Trade in the year 1000

[Asean]

Map showing the largest cities and major trade routes that went on in the year 1000. Roughly around the time M2TW takes place.

[Matty_P]

cool map!

clicking to enlarge really helps!

[imb39]

Hmmm... I'd never have guessed that a city in the Iberian peninsula was the largest city in the world at that time (well, thought to be).

[JANOSIK007]

Hmmm... I'd never have guessed that a city in the Iberian peninsula was the largest city in the world at that time (well, thought to be).

same here

I have heard that Cordoba was one of the biggest. Other surprises: 8 of the top 15 cities were Islamic, all that land of Viking kingdoms had only 1-2 million people (I guess they were lucky no one else knew), HRE had 35 mil (seems a lot), Byzanium wasn't the biggest city (a little surprising), The entire Islamic region, which is the biggest on the map by far, has only 60 mil. (not even twice the HRE population and yet they have 8 of the top 15 cities), what else...

excelent map

[Gunfreak]

same here

I have heard that Cordoba was one of the biggest. Other surprises: 8 of the top 15 cities were Islamic, all that land of Viking kingdoms had only 1-2 million people (I guess they were lucky no one else knew), HRE had 35 mil (seems a lot), Byzanium wasn't the biggest city (a little surprising), The entire Islamic region, which is the biggest on the map by far, has only 60 mil. (not even twice the HRE population and yet they have 8 of the top 15 cities), what else...

excelent map

even to day there's only about 18.5 million people in scandinavia, with Sweden having 9 million, Denmark with 5 and Norway with 4.5

[JANOSIK007]

What about Fins 5 mil?

So that's 19 compared to Bohemia's 10. Back then it was more or less reversed. It's hard to get estimates for population at that time for current countries or different kingdoms at that time.

[Gaius Julius]

Beautiful map. Absolutely beautiful. What book is this from? I must have.

[Asean]

Beautiful map. Absolutely beautiful. What book is this from? I must have.

I forgot where, but I found it online. If you look closely, you could see some sources cited. So it's most likely from U.S. News & World Report magazine, not sure which issue.

[JANOSIK007]

bumping it up for the benefit of this community

are there similar maps for subsequent centuries?

[CIaagent11]

Funny. I read somewhere the mongols were 200.000 people.
They conquered gigantic areas with millions of people.

[Nikko0102]

^really? that's intersting, with the empire they controled that must've been like 1 mongol per 100 squarekilometer.

[alpaca]

I found the article to that map (there's not that much additional info though): http://www.usnews.com/usnews/culture...e_002665_3.htm

[CIaagent11]

^really? that's intersting, with the empire they controled that must've been like 1 mongol per 100 squarekilometer.

But I didnt make this up.
This is from the german wikipedia. Sorry, the english one doesn't say it.

Trotz ihrer geringen Zahl (um 1200 ca. 200.000) spielten die Mongolen eine herausragende Rolle in der Weltgeschichte.

It says, there were 200.000 in the year 1200.

[Ludicus]

imb39 wrote:

Hmmm... I'd never have guessed that a city in the Iberian peninsula was the largest city in the world at that time (well, thought to be).

Well,quoting my previous post,another thread - about the Iberian Peninsula:

Cordoba was the capital of Muslim Spain. It soon became the center for all light and learning for the entire Europe. Scholars and students from various parts of the world and Europe came to Cordoba to study. The contrast in intellectual activity is demonstrated best by one example: ‘In the ninth century, the library of the monastery of St. Gall was the largest in Europe. It boasted 36 volumes. At the same time, that of Cordoba contained over 500,000!’.


The Arabic rule began with the conquest of 711 and lasted until 1492.
During those 700 years, the peninsula was home to often conflicting but also intensely interactive cultures, the Islamic, the Christian and the Jewish, whose interwoven fates during this period can still be seen in the literary and artistic legacy they left to us in architecture, art, mathematics, philosophy, science and literature. Those achievements set the cultural level of medieval Spain and Portugal far above that of the west of western Europe.

[Tovi]

Mongols were "only" 200.000, but all together on the same place

[AlfonsoVIII]

By looking at this map, can we assume that the Russian faction should be more Viking based that what M2TW portrays them as?

[Sher Khan]

They were definately viking based.

But so were the Normans. When they were christinized, they adopted a few Catholic and Orthodox cultures while retaining a small sense of viking-like ideologue. Really though, the vikings were more about trade (if somewhat bullied trade) and 'molding' into European society seemed an obvious choice for rulers. Conversion to Christianity was a apart of that it seems.


Anyway... absolutely wonderful map! Certainly, there must be a thread or other maps someone here can link us to? Fascinating find, my friend!

[JANOSIK007]

By the time game begins Rus are Slavic in culture, language, customs, etc. The few scandinavians who settled in Rus' lands could not rule this vast land alone. In short time they became Russified and Orthodox.

Just because the map shows viking influence extended along Dnieper doesn't mean that they ruled that land. At least not as an isolated ethnic group of norsemen. What happened with viking settlers in Rus is similar to Turkish Bulgar in Balkans. Through intermarriage with daughters of local slavic lords, this process was sped up in the case of vikings.

[Hells Bells]

hmm this just seems wrong to me, i heard that the pop of constantinople was 500k + (guess the map guys didnt count slaves etc.), i also find it hard to believe that moslem cities were more populous than chinese cities. i had heard that the farther east you got the more people per sq mile, (the steppes dont count). At the same time that they were playing around in corduba the chinese were inventing gunpowder.
In the east it was much different than in the west, a few bad centuries never stopped learning art, philosophy etc. since they were important in everyones daily life. And assuming they could read, anyone could have a millenia of classics to browse through.

and im pretty sure that constantinople held alot more books and stuff than corduba, and they were also a mix of jews moslems and christians, and whatever else, plus everything they had accumulated throughout the 1000 years it lasted. How long did corduba last?
not that long is for sure.

and what about tenochitlan? or wasnt that built by then?


vikings have only a few mil cuz their like a wasteland up there, all cold and icy, which is why they went on those long ocean voyages, nothing to do at home. 1-2 mil was over the carrying capacity of the land there, also why they colonised lots of places.

and the mongols would keep their army as a mobile force, they can get bureacrats from the local, just so long as they dont revolt who gives a damn. They also interbred alot with the locals, since theirs were so ugly.

they forgot taoism for china? and they dont distinguish between the different sects of christianity, orthodox, catholic etc. or islam for that matter