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Thread: [Official] Reform requirements - as at 2.3

  1. #301

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaj View Post
    Umm, has someone managed to get the reform since the change?

    I had defeated two galatian armies within the conditions and I just defeated a Seleucid full stack and I got a message about my conquers of the barbaraoi and victory over the Seleucids. I thought that was the reform but I dont notice any effects.

    Shouldnt I be able to build some new goverment and get new units?
    It should unlock the Basilike Patris (pergamon7) government building. Which might not seem like much, but it opens up the full building tree. However, you haven't triggered it until you've had the third message declaring you a kingdom. You need three of those notifications to trigger it.

    No new units, Pergamon enjoys the same military reforms as all the other Hellenistic factions, rather than a separate system of their own.

  2. #302

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    I'll see if I can test the Pergamon reform out later today. It sounds like the reform triggered properly. It may just be that the additional units have not yet been added.

    Did the reform trigger give you any new government types to build? Sometimes the new units are contained in new building options.

  3. #303

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by QuintusSertorius View Post
    It should unlock the Basilike Patris (pergamon7) government building. Which might not seem like much, but it opens up the full building tree. However, you haven't triggered it until you've had the third message declaring you a kingdom. You need three of those notifications to trigger it.

    No new units, Pergamon enjoys the same military reforms as all the other Hellenistic factions, rather than a separate system of their own.
    Umm, so they lack any kind of heavy cavalry apart from generals. I thought it will come with the higher buildings.
    What does then the different eras change then?
    Last edited by Jervaj; July 25, 2015 at 05:11 PM.

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  4. #304

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by adun12345 View Post
    I'll see if I can test the Pergamon reform out later today. It sounds like the reform triggered properly. It may just be that the additional units have not yet been added.

    Did the reform trigger give you any new government types to build? Sometimes the new units are contained in new building options.
    There are no new units unless you build the highest-tier government. That's the only impact of the reform, to unlock the pergamon7.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaj View Post
    Umm, so they lack any kind of heavy cavalry apart from generals. I thought it will come with the higher buildings.
    What does then the eras thing change?
    Sorry, I'm forgetting Hetairoi are unlocked by pergamon7, so yes, there is a new unit.

    The eras do nothing at all; it's been superceded by the Hellenistic Military Reforms for all Hellenistic factions.

  5. #305

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Yay heitaroi. Just what their roster lacked haha.

    And that is planned to change (the eras) or will the hellenistic military reforms be kept in the autnm release format?

    About the reform, for some reason theres something Im doing wrong. I only got the message I said and I ahd already defeated two gallatian armies meeting the requirements. And know I defeated two big seleucid armies last turn and still no new message. I had a FM leading the army and had 1600 and 1061 troops in each battle. And they were 3/4 of a stack both times.

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  6. #306
    Biarchus
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    Default Re: Reform requirements

    To the OP. Under the KH reform, you have Chalkis listed as a city you can get a leader for. I believe that city was in EB but not EB2(minor settlement). Is there a leader trait for this fictional city? I'm also not recognizing the names Mytilene and Kydonia, are they in the same boat as Chalkis?

  7. #307

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by Hummer View Post
    To the OP. Under the KH reform, you have Chalkis listed as a city you can get a leader for. I believe that city was in EB but not EB2(minor settlement). Is there a leader trait for this fictional city? I'm also not recognizing the names Mytilene and Kydonia, are they in the same boat as Chalkis?
    Haha I'm not the only one able to answer that question, no need to address it to me ^.^

    I did not confuse the settlements with EB1. I ripped all that info from the codes of EBII. I don't have the time to double-check how exactly I did it, but I'm pretty sure I just searched for the info of what cities you can be a leader of and then copied all of them here. Best guess is you can be leader of cities that are not settlements. It's tied to ethnicity after all, not settlements you own. I copied them and called them settlements without realising some of them weren't settlements.

    iirc, isn't Kydonia across the Mediterranean? Not sure if it's still a settlement, but I think it's there, in the east horn of Africa. I recognise Mytilene as a name as well, but can't place it off the top of my head. An island I think. Either that or Anatolia, but I think it's the isles. Maybe Krete?

  8. #308

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Kydonia is on Krete - it's been replaced with Knossos.

    Chalkis no longer exists as a full settlement, it's the minor settlement on the island to the east of Athenai. Mytilene is also no longer a settlement - it's been replaced by Ephesos.

  9. #309

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    so if I get this straight, Chalkis is no longer a possible leader, and I should replace Kydonia and Mytilene with Ephesos and Knossos?

  10. #310

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpelicity View Post
    so if I get this straight, Chalkis is no longer a possible leader, and I should replace Kydonia and Mytilene with Ephesos and Knossos?
    Yes. I'd have to go back and check what, if anything, Chalkis has been replaced with in the script.

  11. #311

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Ok, I have been thinking it through and I have found two possible reasons I may not be getting the reform with pergamon.

    One is that the battles dont start to count until you have the provinced need because I defeated the galatian armies prior to the conquest of Ankyra.
    Second possibility is that the galatians armies where in my territory so they may have not counted due to the battle not taking palce in galatia.

    Still there is the mystery why only one of the 3 battles against the seleucids counted for the reform. Does the count only happen if the battles take place during the players turn?

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  12. #312
    delra's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Reform requirements

    What are you talking about. You get a message now every time you win a major battle that's "legit" for the reform. Just starting the game, take Sardis and then defeat the spawned stack of Alexandros, and you'll get such a message saying "Seleucids defeated!". Or march into Galatia and fight the large stack there, you'll be sent a message saying "Galatians defeated!". Three messages + owning proper cities = you're eligible for reform.

    Basically, assaulting Ankyra = no message = no point. Fighting outside of Galatia vs Eleutheroi = no message = no point. Fighting AS anywhere = message = point. Fighting Eleutheroi in Galatia but not those inside Ankyra = message = point.

    ("Fighting" defined as a battle with a large stack vs a large stack as stated in the OP.)

  13. #313

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Ah, I checked the script again; it's not just the battles. They're part of it, but you also need to own Nikaia, Pergamon, Sardis, Ipsos and Galatia.

  14. #314

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by delra View Post
    What are you talking about. You get a message now every time you win a major battle that's "legit" for the reform. Just starting the game, take Sardis and then defeat the spawned stack of Alexandros, and you'll get such a message saying "Seleucids defeated!". Or march into Galatia and fight the large stack there, you'll be sent a message saying "Galatians defeated!". Three messages + owning proper cities = you're eligible for reform.

    Basically, assaulting Ankyra = no message = no point. Fighting outside of Galatia vs Eleutheroi = no message = no point. Fighting AS anywhere = message = point. Fighting Eleutheroi in Galatia but not those inside Ankyra = message = point.

    ("Fighting" defined as a battle with a large stack vs a large stack as stated in the OP.)
    The problem is precisely that I defeated 3 AS stacks between 1600 and 2000 troops each and I only got one message.
    And also that in my campaign is problematic. Galatia is already clean and I dont border the seleucids at all. they were swiftly driven back by Hayasdan and Ptolemaics so to get the battles I had to cross 3 hayasdan provinces. I will prepare another expedition soon to try again

    Quote Originally Posted by [URL="http://www.twcenter.net/forums/member.php?36289-QuintusSertorius"
    QuintusSertorius[/URL]]Ah, I checked the script again; it's not just the battles. They're part of it, but you also need to own Nikaia, Pergamon, Sardis, Ipsos and Galatia.
    I have aall thsoe long ago.

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  15. #315
    delra's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Maybe your army was too small?

    Funny that you still need to "colonize" Pergamon itself in order to upgrade the government to the kingdom there. Another thing is, 21 settlements size is quite steep for this reform. It's like all of Asia Minor and Greece, so you don't get reformed until after you've already beaten everyone already. Maybe we could lower that a bit?
    Last edited by delra; July 26, 2015 at 09:10 AM.

  16. #316

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by delra View Post
    Maybe your army was too small?

    Funny that you still need to "colonize" Pergamon itself in order to upgrade the government to the kingdom there. Another thing is, 21 settlements size is quite steep for this reform. It's like all of Asia Minor and Greece, so you don't get reformed until after you've already beaten everyone already. Maybe we could lower that a bit?
    It's not 21 settlements for the reform, that's for the redundant Late Era. You need those five I listed above for the Kingship reform.

  17. #317

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    I kept track of it and in the last battle during the expedition (obviously the one with the smallest numbers) was 1061 units.
    In theory over 1000 is ok. Even if it were 1500 like for galatians the second battle should have gotten message as it was over 1600 troops there.

    The settlements number is for eras that for now seem to have 0 effect accoridng to what Quintus said.
    The good thing for Pergamon is that in asia minor theres already a lot of colonies, together with you having metropolis from the start and another bordering, so settlements are in general easy to hellenize except Gallatia and the one from Pontus that take a while due to the low starting levels.

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  18. #318

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    The number of troops is your army, not the enemy. For both Seleukids and Galatians, the requirement is 11 or more units.

    I'm going to lower it to 1000 for both - for the Galatian monitor it's currently 1500. You also have to defeat the Galatian army in Galatia.

  19. #319

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Those I posted were the numbers of my army indeed.

    The enemies were always 3/4 of stack so no problem of units there.

    The gallatian thing is clear because I fighted those stacks outside of galatia when they came in to Ipsos to atack me.

    The problem is the seleuicd thing. Seen everything is correct Im starting to believe more that it had to do with not been the players turn. As those two atacked my army, not the opposite.

    We will either find a way, or make one.


  20. #320

    Default Re: Reform requirements

    Quote Originally Posted by Jervaj View Post
    Those I posted were the numbers of my army indeed.

    The enemies were always 3/4 of stack so no problem of units there.

    The gallatian thing is clear because I fighted those stacks outside of galatia when they came in to Ipsos to atack me.

    The problem is the seleuicd thing. Seen everything is correct Im starting to believe more that it had to do with not been the players turn. As those two atacked my army, not the opposite.
    Possibly, I'm not entirely sure how the conditions work:

    Code:
    monitor_event PostBattle FactionType f_pergamon
    I suspect the FactionType condition means it has to be on that faction's turn.

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