Medieval Kingdoms Total War Screenshots and Videos Thread

[robtim92]

Ok, so I thought I´d show you guys a little teaser of one lithuanian unit, since I have been working on their roster after the Teutonic order.

Since Lithuania got exposed both to the West in the form of the Teutonic Order and Poland as well as to the east in the form of the Kievan Rus etc, their armor tends to show that, hopefully...
So, this is a late era unit, Lithuanian Armored Cavalry with transitional armor.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The single greatest screenshot I have seen so far. Sorry for being biased, but I LOVE the European transitional armors, and this is a beautiful representation. If you can use these and similar armors on some of the late western european armies I would faint

[Ltd.]

mercenary heavy men at arms (the exact availability, the role, the name etc will be decided on later):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[saneel]

Heavy assault infantry - looking at their armor late period and very very expensive.

[Slytacular]

They look like something that would better fit a low fantasy or early romantic Renaissance paintings (if you exchange the helmets). They do not look like anything out of any illustrations or descriptions I have conceived. Anybody with that expensive amount of clothes would wear something more colorful than black. I have already posted why I find the flipped up visors distasteful. I don't think even mercenaries had that amount of armour either. Not even say the Gallowglass for example.

Wearing breastplates to battle were more used amongst rich nobility. That kind of armour has to be custom fit and imported all the way over from Italy. You don't see breastplates as something commonly worn among soldiers until the Renaissance. The transitional period was more of an era for well paid soldiers to wear brigandines, coat of plates, lamellar, and surcoats of maille.

[sshuttle]

I have to say they look amazing, and even if they didn't or couldn't exist as mercenaries I do not care. The game you are making is fantastic and not everything you make has to be 100% historically accurate. Making a game requires a focus on reality and balancing game play. You guys are wonderful, and I have been watching from the beginning, and it has bothered me every time your team does something not completely historically accurate many people criticize it. Keep up the great work and I cannot wait to play this amazing mod!

[Slytacular]

Its impossible to do anything historically accurate. Nobody alive has witnessed the 13th to 15th century and even if there were, the perspective would be skewed. We can only guess from an educated observation from what is where, what happened, and why is it here. What bothers me is when people I talk to can only recite what they know about history from social media such as Braveheart, 300, and any "historical" documentary that half-butts the research into costume design and borrow fantasy props from the nearest costume store. People even use Rome: Total War as a tool to teach history and that game is made on purpose to not display history correctly. As a co-developer for this mod, I would like to use this game as an outlet to properly display how things were back then based on up to date scholarly research as well as a focus on gameplay and uh... "reality"? To educate people is one of my biggest motivations to working on this project. I can argue that the little bits of historical details can make each faction different and unique in its own way to make it fun.

[Ltd.]

As we are talking about the 14th and 15th century in terms of our late era units, I really don´t understand why this type of armor would not fit that period and what is fantasy or historically not accurate about them. This churburg type breastplate was worn in the late 14 and 15th centuries. Our mod is supposed to end around 1450, well into the 15th century.
And why do you think they could not have existed as mercenaries? mercenaries were and had to be among the best equipped troops in most armies and not comparable to any riff-raff hoping to survive one more battle . They were paid to do their job and as such they tended to outfit themselves with contemporary armor and weaponry.
They wear maille, arm and leg protection, and a breatsplate .

Also, they are not wearing anything black.
In terms of flipped up visors, I mentioned on my turn as well, that it is supposed to symbolize them opening the visor to get some air / be able to take a better look at what is surrounding them, you name it. We can´t depict everything in a game as in real life , with animation sets for every happening on the battlefield.

