[Official] Reform requirements - as at 2.3

[Floren d'Asteneuz]

Hi Simplicity, (and dev team if you are still reading this thread)

Just so you know, in the v2.05, the Saka reform seems broken. First stage works fine, and when you have three cities, it triggers. But then it seems that the second reform tries to trigger also. The second reform building tries to pop in the bulding choices of some of the settlements, and if you click to construct them, some of them will go on and some other will stay in the building queue indefinately. If you destroy the builded one, you cannot build them anymore. And more : if you wait for 40 turns, nothings triggers, and if you wait for 40 years (yeah, I DID IT !!!) nothing triggers either, even though I have L3 farms.

[QuintusSertorius]

Hi Simplicity, (and dev team if you are still reading this thread)

Just so you know, in the v2.05, the Saka reform seems broken. First stage works fine, and when you have three cities, it triggers. But then it seems that the second reform tries to trigger also. The second reform building tries to pop in the bulding choices of some of the settlements, and if you click to construct them, some of them will go on and some other will stay in the building queue indefinately. If you destroy the builded one, you cannot build them anymore. And more : if you wait for 40 turns, nothings triggers, and if you wait for 40 years (yeah, I DID IT !!!) nothing triggers either, even though I have L3 farms.

Sorry, I did see this (I read almost everything on this forum), and forwarded a note to Gigantus to take a look a few days ago. He's reviewing and it will be fixed, he's already identified the likely cause of the break.

[Floren d'Asteneuz]

Sorry, I did see this (I read almost everything on this forum), and forwarded a note to Gigantus to take a look a few days ago. He's reviewing and it will be fixed, he's already identified the likely cause of the break.

That's great ! I will report here the result of my tests when it will be implemented (for the sake of the thread), and notice you in private also.

[AncalagonBlack]

Sorry, I did see this (I read almost everything on this forum), and forwarded a note to Gigantus to take a look a few days ago. He's reviewing and it will be fixed, he's already identified the likely cause of the break.

So can we hope in finding the bug resolved on the next patch (most likely the 2.05d)? I'm eager to use saka rauka on my next game...I absolutely love horse archer!

[QuintusSertorius]

So can we hope in finding the bug resolved on the next patch (most likely the 2.05d)? I'm eager to use saka rauka on my next game...I absolutely love horse archer!

Yes, we think we've fixed it, though as always need feedback of people playing it.

One other important note on Saka in 2.06 - their post-reform government buildings now give local units, as their description implies, but wasn't previously delivered upon. Which not only adds to the feel of them settling and taking on Persian modes of rulership, but gives some much-needed variety too. So when you take India or Baktria or the Seleukid domains, you'll have native troops at your disposal (including Greeks in the right places).

[Floren d'Asteneuz]

Yes, we think we've fixed it, though as always need feedback of people playing it.

One other important note on Saka in 2.06 - their post-reform government buildings now give local units, as their description implies, but wasn't previously delivered upon. Which not only adds to the feel of them settling and taking on Persian modes of rulership, but gives some much-needed variety too. So when you take India or Baktria or the Seleukid domains, you'll have native troops at your disposal (including Greeks in the right places).

- First reform : works. Reminder : you have to have the faction leader having the "settled" trait for the first reform. Will change your faction's culture.
- Second reform : works : in addition to the 40 turns, the 2nd reform need faction leader with "settled" trait and the faction owning 10 settlements and l3 (?) Farms. Will change your faction's culture again in a third culture.
- Third reform : not exactly a "reform" per se, in fact, since it allow you to place a building to act as your "capital" in the settlement of your choice. It "works" but it is still bugged a bit. Here are the conditions : If your faction leader has 4 or more authority, OR, if the faction is owning 19 settlments, THEN one turn at least after the second reform, the faction will have a "royal domain" building, emulating a "capital".

Problems :
- First reform : footmen (axemen and archers) and light horse archers are only recruitable in steppe nomad settlements, no more in the "settled" settlements, wher you can only recruit nobles or light lancers. Second reform will allow to recruit local armies, resolving partially the problem. "Royal domain" building possibly allow you to recruit every faction's unit.
- Second reform : Nothing for now.
- Third reform : triggers in a chaotic way. I had mine in the same turn as the first reform, discarded it. Triggers more than once (at least two) and the second one, if you try to build the "royal domain" building again in an other settlement, it will stay forever in the construction queue, and if you remove it, it will disappear. (the disappearance is normal, see "tips")

Tips :
- First reform :
--- To have the wooden palissade (settled instead of nomad) needed for this reform, you have to build the "Large scale farming" building. This building cannot be build if you have the "Live stock herd" (or it's evolution) or "Warlord Court" (or it's evolution). When you'll have the "Large scale farming" building, you'll be able to convert your nomad settlement to a permanent settled community.
--- Since you'll not be able to recruit any footmen in any native settlement, you'll have to relly on mercenaries and on your nomad settlements. I didn't try "allied settlement" but it could be a solution.
--- Culture influence is very slow and you'll have to face disorder. Be prepared.

- Second reform :
--- Nothing for now.

- Third reform :
--- Warning : the "royal domain" building can be build only once, at least for now. Meaning : if you click on it and then remove it from your building queue, You Will Not Be Able To rebuild It Again. Chose your emplacement wisely, and then click on it, but Not Before Saving. If it shows before it should (when the first reform is triggered for instance) I strongly suggest not to click on it and wait for the second reform to trigger, and wait one turn at least, and then click on it. If a second one is showing, I suggest not to click on it.

