Thread: SSHIP - General Discussion

  1. #3661
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
    Patrician Artifex Moderation Mentor Content Emeritus

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dunkirk - France
    Posts
    13,627
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Mongol roster is not planned to be re-worked for now. Not enough time. We'll see later.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader


  2. #3662

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifthrasir View Post
    Yes but no point to start these if we change stats, depending also on the impact of the new animations as well. Unless you want to do the job several times
    i would guess it depends how big the overhaul is, if units attributes dont change much it would be just a matter of updating, not doing the job several times


    it's not like you have a new combat/stats system and unit stats are all going to change completely is it ?
    Last edited by Dekhatres; April 25, 2017 at 01:36 PM.

  3. #3663
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
    Patrician Artifex Moderation Mentor Content Emeritus

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dunkirk - France
    Posts
    13,627
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Don't know as I haven't started yet to work on that feature
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader


  4. #3664

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Dekhatres View Post
    I suggest for a bit more info regarding units to be added into the description, things such as range for archers, secondary melee attack for horse archers and melee cavalry, spear bonuses, pike bonuses and all kinds of attributes and numbers should all be in the description.
    some units also are better than their stats tell because of animations ? that should be in the description too imo

    Descriptions should overall be more precise on what the unit is for and what it can do
    Similar to this images about the submod of "Divide and Conquer" for Third age total war, they have very well explained and defined units descriptions...
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0011.jpg 
Views:	25 
Size:	628.3 KB 
ID:	344804Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0002.jpg 
Views:	18 
Size:	619.9 KB 
ID:	344805Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0001.jpg 
Views:	13 
Size:	698.2 KB 
ID:	344806Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0000.jpg 
Views:	23 
Size:	641.2 KB 
ID:	344807

    also for sship team, other suggestion about implement other new units for replaced anciend vainilla units...look at the one and second picture about unit "beast slayers" they have 2 type of weapons, archer and also spear, so they can shoot and also are good against mounted units and other abilities..i think that sship could implemented as prussian units(for replaced prussians axemen and prussian auxiliaries with teutonic models)they look at as a type of hunters and northmen units, pretty badass
    i dont know if divide and conquer borrow some units from them but some units(no orcs or fantasy units,logic) as kingdom of dale,gondor,rohan,harad,easterlings and other humans factions have units that could be useful for some medieval roster in sship, units for swedens,bulgarians,prussians,arabs,some mercenaries...they are fit
    THE MORE YOU SWEAT NOW,
    THE LESS YOU BLEED IN BATTLE!!!



    Sign the petition to remove hardcoded limits for M2TW

  5. #3665
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
    Patrician Artifex Moderation Mentor Content Emeritus

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dunkirk - France
    Posts
    13,627
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Once again and for countless time, we don't have the resources (time and human) to make all these changes in a short time period. Discussion and preview will come when it's the right time. Why are you insisting all the time?
    On top of that, no fancy units for SSHIP.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader


  6. #3666
    tmodelsk's Avatar Tiro
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Warsaw, Poland
    Posts
    269

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifthrasir View Post
    Once again and for countless time, we don't have the resources (time and human) to make all these changes in a short time period. ...
    j.a.luna - Lifthrasir is right.
    In project management, software development - if you want to do something, finish something - at a specified moment of time you need to 'froze' the scope of changes,
    and focus on that scope, stabilize software (SSHIP) with that scope of changes, don't start new things.
    It's well known & experienced. Lifthrasir is now acting properly as project manager, for all our good .

    If you don't 'froze' the amount of changes - it's highly possible that you will never finish anything.
    SSHIP mini-mods :

  7. #3667

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Ok excuse me, only that when i saw some units in other places/mods always i think in sship and how could fit them,only this, but ok i will suppress my ebullience
    I always value the hard work of modders( and now more since i support jurand minimod and for improve little things is much work and time)
    Last edited by j.a.luna; April 26, 2017 at 04:49 AM.
    THE MORE YOU SWEAT NOW,
    THE LESS YOU BLEED IN BATTLE!!!



    Sign the petition to remove hardcoded limits for M2TW

  8. #3668
    Svir@c's Avatar Libertus
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Subotica Serbia
    Posts
    82

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by j.a.luna View Post
    Similar to this images about the submod of "Divide and Conquer" for Third age total war, they have very well explained and defined units descriptions...
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0011.jpg 
Views:	25 
Size:	628.3 KB 
ID:	344804Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0002.jpg 
Views:	18 
Size:	619.9 KB 
ID:	344805Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0001.jpg 
Views:	13 
Size:	698.2 KB 
ID:	344806Click image for larger version. 

Name:	0000.jpg 
Views:	23 
Size:	641.2 KB 
ID:	344807
    Good point mate! Actually was thinking about D&C units descriptions, for units desc. here, also!! Short description with needed source materials, who, when, why, how ... and then this "statistics info", so-called, for the end of desc.!?
    But, all the work will be for the next release, I think?!
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    -Come not between the Nazgúl and his prey!- J.R.R.Tolkien, The Battle of the Pelennor Fields, The Return of the King

  9. #3669

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Svir@c View Post
    Good point mate! Actually was thinking about D&C units descriptions, for units desc. here, also!! Short description with needed source materials, who, when, why, how ... and then this "statistics info", so-called, for the end of desc.!?
    But, all the work will be for the next release, I think?!

    i played lotr mods only a few times (old versions) and i didnt knew they already made such descriptions, this is very good

    though a few things might be missing, or maybe that mod doesnt use it, like unit speed for example, some units have "move_speed_mod 0.85" that is particularily important to know on cavalry, that bonus against cavalry should also be specified as iirc it can go from +4 to +12, quite a bit of diference

  10. #3670
    Svir@c's Avatar Libertus
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Subotica Serbia
    Posts
    82

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Dekhatres View Post
    i played lotr mods only a few times (old versions) and i didnt knew they already made such descriptions, this is very good

    though a few things might be missing, or maybe that mod doesnt use it, like unit speed for example, some units have "move_speed_mod 0.85" that is particularily important to know on cavalry, that bonus against cavalry should also be specified as iirc it can go from +4 to +12, quite a bit of diference
    Of course, I get what you mean! For me also this kind of info's are missing too. And then, luna has posted the D&C descr. thing which, frankly, personaly find the best desc. in all of mods. I'm playing it, of course like bounch of others too, and been thinking on doing like this since!? And it is "quite a bit of difference" in desc. from infantry units to archer units up until cavalry units. So, will do, suggestions noted and implemented!
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    -Come not between the Nazgúl and his prey!- J.R.R.Tolkien, The Battle of the Pelennor Fields, The Return of the King

  11. #3671
    isa0005's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Australia, Victoria, Melbourne
    Posts
    1,505

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Out of curiosity, what is the team working on atm? What is the main focus of development currently? Or are you all working on little things here and there?

  12. #3672
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
    Patrician Artifex Moderation Mentor Content Emeritus

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dunkirk - France
    Posts
    13,627
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    JoC is working on the titles. MWY is on different things such as script, models, etc... I'm on some map adjustments for now (almost done) and then I'll fix the issues mentioned by the players (hopefully most of them) before to implement some new units and new animations.

    To be honest, there souldn't be many new features in the next release. It will be more a polished version (adjustments, fixes, etc...). We definitively need to have a "clean" basis before we move forward.
    Last edited by Lifthrasir; April 28, 2017 at 02:10 PM.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader


  13. #3673
    isa0005's Avatar Campidoctor
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Australia, Victoria, Melbourne
    Posts
    1,505

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Sounds good

  14. #3674

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by Lifthrasir View Post
    Once the stats and animations have been adjusted, why not?

    another suggestion, whoever changes that stats might want to lower all cavalry secondary weapon damage to 1 and then balance it by using the mount_effect

    the point is to make cavalry weak in melee while preserving their effectiveness against other cavalry, basically this ensures that heavy cavalry will still dominate light cavalry in melee

    one might think this will make cavalry completely useless even against peasants but it isnt true as i've played for quite a while with this and heavy cavalry with a few chevrons can still inflict significant casualties even to good infantry
    Last edited by Dekhatres; April 29, 2017 at 09:18 AM.