[Slytacular]

The reason why I do not think churburg armour should belong to mercenaries is because I have not read or seen enough evidence in the frescos and articles I read where mercenaries were displayed wearing churburg like sets of armor. Any professional group of mercenaries to afford that sort of armour would be in an Italian merchant record of some sort. The churburg armours were bought by aristocratic nobility who require custom measurements to make the armour fit for them. I do not fully deny that an aristocratic type of mercenary has existed, but rather it is an interest of mine to find out what group of mercenaries clad in such expensive suits of armor would have existed where? I'll do some research of my own, but if anyone can provide me with something evidence worthy, then I will cease my crying and bickering.

I complain about the visors because it will look silly during a fight in the game. It would look more realistic and have more sense if the visors were worn covering the face.

[Linke]

I would argue that if a mercenary was rich enough to afford that armour he would have a horse aswell. To my knowledge heavy horsemen were important part of merceneries in Italy and France in late middle ages, I'm thinking of the white company (about the heavy horsemen not the specific armor). The visirs would be best for nobles and generals who need to show they are alive and speak commands and who aren't always entering the middle of battle.

Good looking unit anyhow, this look before later shiny plate armors covering everything, but rather with chain mail and heavy plate mixed looks really good to me (and many others)

[robtim92]

mercenary heavy men at arms (the exact availability, the role, the name etc will be decided on later):

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

This unit looks incredible. If all the plate metal in this mod looks as beautiful as this, then I will be quick excited. And, I'm fairly certain that there were some fully plated soldiers by the mid 15th century, so I wouldn't question the presence of even half-plate armor

[vismitananda]

Cool mod. I can't seem to find the download button, sorry If didn't scan the whole thread.

Also Is it possible to play this mod, w/o buying any DLC's?

thanks

[tryadelion]

mercenary 15th century heavy infantry, armours made from sources by the 2nd guy from the left on his forge. half of those on this photo are medievalist historians / archaeologists.

those mercenaries look badass but need more color, less gold and black, and more variation.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Slytacular]

I don't doubt your friend for his sources, but the difference is that this mod represents two eras of units- before the transitional period and during the transitional period. I wouldn't question the unit if it were to represent a troop during the mid 15th century (though what would be worn by mercenaries and free companies could still be argued), but this is a unit that is representing a blend of troop from 1350 to 1453. Breastplates during that period of time were experimented with in Italy and eventually carried over to Germany, Burgundy, and other Kingdoms as time goes on. Breastplates were a very expensive purchase for that time period and has to be custom fitted. Custom-fitted breastplates would be a purchase most likely from aristocratic people and to develop these forms of armour in its early prototype stage could have taken some time to develop. It would be more likely to see mercenaries and free companies during the time span of 1350 to 1453 wearing something between a coat of maille to a brigandine. In all fairness and respect, I have not seen your friend's catalogue of pictures and illustrations so I cannot validate. I would however love to see his collection of Medieval sources though!

[Matamoros]

Awesome. The armors look amazing. The quality is growing even more.
I find logical too that the helmet visors should be closed in a middle of a battle, otherwise what's the point of having one?

[+Marius+]

Wearing breastplates to battle were more used amongst rich nobility. That kind of armour has to be custom fit and imported all the way over from Italy.

The breastplates were the most common piece of plate armor after helmets and started popping up on common soldiers as early as the 1360s.

Breastplates do not really have to be fitted that well if you are not attaching other pieces of armor to it and they were far cheaper to produce than mail shirts.

The armor does look kinda too expensive for mercenaries at first glance, but if you look closer you will notice that they do not have pauldrons, gauntlets, sabatons, cuisses etc.
It is basically a heavier version of a cheap helmet+breastplate combo that was worn by basically anyone.
Certain town militias in Italy/Germany were required to own helmet and breastplates in order to receive a salary.

Richer mercenaries would surely be able to afford such half armor considering there were entire mercenary bands that were mounted on extremely expensive warhorses as early as the 1320s.