Conclusion : Since Quitus told me the 2.06a will come soon with a correction, my suggestion would be to wait for it before starting a Saka campaign. But if you wish to start now, the reforms here works almost perfectly and the flaws found in game (hole in the faction troop recruitement pool, 3rd reform glytching) can be avoided with little efforts or can be managed easily.

Take care, everyone.

Note :
- Bug report (not critical) : Chighu start with a "trader (western greek)".
- Bug report (not critical) lots of "placeholder" images. Including roads when in the building pool (but not in the construction queue nor in the building list when build)
- lots of regions descriptions missing in the saka area.
- Will edit if something new come up.

[Genghis Skahn]

Just out of curiosity, will the Boii or Arevaci be getting any reform events of their own? Or is there no history to support these events???

[Trarco]

Just out of curiosity, will the Boii or Arevaci be getting any reform events of their own? Or is there no history to support these events???

In the future, Arevaci may get a reform that represents that Celtiberians became a Polis-type society with Senates, assemblies and magistrates but with their native features and their humble capacities.

[Sylon]

Boii share the same reform events as the Aedui and Arverni. Arevaci might get a new reform, depending on what our new Iberian historian designs.

[Genghis Skahn]

Boii share the same reform events as the Aedui and Arverni. Arevaci might get a new reform, depending on what our new Iberian historian designs.

I thought so. Can the main post possibly be edited to say Aedui, Arverni and Boii then? To prevent future confusion? Theyre not listed with the other factions on the OP yet

[Simpelicity]

Hey Floren!

Quintus was reading this a lot more than me for a while there. Hasn't manifested himself yet though. I'll write it down as possibly broken until we get more info. Thanks though

[Floren d'Asteneuz]

Hey Floren!

Quintus was reading this a lot more than me for a while there. Hasn't manifested himself yet though. I'll write it down as possibly broken until we get more info. Thanks though

Thanks dude !

I will try to contact those people in private but I doubt it will work.

[Ribtickler]

Quick question. Do sieges count as battles won for the roman reforms? Or does it have to be an open battle?

[Barnabas]

Do sieges count as battles won for the Hayasdan reforms? Or does it have to be an open battle?

[QuintusSertorius]

Quick question. Do sieges count as battles won for the roman reforms? Or does it have to be an open battle?

Do sieges count as battles won for the Hayasdan reforms? Or does it have to be an open battle?

In both instances I'd have to check with Gig - I suspect not. For the Roman one it has to have at least 11 units on the enemy side; at least 5 of these against Carthage and at least 4 in Cisapline Gaul. And it has to be at least turn 101.

[myarta]

In 2 or 3 playthroughs, I've never been able to successfully achieve that. Probably because there aren't enough stacks of rebels in Cisalpine Gaul to fight. And the rebels are so strong, the Celts never take over those provinces. I get plenty of Carthaginian battles, but even freshly spawned Rebel stacks after I've conquered CAG don't have enough units to count. Usually the enemy has one or two full stacks adjacent to each other, so fighting that battle counts as only 'one', then their survivors only have 10 units, or something. I may just custom edit my script to avoid that criteria or only require 2 or something when I do my Autumn playthrough since the fallback turn is many many many hours and I'd like to see Polybians at least once in EB2.

[QuintusSertorius]

In 2 or 3 playthroughs, I've never been able to successfully achieve that. Probably because there aren't enough stacks of rebels in Cisalpine Gaul to fight. And the rebels are so strong, the Celts never take over those provinces. I get plenty of Carthaginian battles, but even freshly spawned Rebel stacks after I've conquered CAG don't have enough units to count. Usually the enemy has one or two full stacks adjacent to each other, so fighting that battle counts as only 'one', then their survivors only have 10 units, or something. I may just custom edit my script to avoid that criteria or only require 2 or something when I do my Autumn playthrough since the fallback turn is many many many hours and I'd like to see Polybians at least once in EB2.

Note there's a "fallback" trigger for the Polybian reforms in 210BC if the player fails to trigger them earlier. Otherwise they won't happen before 247BC anyway. So the only thing the battles-related requirements do is allow you to get them earlier than 210BC when they'd happen automaticaly.

[Ribtickler]

The cisalpine rebel stacks always invade Roma land, leaving you no choice but to fight them on land tiles that don't count towards the reform. Leaving it impossible to achieve in northern Italy. I suppose the solution for a player is to hire mercs and take on the rebels before they head south. Something I havn`t tried yet.

[QuintusSertorius]

The cisalpine rebel stacks always invade Roma land, leaving you no choice but to fight them on land tiles that don't count towards the reform. Leaving it impossible to achieve in northern Italy. I suppose the solution for a player is to hire mercs and take on the rebels before they head south. Something I havn`t tried yet.

Then you have to wait for 210BC. The reform will happen then regardless, you just won't get it early.

[Hummer]

Then you have to wait for 210BC. The reform will happen then regardless, you just won't get it early.

Haha, that's what I always do. I simply turtle along and eventually get the reform. It seems everybody else is in a hurry. Not sure why.

Especially since the Polybian units don't even have their proper models skinned yet... Is that not correct? I believe they currently use the same model as the Camillians.... Do they not?...