  15. #3675
    Polycarpe's Avatar Back into action!
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Quebec, Canada
    Posts
    3,338

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion


  16. #3676
    Lifthrasir's Avatar "Capre" Dunkerquois
    Patrician Artifex Moderation Mentor Content Emeritus

    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Dunkirk - France
    Posts
    13,627
    Blog Entries
    4

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    It has been a very long time since I heard from you Poly. Thank you very much for the link to let us know. That's very generous. I'll check that and if we use some of your work, we'll give the credit accordingly
    I wish you all the best and hope to see you around nevertheless despite your busy RL.
    Under the patronage of Flinn, proud patron of Jadli, of the Imperial House of Hader


  17. #3677

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    I've dived into SSHIP quiet recently, and have been playing it for a while. So far, the mod is great, with one exception. The diplomacy, especially against the papacy, that I have experienced has gone beyond challenging or annoying and into insanity.

    My faction was Venice(hard campaign difficulty). Took all of northern Italia, my economy was good, Sicily sent up a couple of armies only to be annihilated, everything was fine, until the pope came in.
    First, it was understandable, since the pope hated me. I didn't took much part in the crusades(busy going through northern Italia), I destroyed Pisa, didn't have any cardinals, wasn't in an alliance with the papacy as well. Still, even when I had about 4 or 5 crosses, the pope would randomly excommunicate me and siege my city. When I was at peace, he excommunicated me. I was fighting the orthodox(Serbia) or excommunicated Sicily, he excommunicated me. Once I decided to join the crusade, and the very next turn, he excommunicated me. This was already getting more than annoying.

    So, in order to improve my relations with the pope. I spammed out priests, many of them got good piety, made it to the cardinal's seat, and finally got one of my priests to be the pope. We had outstanding relations, and he excommunicated me.

    This was when I decided that enough is enough. I mobilized my army, and killed the pope in a battle. Since I had many of my priests as cardinals, The next pope was also one from my faction. I was reconciled, got outstanding relation again. To make things sure, I made an alliance with papacy. relations went from outstanding to perfect, I had enough favor to request a crusade, and he excommunicated me. SERIOUSLY, WTF POPE.

    No other faction was excommunicated this often or randomly. I was beginning to be convinced that the pope is not actually a religious head but a selfish warmongering dick who had too much power and wanted the lands just above his, which happened to be mine. That was the only reason that I could think of, since every excommunication that I got was without any signs, not even the "make peace or you're excommunicated". I was excommunicated even when I was not in a war.

    This aggressive stance was somewhat similar to other factions, since they, even my ally, would randomly declare war on me. Maybe it is because that papacy, even while being papacy, behaves like any other factions, and wants to expand as much as anyone else. Aggression from AI is fine, but if it uses a cheap cheat like this excommunication, it is no longer challenging, and just ruins the game.

    Capturing Rome was not a solution, since the pope would just spawn nearby and call a crusade on Rome. So I am doomed to have this trolling lunatic lurking just below my mainland and bear the pain until the end of the game.

    I loved the campaign as Venice, but this one problem has been ruining my game so much that I grew tired of the game despite enjoying everything else. Now I am more inclined to play a non-catholic faction or at least stay away from papacy.