The price of armor went really down once you took out the intricate small plate sections out of the price order.
For instance, in 16th century Germany, a mercenary would pay 7 Gulden for his harness made up of burgonet, collar with shoulder defences (spaulders) breastplate with long tassets and backplate.
The man-at-arms however paid at least 35 Gulden for his full harness with some prices going up to 100 Gulden, because the more enclosing the armor is, the more intricate and time consuming it is to forge.

Osprey book about 15th century English knights makes a mention of Sir Joh Cressy buying full suit of Milanese armour in 1441, costing him £8.00 6s 8d, with armour for squires costing from £5.00 to £6.00 16s 8d. At the time, an English man-at-arms employed on a campaign could expect to be paid 12d per day, so those prices given would be equivalent to 100-127 days salary for a man-at-arms.

If we use the same math with comparing the highest quality Milanese armor in 1441 with the comparison of the 16th century armor, a mid 15th century regular footman would have to pay 1.5 pounds for an entire half armor, meaning 80-140 days salary for him.

Entirely doable.

Back to the image;
The greathelms should not be used with it if it is the 15th century.
You can use bascinets as long as you want, those babies did not fall out of use until the 1480/90s.

You don't see breastplates as something commonly worn among soldiers until the Renaissance. The transitional period was more of an era for well paid soldiers to wear brigandines, coat of plates, lamellar, and surcoats of maille.

Not so sure about that.

City militia of Bruges, Ypres and Ghent at the Golden Spurs;

http://medieval2.heavengames.com/m2t...nders/kortrijk

Communal skirmish in Bologna between Guelphs and Ghibellines, 1369 AD;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ercambi%29.jpg

Miltia from the towns of Prague and Tabor;

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/attach...id=56249&stc=1

Berne militia praying before and after the battle of Laupen (14th Century, painting from the 15th century) Diebold Schilling;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...bei_Laupen.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Chronik_17.jpg

Armed militia from Zurich, relieving a siege, Diebold Schilling, 15th Century;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...rom_zurich.jpg


In the 15th century the regular footmen appear to be very well armored, but not fully enclosed as mounted men are;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ichte5-230.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...f_Grandson.jpg
http://media.kunst-fuer-alle.de/img/...1_00077148.jpg

Though, some bands of infantrymen do pop up wearing basically a full suit;
http://i.imgur.com/bw62Idr.jpg

This image is very important because it shows that some of the armors were fluted gothic style while others are not, also, if you look closer, you will notice that;

1)The armored man at the right of the ladder does not have pauldrons.
2)The second man from the right has no right leg armor and has no visor.
3)The man on top of the ladder(only the legs are seen), is unarmored(from what we can tell).

[warman222]

Some of those pics don't have breastplates in them or are hard to tell. We'll see.

Anyhow, I got another screen for you guys. Faction Leaders!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[robtim92]

Some of those pics don't have breastplates in them or are hard to tell. We'll see.

Anyhow, I got another screen for you guys. Faction Leaders!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Leaders look awesome! Especially love the Roman and Cuman faction leaders. I have one question though; will the faction leaders' garb change for the later period or is that something that is impossible with Attila's mechanics?

[Ltd.]

Leaders look awesome! Especially love the Roman and Cuman faction leaders. I have one question though; will the faction leaders' garb change for the later period or is that something that is impossible with Attila's mechanics?

Yes, it is possible, since they are just part of another unit. There will be later era bodyguard units with the corresponding faction leader / heir / officers

[MOS-Lukas-Dwarf]

How did you manage to make the French faction leader hold the shield in that manner? Is it possible to make all shields held this way so that it is different to Attilas default?

[Ltd.]

Awesome. The armors look amazing. The quality is growing even more.
I find logical too that the helmet visors should be closed in a middle of a battle, otherwise what's the point of having one?

well, for one normally it would make a lot more sense to have the visors lowered in the particular phase of troops advancing towards each other, where most of the missiles , like arrows etc are flying around. However during close combat it would make more sense to have them raised as it would really make it a lot easier to breath, keep you cool and most of all, you´d be able to see what is going on around you.