Further increasing the AI recruitment behaviour

[Alu10]

Even though the AI recruitment behaviour in DeI is far better than vanilla behaviour, it really needs another improvement. I was under siege by 3 full stack Suebi armies, had 1 army in Mediolanum, 34 units total garrisoned. They attacked me and were utterly crushed. 500 lost men on my side 4000 enemies dead. This is an example and a sure thing -> the enemy needs to recruit better troops not levy units. And it is not the siege AI that led to this heroic victory nor my OP tactical skill. And the requirement to get "heroic victory" should be harder to get. you even get a heroic victory even if you win against a low tier enemy with a high tier army. The 1.0 version will do the balancing stuff but that might be even against the AI when they lose their levy magic armour. that would be a hugh hit on levy armies. i really shouldnt be too hard to force the AI to recruit the best units possible, when they recruit mercenaries that cost way more that those elite units they dont even try to recruit. i saw a carthagian army with 2 carthagian legionaries, the only time i saw high tier units in carthagian armies. the money shouldnt be the problem when they have the money to recruit and keep up mercenaries.. sure i play with rome now, they are OP so its natural that i own every other army. but when the AI is rome they get destroyed or stay in italy. i hoped that the name Rome 2 total war would make the roman AI strong.

[Litharion]

Even though the AI recruitment behaviour in DeI is far better than vanilla behaviour, it really needs another improvement. I was under siege by 3 full stack Suebi armies, had 1 army in Mediolanum, 34 units total garrisoned. They attacked me and were utterly crushed. 500 lost men on my side 4000 enemies dead. This is an example and a sure thing -> the enemy needs to recruit better troops not levy units. And it is not the siege AI that led to this heroic victory nor my OP tactical skill. And the requirement to get "heroic victory" should be harder to get. you even get a heroic victory even if you win against a low tier enemy with a high tier army. The 1.0 version will do the balancing stuff but that might be even against the AI when they lose their levy magic armour. that would be a hugh hit on levy armies. i really shouldnt be too hard to force the AI to recruit the best units possible, when they recruit mercenaries that cost way more that those elite units they dont even try to recruit. i saw a carthagian army with 2 carthagian legionaries, the only time i saw high tier units in carthagian armies. the money shouldnt be the problem when they have the money to recruit and keep up mercenaries.. sure i play with rome now, they are OP so its natural that i own every other army. but when the AI is rome they get destroyed or stay in italy. i hoped that the name Rome 2 total war would make the roman AI strong.

Thanks for the feedback. One thing you have to consider is how old the armies were you fought. The AI will use its old units as long as they are destroyed. The AI in DeI will always go for the Elite units if available and they have room in their armies to create them. I will tweak the system for 1.0.

[Alu10]

Thanks for the feedback. One thing you have to consider is how old the armies were you fought. The AI will use its old units as long as they are destroyed. The AI in DeI will always go for the Elite units if available and they have room in their armies to create them. I will tweak the system for 1.0.

thank you. but i know that they keep their old armies. i hoped that they would "retrain / upgrade" them due to the ability of the player to do so without disbanding units

[zonks40]

Would it help the AI build better units if the minimum soldiers per unit threshold was increased? I'm not sure what it is set at now, but if the units were disbanded when the number of men is at say 20% it would induce the AI to build new units more often?

[Litharion]

Would it help the AI build better units if the minimum soldiers per unit threshold was increased? I'm not sure what it is set at now, but if the units were disbanded when the number of men is at say 20% it would induce the AI to build new units more often?

yep, but should units with 20% of men left disband ? 300 men would disband with 60 units left for example.

[zonks40]

yep, but should units with 20% of men left disband ? 300 men would disband with 60 units left for example.

True, 20% was just an example though.
I know there is a "minimum men per ship" field, if there was also a field for minimum men per unit, it would be great, as we could then control on a per unit basis when the unit is disbanded, thus ensuring that the lower tier units disband at a higher %.

[Litharion]

True, 20% was just an example though.
I know there is a "minimum men per ship" field, if there was also a field for minimum men per unit, it would be great, as we could then control on a per unit basis when the unit is disbanded, thus ensuring that the lower tier units disband at a higher %.

we can only use the variable .
All suggestions and complains about AI recruitment can go into this thread. I will take your feedback seriously and will try to improve the current system as much as possible.

[Dresden]

The main issue is the AI doesn't disband any units. So early on, they build some levy armies and then (until destroyed) they keep them.

We had the minimum level set higher but it is highly annoying for the player to lose veteran units when at 20% health.

[juanplay]

Maybe could be good idea to give to the main faction´s capitals level 4 barracks, so that when their early armies are destroyed and the reforms have already ocurred, the AI will create meaningful elite troops.

[Litharion]

Maybe could be good idea to give to the main faction´s capitals level 4 barracks, so that when their early armies are destroyed and the reforms have already ocurred, the AI will create meaningful elite troops.

Yeah or we could make most units of the starting reforms available with the first barrack. This way player and AI have the basic units sets available shortly after or right at the start of the campaign.

[Dresden]

Many of the elite units are available at earlier barracks levels than vanilla but it could be a good idea to go through and make sure more are available. I am just glad that complaints are back to balance issues rather than crashes

[lake]

Also what about the kind of units recruited by AI? I am thinking about cavalry. For example the Gauls do not use much cavalry, but I guess they should..

[Litharion]

Also what about the kind of units recruited by AI? I am thinking about cavalry. For example the Gauls do not use much cavalry, but I guess they should..

yes, they should

[UsulDaNeriak]

One problem is, that the AI obviously has no "recruitment strategy". My strategy is a bit extreme. If playing Rome, all my military barracks are in the province Italia (but harbors). All buildings which give buffs to the recruits are also here. Almost all of them, which needs a clever PO management. Also some characters with recruitment buffs are located in Italia. This way I always recruit the best soldier, regardless wether elite unit or standard unit. And my armies are very superior to any AI army.

The AI spreads military buildings all over the place. This is a waste of money and building slots. And it recruits suboptimal, unbuffed units. Also the economy suffers, due to wasted slots. Therefore the AI may win a single battle, but can never win the war.

I don't say, the AI should use such an extreme centralized strategy like me. I criticize, that the AI has no recruitment strategy at all. And I doubt a modder can do anything about it.

[Alu10]

One problem is, that the AI obviously has no "recruitment strategy". My strategy is a bit extreme. If playing Rome, all my military barracks are in the province Italia (but harbors). All buildings which give buffs to the recruits are also here. Almost all of them, which needs a clever PO management. Also some characters with recruitment buffs are located in Italia. This way I always recruit the best soldier, regardless wether elite unit or standard unit. And my armies are very superior to any AI army.

The AI spreads military buildings all over the place. This is a waste of money and building slots. And it recruits suboptimal, unbuffed units. Also the economy suffers, due to wasted slots. Therefore the AI may win a single battle, but can never win the war.

I don't say, the AI should use such an extreme centralized strategy like me. I criticize, that the AI has no recruitment strategy at all. And I doubt a modder can do anything about it.

The reason to play the game is to feel stronger than everyone else. thats okay. it is the same in every total war game. They should be at least fair enemies. all i want is to fight elite troops we all know how to buff the armies with buildings, im not looking at the campaign map for 700 hours without doing anything. 90% of the rome 2 players do what you do, when they want. why cant the AI retrain their units BTW?

[Champlain]

I personally set mine to 20%, if I screw up I pay. Another thing that should be taken into account when fighting AI stacks is the human players advantage with planning their generals. I am certain I am not alone in min/maxing the level ups I pick, and the addition of an agent to the stack. I don't really know if the AI is capable of taking advantage of these, if it has the smarts. As an aside .95e is going very well on 5 different faction saves so I am happy that the CTDs are getting squeezed out. Good job kids! keep at her.
Cheers!

[Dresden]

The AI can upgrade their units, they don't often build the military buff buildings. They would probably end up building them and not barracks, knowing the AI in this game.

I realize that sometimes the AI overbuilds barracks, but you have to realize that in previous versions there were issues with the AI not building any barracks at all.

The player will always be able to min/max better than the AI.

[quaz601]

another issue is how the AI handles choosing AOR units they might take them instead of stronger faction specfic units that can be later upgraded, i think they're could be an option where if your culture becomes dominant u can no longer recruit AOR units that way the AI focuses on its own units and upgrades them

[Litharion]

another issue is how the AI handles choosing AOR units they might take them instead of stronger faction specfic units that can be later upgraded, i think they're could be an option where if your culture becomes dominant u can no longer recruit AOR units that way the AI focuses on its own units and upgrades them

I could do it for the player, but the amount of scripting required to restrict the AI would possibly make the game unplayable. I will lower AoR unit qualities for the AI in the future to prevent them from choosing AoR instead of local troops.

[quaz601]

heres some ideas

1. Increase size of starting armies even add some elites the economy will have to be tweaked to balance, elites are capped anyway to balance power in the game

2. Make stronger, and even elite units to be recruited earlier in game. Since you have scripted reforms for upgrades this still feels historical.

3. Put caps on AOR recruitment to encourage player and AI to focus on promoting their culture this would make taking a region for the player a lot more dangerous also it still works out since each army can only have 20 units and there's only so many army slots in game for each faction. If you take a city in a foreign land and loose half your army the effects are much worse. I've never had serious issues converting a region with a few temples but some buffing might be needed for the AI.