    Then there is the diplomacy going crazy in general. Even when I never declared a war myself and only fought defensive(partly counter-offensive) wars, my reputation would fall to the ground. In every couple of turns nearly every faction would have worse relation with me and it would never improve. In fact, I don't think I have ever seen a relationship improvement in my campaigns. On one odd occasion, AI would declare war on me, ask for peace(I accepted it), and declare war on me again, all in the same turn. When I saw this, I was not even angry, it was just too stupid.

    To clarify, I don't hate this mod. I had tons of fun playing it, and plan to do more. However, as long as this problem lasts, it will forever be an thorn in my game. It may just be me misunderstanding and doing something wrong, if that's the case, please correct me.

    Looking through the posts, it seems that the next update is coming up soon. Is the diplomacy going to be a part of the update? Plus, is there an ETA on the release?



    And just one tiny question. Venice has feudal knights in their roster, but isn't that odd, since Venice was a merchant republic, and did not adopt feudalism? I think a more appropriate unit would be something like high-end mercenaries, since Venice hired mercenaries instead of engaging in warfare themselves. Also, Italian mercenaries were quite renowned in the medieval Europe.

  18. #3678
    Jurand of Cracow's Avatar History and gameplay!
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Cracovia
    Posts
    5,130

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Well, I've got much sympathy for you, crypteque. I'm also bothered with the pope behaviour - see here and around. Alavaria made his game by removing the pope (discussed also in this thread), but I'm not convinced as far as historicity is concerned.
    If you're to play another game, you may try Regnum Poloniae - I've described my experience here. I managed to cope with the pope and kept HRR not attacking me despite an aggressive AI (yes, it attacks many times, also out of no reason - you just need to cope with it) and reputation falling to the ground (admitedely, I kept on paying HRR around 300 every turn). Anyway, if you would play Poland, you'd better to use my submods as well, especially PTF.

  19. #3679

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by crypteque View Post
    Capturing Rome was not a solution, since the pope would just spawn nearby and call a crusade on Rome. So I am doomed to have this trolling lunatic lurking just below my mainland and bear the pain until the end of the game.

    It may just be me misunderstanding and doing something wrong, if that's the case, please correct me.

    And just one tiny question. Venice has feudal knights in their roster, but isn't that odd, since Venice was a merchant republic, and did not adopt feudalism? I think a more appropriate unit would be something like high-end mercenaries, since Venice hired mercenaries instead of engaging in warfare themselves. Also, Italian mercenaries were quite renowned in the medieval Europe.
    Nah, if you take Rome, just force feed the pope cash so he likes you a lot then you can get him to un-excommunicate you and so on.

    Also, the AI tends to go wild if it sees a settlement it can beat with a stack, which means that little random town on the border... or maybe just a random port. The game also just hits your reputation for being in a war...

    Just pretend the feudal knights are mercenary heavy mailed lance cavalry if you like. Or just mercenary (landless) knights or whatever. The "broken lance" mercenary knights are one of those late units that show up at turn 600 or something (plate armor wearing).

  20. #3680

    Default Re: SSHIP - General Discussion

    So the pope is has hunger for lands which can be satisfied with tons of cash. Seems like my impression was not very far off.

    Paying off the pope may be a solution, but the problem is that pope excommunicates me too often. The case I mentioned above, which I killed a pope, elected another of mine, got an alliance, only to get excommunicated again all happened is a span of several turns. AI doesn't seem to bother about peace treaty as well, so I think they would take the money and soon come back for more. The pope is really more like a gangster at this point.
    Maybe I should give Lithuania a try and exterminate Rome into space.

    The AI aggression seems to be not only a papacy thing but AI in general. Does this mean that papacy just excommunicate anyone they attack, rather than attack someone they excommunicate? That seems quiet broken, since excommunication doesn't only declare war but damages public order and diplomacy. Is it possible to set a different AI for different faction?

    Also, is it possible to remove papacy? I just thought that they had a sort of immortal script that prevents them from getting destroyed. Or is it that they had a settlement somewhere far away and only the pope was spawning outside Rome?

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •