unable to balance horse archers properly?

[Alu10]

Skuda Aspa. The weakest horse archers in game still armour of 22. 22 armour for horse archers when compared to cataphract horse archers of armenia with 29 armour. Seriously? When on foot, the skythian archers have 10 armour but when they are on a horseback magically they have 22 armour. Armenian cataphract horse archers have a upkeep of 160 while the skythian horse archers cost nearly nothing. And the morale of the armenians, shameful.

[zonks40]

I imagine it will take some time for the team to balance 1500+ units, you can either be patient, or learn to modify the stats yourself, it's not all that difficult.

[tomFoolery]

All this, and stuff like it, should be balanced out for 1.0...

[Butan]

Even after the "1.0 balance", I doubt that the horse archers of the nomad factions will be much nerfed.... Thats their bread and butter and only advantage, if they are "balanced", meaning, equal to other horse archers in terms of damage/protection/upkeep, then the nomadic factions will not be balanced but weak.

Balance isnt putting all unit type to equal stats, especially in DeI which favors having factions with strenghts and weaknesses, which is their main forte for me.

[Scythion]

Even after the "1.0 balance", I doubt that the horse archers of the nomad factions will be much nerfed.... Thats their bread and butter and only advantage, if they are "balanced", meaning, equal to other horse archers in terms of damage/protection/upkeep, then the nomadic factions will not be balanced but weak.

Balance isnt putting all unit type to equal stats, especially in DeI which favors having factions with strenghts and weaknesses, which is their main forte for me.

1.1: Full overhaul of the east and the steppe.

[Alu10]

Even after the "1.0 balance", I doubt that the horse archers of the nomad factions will be much nerfed.... Thats their bread and butter and only advantage, if they are "balanced", meaning, equal to other horse archers in terms of damage/protection/upkeep, then the nomadic factions will not be balanced but weak.

Balance isnt putting all unit type to equal stats, especially in DeI which favors having factions with strenghts and weaknesses, which is their main forte for me.

they dont need armour to be balanced. The nomads have more than just Skuda Aspa, why making the levy horse archers with so much armour when the nomads have 2-3 more horse archer units depending on faction. Its stupid to say such a thing. Hayasdan cataphract horse archers (in your argumentation) should have way more armour because this is the only horse archer unit for hayasdan and they have a history of horse archers too.

The way how to balance things is:

cheap unit = weak unit (compared to other units of the same class)

hayasdan cataphract horse archers for example have nothing special. armour is weak (how is that possible when they wear mail armour and have cataphract horses compared to cloth wearing bare bone horse archers) but the upkeep is doubled and their morale is like Skuda Aspa's morale.

i am an expert of steppe factions i played 3 of them, and giving the weak of them magic invisible armour is not "bread and butter" for them. Also i know how to mod (to the other guy) but why should i mod them myself when there is a Divide Et Impera modding team that says they will balance all units.

[damien007]

Obviously some factions need to have different advantages and disadvantages. One of the stated goals of this mod is to ensure each of the faction are unique and different experience to play. Horse Archers are the only Ace nomads have, if you take that away from them what else do they have?

[KAM 2150]

I have my idea on how to balance Nomads for 1.0.

They will be different from other nations but not in the OP way.

[Marcus Marcellus]

I don't think that they should have "magic" armour like someone called it, but perhaps greater range and speed? Since that might be more accurate as the "bread and butter"

[Butan]

Lowering their armor would be a good idea, but the upkeep and damage needs to stay, IMO: they are meant to be spammed, until the nomadic factions have a bigger roster and various units, as Scythion implicated.

[Scythion]

I think nomadic factions (Armenia and Parthia too) should have bigger cavalry unit sizes. This would make sense because their armies are mostly cavalry based.
I think the size of a cavalry unit should depend on the unit's culture.
Balance example: Italian < celtic/greek < eastern < nomadic.

[GatoVolador]

I think nomadic factions (Armenia and Parthia too) should have bigger cavalry unit sizes. This would make sense because their armies are mostly cavalry based.
I think the size of a cavalry unit should depend on the unit's culture.
Balance example: Italian < celtic/greek < eastern < nomadic.

It already is exactly like that. On my unit scale romans get 67 or so men per unit (even on auxiliarry like cataphract alae), celtic/greek 83 and eastern and nomadic 90+ (forgot the exact number).

[Scythion]

It already is exactly like that. On my unit scale romans get 67 or so men per unit (even on auxiliarry like cataphract alae), celtic/greek 83 and eastern and nomadic 90+ (forgot the exact number).

Then my mistake I didn't noticed it.

[KAM 2150]

Nomads, barbarians and eastern nations share the same unit size, you were not mistaken.

Unit size will be one of the things that will make Nomads more unique, but do not worry about making them too OP.

[tomFoolery]

Nomadic cavalry units should definitely be somehow markedly better than just about every other cavalry unit in the game, but I find myself really bothered by a discrepancy in a unit's armor value and actual armor the soldiers wear. Generally it should come down to unit size and their actual fighting capabilities (for melee cav this would be their melee attack, defense, charge bonus, and for cav archers their rate of fire, accuracy, speed, etc, etc), and not "magical armor stats", which appear here and there on some units.