicit dozens of responses on how ignorant the commentor is.

Saying "Americans are stupid" however will get a few people to contest that, but many others trying to prove how the commentor was right.

[RZZZA]

Saying "French rifle for sale never been fired, dropped once" will many times illicit dozens of responses on how ignorant the commentor is.

Heh heh...well I'd defend that, I think its a joke and its funny. But this...

Saying "Americans are stupid" however will get a few people to contest that, but many others trying to prove how the commentor was right.

Is not a joke, its not meant to be funny, its just an insult and a general flame and would warrant mod action. If people want to poke fun of America I say do it, but put a little more effort into it.

[Tom Paine]

Saying "French rifle for sale never been fired, dropped once" will many times illicit dozens of responses on how ignorant the commentor is.

No, it'll get noted as french-bashing and mostly a moderator will say get the topic back on, well, topic, as they are used as standalone posts in serious topics.

Saying "Americans are stupid" however will get a few people to contest that, but many others trying to prove how the commentor was right.

No, it'll get mainly ignored as bs, being part of a post in a serious topic which doesn't take the thread offtpic.

[Erik]

Bashing countries is OK, bashing people based on their nationality boarders on racism.

And somebody HAD to post this:

[Sétanta]

Hypocrisy. Well, I can see both sides to this (or rather two of many sides). It is rather hypocritical to allow very harsh criticism of America, and not France. And yes, America is covered by bashing Bush and the Govevernment of the United States because those two things were both selected by the collective will of the American people.

However, usually criticism of France is completely unjustified and factually innacurate, not to mention very offensive to Frenchmen because of the bashing of the French citizen incorporated in most anti-france posts. Criticism of the United States is generally thrown at the Government, instead of the American people.

[LoZz]

Hypocrisy. Well, I can see both sides to this (or rather two of many sides). It is rather hypocritical to allow very harsh criticism of America, and not France. And yes, America is covered by bashing Bush and the Govevernment of the United States because those two things were both selected by the collective will of the American people.

However, usually criticism of France is completely unjustified and factually innacurate, not to mention very offensive to Frenchmen because of the bashing of the French citizen incorporated in most anti-france posts. Criticism of the United States is generally thrown at the Government, instead of the American people.

i was trying to say that, couldnt find the words, but yer what this guy said!

[Erik]

The most hypocrite people here are the Americans who think it's OK to bash France, but then get all offended when people bash their country.

[Crimson Scythe]

I don't think Americans are stupid at all, or at the very least no more so than any average European. And Americans are just as ignorant as Europeans on most things, but because America often acts on it (which Europe isn't powerful enough to do to the same degree), this ignorance is often a little more obvious.

I do think that Americans are naive about the state of the world, as much as Canadians are. Heck as much as any citizen of the Americas is (including South Americans, to a lesser extent). This is thanks to geography. Americans don't often have world issues exploding in their. The US has 2 borders, one with Canada (not really a border in the traditional sense) and one with Mexico. And that's it. And neither of these countries is that volatile. Mexico, maybe a little, and Americans are fairly well informed about Mexican politics because it directly affects them. But European or Middle Eastern politics? Forget it. It's just too far away for the average person to care about it. The social and economic elite will, since it will affect them, but the average person on the street couldn't care less. Until something like 9-11 happens, that is. Then Americans are shocked because it seems like it came out of nowhere.

The US's problem is that a small element cares too much about what is going on in the world, and the rest don't care enough (until it directly affects them, hence the media's important role in US perceptions of the world). If a balance is reached, the world's perception of the US will probably be more like its perception of the EU. Well, maybe. :wink: