[DOWNLOAD] SSHIP ver. 0.97 (outdated, use v. 098)

[Lifthrasir]

There's still quite a lot of work to do in the EDU, that's for sure. I think (but I guess most of our team also) that's the best thing to do is to remove some of the late (to not say very late) units, those that you won't see if not playing almost until the end of the game. They aren't relevant for an early era campaign. It would set free numerous slots in the EDU and give us the opportunity to make some specific units for specific factions. The result would be a greater variety and so a better gameplay, no matter which faction you choose.

[Navajo Joe]

Lifth,

That sounds like a great idea to remove deadwood you do not see, how about clearing the fantasy units like, Sherwood Archers, Gwent Raiders, Religious Fanatics, to name three

[Lifthrasir]

That's also the idea. Based on Ichon's comments, we can clear easily between 20 and 30 slots in the EDU.

[Eldorien88]

How about "Portugese" knights, "Noble" knights, German Imperial knights and certainly the (goofy-named) "Gothic" knights?

(There were no such things as "Gothic" knights, but instead there were renaissance knights, clad in "gothic" style harnesses, or "Milanese" style harnesses, or Greenwitch style harnesses.)

In any case I believe what you guys are doing is something that ought to have been done a long time ago, but better late than never, so thank you all so much.

Regarding Portugese Knights and German Imperials, there is no need to exclude them 'cause they are already out.
To the rest that you and NJ mention you make a good point both.
It would be nice to be considered i believe..

There's still quite a lot of work to do in the EDU, that's for sure. I think (but I guess most of our team also) that's the best thing to do is to remove some of the late (to not say very late) units, those that you won't see if not playing almost until the end of the game. They aren't relevant for an early era campaign. It would set free numerous slots in the EDU and give us the opportunity to make some specific units for specific factions. The result would be a greater variety and so a better gameplay, no matter which faction you choose.

Exactly!

@Navacho: I just googled for Gwent Raiders and i have found them in a fantasy book called "Tomorrows magic".
Well look at that..

[Lifthrasir]

Well, I didn't want to put this on the high light now but as the subject is coming...

Here is a list proposed by Ichon a while ago to remove some units. Note that some of them might be already removed to add some of the units from BC:

More complete list of units that can be cut including ships, mercenaries and doubled units-

galleass, caravel, carrack, grande_carrack, gun holk, Aventurier, aventuros, Genoese crossbow militia, french feudal knights, german feudal knights, gothic knights, dismounted gothic knights, elephants, gendarmes, musketeers, late musketeers, pistoliers, early reiters, reiters, demi lancers, arquebusiers, mercenary arquebusiers, mounted arquebusiers, lancers, tercio pikemen, spanish arquebusiers, portuguese arquebusiers, janissary arquebusiers, lithuanian arquebusiers, flagellants, menaulatoi, late tercio pikemen, husarze, janissary musketeers, cossack gunners, cossack musketeers, camel gunners, mounted calivermen, calivermen, sudanese gunners, doppelsoldner, pikemen, swiss armored pikemen, late_pikemen, black band arquebusiers, NE ballista, ME ballista, NE catapult, ME catapult, NE mortar, NE ribault, NE culverin, NE cannon, ME cannon, NE serpentine, NE basilisk, NE monster ribault, mercenary ribault, mercenary monster ribault,

Questionable- Fyrd spearmen, peasant archers, s_peasant archers, EE peasant archers, ME peasant archers, (some peasant archers replaced by hunters), Moorish Auxullaries, Smolensk infantry, Edessan Guard, Canons of the Holy Sepulcher, Scots pikemen(keep scots pike militia)?

So I get 59 for sure with possible 10 additional. Last count EDU was at 496 so - 59 or 69 would be somewhere around 427 or 437 leaving space for about 70 additional units. I've come up with 23 new units right now but 6 of them use already named units just renaming them so really only 17 units with models all from BC. Probably I can find some more models in BC and I'm looking at a couple other mods as well... there are war wagons with crossbowmen/archers in other mod and I'd love to include those for Cumans/Mongols and possible Hussite rebellion event and maybe Hussite mercenaries since the Hussite wars began in 1420 before our tech cutoff date.

Any comment?

[Gercog]

In Spain and Portugal there are units Jinete and caballeros villanos, with the same battle models and small difference in EDU and name
I think that caballeros villanos can be painlessly removed, it also frees 2 slots! What do you think?

[Lifthrasir]

I'll check that also. Many thanks.

[Gercog]

Also i think that there is no need the Templar heavy spearmen if we have Templar sergeants
check that also

[Lifthrasir]

Regarding the jinetes and caballeros villanos, I think we have to keep both as they are actually 2 different units. From my reseaches (limited as my Spanish is very poor), this is what I found:
- caballero villano: Non-noble (or ‘lesser noble’) man-at-arms, or ‘commoner knight’ who had privileges similar to those of a noble (particularly tax exemptions) by possessing a horse and body protection suitable for military service, different to caballero hidalgo who is a Noble paid as man-at-arms.
- jinete: Castilian for light cavalryman (genete) of a Maghribi tradition, originally armed with a small shield (daraga) and throwing spears or javelins. Later they employed short lances. Jinetes wore little or no body protection, relied on manoeuvrability and tactical speed for defence, and were accomplished in hit-and-run tactics. They were excellent for ambushes and mountain-pass skirmishes, but they were weak in open battle against heavily armed cavalry.

However, these units may need to be updated in game as they were actually different. But both played an important role during the Reconquista.

Regarding the CS units, heavy spearmen and sergeants, I need to check. I'll revert as soon as possible.

[MWY]

Caballeros villanos existed way earlier than jinetes. Jinetes were professionals while caballeros where just locals or common people if i remember correctly. Lifth has said everything else.

By the way it doesn't really make sense to cut so many units when we don't have the time or resources to refill all those slots..

[j.a.luna]

Hello SSHIP!!! Sorry,but i write better in spanish, i write you my question...mi primera pregunta seria cuando estaría listo la nueva actualización de SSHIP??? y otra pregunta sería porque quitais o eliminais tantas unidades de la era tardía, tambien esta bien unidades como arcabuceros,piqueros de los tercios,jenízaros,etc no eliminais tantas unidades de pólvora y mi sugerencia sería que las mejoraseis o le dieseis un nuevo estilo, diferente al estilo original del medieval 2, las unidades tardías son una de las grandes cosas que diferencian al stainless steel del bellum crucis...otra sugerencia sería que se modificasen las unidades serbias y se les diera unidades mas propias diferentes de las unidades húngaras,además creo que se deberían mejorar las milicias italianas y las milicias con pavés diferenciando los modelos de unidades de las milicias de lanceros o los sargentos lanceros,así como nuevos modelos para los lanceros escandinavos,digamos que sería diferenciar más las unidades entre diferentes facciones para así mejorar el mod. otra sugerencia sería añadir nuevos item a personajes importantes con poderosos atributos como lo hace el bellum crucis,como por ejemplo "PRIMUS INTER PARES" o "PATRIARCA ECUMÉNICO DE CONSTANTINOPLA" para el patriarca bizantino o corona de españa, corona de inglaterra,etc
Espero no haberos aburrido mucho y espero que tengais en cuenta mis sugerencias para mejorar este maravilloso mod, sois la única esperanza de mejora del stainless steel ya que el stainless steel 7 nunca sale a la luz...un saludo desde España.

[j.a.luna]

por cierto sólo quería deciros que en el mod Tsardoms total war hay geniales unidades para las unidades bizantinas,venecianas,turcas,etc..si quereis podeis copiar unidades de este mod ademas del bellum crucis, son unidades fabulosas e históricas.Un saludo

[messenger]

There is a unit called Burgher Pikemen that only appears on the HRE's custom battle roster. I could not find it in the EDB or descr_mercs file so I think it is pretty much unused. That could be removed for another EDU space I guess.
The same seems to apply to the Norse Axemen (Huskarlar) unit for the Danes and Norwegians, it only appears on custom battle and not in campaigns.

[Lifthrasir]

@ j.a.luna, please write in English because none of the team member speaks Spanish as far as I know. Also, a Moderator might send you a "warning" if you don't write in English.
There are several translators on the web (f.e. Reverso or Google Traduction) that might help you
Anyway, if I understand correctly your message:
- a patch for the v0.8.3 should be released soon.
- there's no decision made so far to remove more units. As MWY mentionned, there's no point to remove units if we can't replace them. We're aware that there's still a lot of work to do on the EDU.
- regarding the Serbian unit roster, Eldorien88 is working on it (check the relevant thread).
- I'm not sure to understand your next point: are you talking to make a kind of a specific roster per faction or do you mean to make more models for a unit which can belong to several factions?
- regarding bonuses, they already exist for some crowns, like Crown of Spain, Crown of Syria, etc... That might also be a point to be improved.
- finally, regarding Tsardom mod unit models, that's something we need to check. Same remark about Bellum Crucis Mod.
Anyway, thanks for your suggestions and kind words. Just note that we're doing our best to improve SSHIP depending on the free time available for each of us. That's why it takes time for a release.

@ messenger, thanks for that. I'll check it.

[Mihajlo]

Well perhaps you can remove units. For a release you dont have to put all 500 in edu anyway, it can be added later...

Also there is a lot of mods and you can ask to input their units to fill edu if you want. (BC 2.3, then italian mod BC 7.0, etc),no need to redo all units imho.
Did you take into consideration to remove all double units, and perhaps all peasant units?

[Lifthrasir]

Regarding Bellum Crucix, I don't know this mod except the name. I also know that they're strict about sharing their work which is fine.

For now, there are numerous other points we need to improve by ourselves before to start thinking adding more stuff from others.

[Navajo Joe]

Oh Lifth, you have just spoiled my fun, just getting ready to run him out of 'Dodge', not a problem, but has stated lets please keep to English.

[Mihajlo]

For now, there are numerous other points we need to improve by ourselves before to start thinking adding more stuff from others.

yup, totally agree! (other stuff can be imported later, that is why I said that units can be deleted even if there is not enough to put back in...)

[Lifthrasir]

Oh Lifth, you have just spoiled my fun, just getting ready to run him out of 'Dodge', not a problem, but has stated lets please keep to English.

NJ. I just wanted to warn him, not to take your duty

[Heskey]

Is this sub-mod compatible with Byg's Grim Reality IV-E and V for SS 6.4?