SSHIP - General Discussion

[kostic]

One question, did you guys disable the destruction of buildings when you Sack/Exterminate? I exterminated Seville and Cordoba and noticed the buildings seemed the same. The only downgrade I noticed was the Plantation becoming mere Irrigation (and it was a Large City, Plantations should not even have been available).

I think that that is a great change. In the vanilla game Extermination did so much damage to the region buildings that it was a horrible decision to do. Now it actually makes sense sometimes.

Interesting note. I almost never destroy a city after conquering it, but it seems to me that damage to buildings should be logical in the event of extermination and even in the event of looting, although in the latter case the same damage should be mitigated.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Interesting note. I almost never destroy a city after conquering it, but it seems to me that damage to buildings should be logical in the event of extermination and even in the event of looting, although in the latter case the same damage should be mitigated.

In the future for certain cities there'll be some probability of certain core buildings damaged. We may diffenciate depending on many factors, to be seen where we land.

	;------------------------------------------------------------------------------  WROCLAW	
    declare_counter current_name_Wroclaw		; 0 - Wroclaw, 1 - Breslau, 2 - Vuartizlau
    set_counter current_name_Wroclaw 0
	
    monitor_event GeneralCaptureSettlement SettlementName Wroclaw


		if I_EventCounter faction_turn_poland = 1				; Poland: Wroclaw


			change_settlement_name Wroclaw Wroclaw
			
			if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1 
			and I_CompareCounter current_name_Wroclaw > 0
				historic_event CONQUERED_WROCLAW_PL  factions { poland, hre, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, }
			end_if
		
			set_counter current_name_Wroclaw 0		
		end_if


		if I_EventCounter faction_turn_orthodox = 1				; Orthodox: Wroclaw


			change_settlement_name Wroclaw Wroclaw
			
			if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1 
			and I_CompareCounter current_name_Wroclaw > 0
				historic_event CONQUERED_WROCLAW  factions { poland, hre, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, }
			end_if
		
			set_counter current_name_Wroclaw 0		
		end_if
		
		if I_EventCounter faction_turn_catholic = 1				; Catholic factions but Poland: Breslau
		and not I_EventCounter faction_turn_poland = 1


			change_settlement_name Wroclaw WroclawGerman
			
			if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1 
			and I_CompareCounter current_name_Wroclaw < 1
				historic_event CONQUERED_WROCLAW  factions { poland, hre, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, }
			end_if


			if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1 
			and I_CompareCounter current_name_Wroclaw > 1
				historic_event CONQUERED_WROCLAW  factions { poland, hre, denmark, hungary, lithuania, kievan_rus, russia, }
			end_if
			
			set_counter current_name_Wroclaw 1		
		end_if
	
		if I_EventCounter faction_turn_pagan = 1				; Pagan: Vuartizlau


			change_settlement_name Wroclaw WroclawPagan
			
			if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1 
			and I_CompareCounter current_name_Wroclaw < 2
				historic_event SETTLEMENT_NAME_CHANGE
			end_if
		
			set_counter current_name_Wroclaw 2	
		end_if
		
        if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1						; additional 10% turmoil for H/VH difficulties 
		and I_EventCounter DifficultyLevel > 2
		and RandomPercent < 66
            add_settlement_turmoil Wroclaw 2
		end_if


        if I_EventCounter is_the_player = 1						; building destroyed for VH difficulty
		and I_EventCounter DifficultyLevel > 3
		and RandomPercent < 66
			console_command set_building_health Wroclaw hinterland_roads 60
		end_if
		
    end_monitor

Coward - here you've got the relevant part of the code.

;--------------------------------------------------------- Coward from Battles

;------------------------------------------ very unlikely on autoresolve
Trigger BattleCoward_No_Killed_Enemies
 WhenToTest PostBattle


 Condition IsGeneral
       and BattleOdds < 3.0
       and GeneralNumKillsInBattle < 2


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 33


;------------------------------------------
Trigger BattleCoward_Only_Weak_Enemies
 WhenToTest PostBattle


 Condition IsGeneral
       and BattleOdds < 2.0
       and PercentageBodyguardKilled < 10


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 33 


;------------------------------------------
Trigger BattleCoward_No_Real_Fight
 WhenToTest PostBattle


 Condition IsGeneral
       and BattleOdds < 1.0
       and PercentageBodyguardKilled < 20


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 33 
 
;------------------------------------------
Trigger BattleCoward_Loss_Without_Fight
 WhenToTest PostBattle


 Condition IsGeneral
       and BattleOdds <= 3
       and not WonBattle
       and PercentageEnemyKilled < 30
       and PercentageBodyguardKilled < 50


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 33 


;------------------------------------------
Trigger BattleCoward_Routed
 WhenToTest BattleGeneralRouted


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 70
 Affects Coward 1 Chance 20
 
;------------------------------------------
Trigger Coward_Withdraws
 WhenToTest PreBattleWithdrawal


 Condition WasAttacker


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 20 


;------------------------------------------
Trigger Coward_Withdraw_Before_Battle_Even_Odds
 WhenToTest PreBattleWithdrawal


 Condition IsGeneral
       and I_WithdrawsBeforeBattle
       and BattleOdds > 0.7
       and BattleOdds < 1.75


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 50 


;--------------------------------------------------------- Brave and Coward - other reasons


;------------------------------------------
Trigger Coward_In_City
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


 Condition IsGeneral
       and EndedInSettlement
       and RemainingMPPercentage > 95
       and SettlementBuildingExists > wooden_wall
       and RandomPercent > 50


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 2


;------------------------------------------
Trigger Brave_Selfperpetuating_OldAge
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


 Condition Trait Brave > 2
       and Trait Senile > 0 
	   and Trait Haemophobic < 1
	   
 Affects Brave 1 Chance 10 


;------------------------------------------
Trigger Coward_Selfperpetuating
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


 Condition Trait Coward > 0
       and Trait Wantschool < 1 


 Affects Coward 1 Chance 2


;------------------------------------------
Trigger Coward_NoGoingBack
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


 Condition IsGeneral
       and Trait Coward < 5
       and Trait Coward > 3
	   
 Affects Coward 10 Chance 100 


;--- AI doesnt know how to deal with this trait -----
Trigger AI_Coward_Normalization
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


Condition not FactionIsLocal
       and Trait Coward > 0


 Affects Coward -1 Chance 10 
 Affects Coward 1 Chance 3 


;------------------------------------------
Trigger AI_Brave_Normalization
 WhenToTest CharacterTurnEnd


Condition not FactionIsLocal
       and Trait Brave > 0


 Affects Brave 1 Chance 10 
 Affects Brave -1 Chance 5

[Nemesis2345]

OK, I did use him in combat though. Should have specified. It seems you have to use the general a lot to avoid Coward and want to stock up on Brave points as much as possible. I always try to use generals somewhat but maybe I have to more in this mod.

The trigger seems really harsh but I will keep playing before forming a strong opinion.

.

What were the odds? If your army has 1000 troops and the enemy 200 , there are chances he gets Coward because it is not considered an honorable fight , more like a massacre xD. U can also get dread for that i think.

[Steward Denethor II]

None of my generals had overwhelming favorable odds and they always fought and never routed. However they did not always take the most dangerous positions I admit.

About extermination, in the vanilla game it would destroy so many buildings that Extermination was almost always a terrible idea. It set the settlement back decades. I think removing that penalty was the right call, otherwise Extermination is just a bad option, by far the worst.

Another problem with extermination is that it actually gives far less gold than sacking!



Edit: what does the new patch do, should I start over?

[Nemesis2345]

None of my generals had overwhelming favorable odds and they always fought and never routed. However they did not always take the most dangerous positions I admit.

About extermination, in the vanilla game it would destroy so many buildings that Extermination was almost always a terrible idea. It set the settlement back decades. I think removing that penalty was the right call, otherwise Extermination is just a bad option, by far the worst.

Another problem with extermination is that it actually gives far less gold than sacking!



Edit: what does the new patch do, should I start over?

Sacking is indeed made to give you more gold.
Extermination is supposed to give you public order tho.

I presonally used to sack cities i couldnt hold but i could easily attack such as Alexandria , and other Fatmid cities as Jerusalem . Excelent amounts of cash from them ,but impossible to hold unless later in the game.
Extermination i only used in provinces i inteded to keep and i didnt want to deal with the public order hit.

[Steward Denethor II]

Yeah sacking would be good for a hit and run operation, with Crusades as you mentioned. As a European power you could sack the Egyptians and then give/sell the regions to the Crusader States.

As the Christian Iberian factions you want to Exterminate the regions in Southern Spain because they are really big and of a different faith. That is the only way you can effectively rush the enemy. If you just sack or worse occupy you will have to move much slower.

There is a reputation loss for Extermination, but in this mod your reputation is always so bad if you are expanding so there is no point in worrying. I think Occupy/Sack/Exterminate are all well balanced in this mod, more so than vanilla or SS.

I've played a little more, and confirmed something. If you Sack or Exterminate a region, and it has a building that required a higher settlement level, then it gets downgraded to the appropriate level (or destroyed if there is no appropriate level). For example I conquered the Balearic Islands. That region is only a Town, but it has a Port, which requires a Large Town. If I sack or exterminate, the Port gets torched, if I occupy, it is not torched. Same thing happened to a Large Town I took from the Moors, the Caravanersary was downgraded to a Caravan Stop when I sacked/exterminated (I didn't like torching that building but the Public Order was just too bad.) That seems to be the only time buildings get downgraded but I will keep my eye open.

Also the video is not displaying properly above, I'll try to fix.

[j.a.luna]

Jurand talking about new version 0.9.8, i think that you could take a look to the independent settlement of Pamplona, it shoud be independent kingdom as Kingdom of Navarra, Aragon should not have this settlement, and also should have a full garrison would avoid a quick conquest and make it difficult to take this small kingdom, I leave you here the link with all the information on this subject.


https://www.twcenter.net/forums/show...?801634-ARAGON

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Navarre

[Jurand of Cracow]

Jurand talking about new version 0.9.8, i think that you could take a look to the independent settlement of Pamplona, it shoud be independent kingdom as Kingdom of Navarra, Aragon should not have this settlement, and also should have a full garrison would avoid a quick conquest and make it difficult to take this small kingdom

Yep, I remember it, I have it in my notes.

[j.a.luna]

Yep, I remember it, I have it in my notes.

Ok thanks Jurand, you know that this independence kingdom was historical.

[kostic]

I find the game download thread confusing. The player thinks he is downloading SSHIP 0.9.7 (patch G included) when he is actually only downloading the patch.

[Jurand of Cracow]

I find the game download thread confusing. The player thinks he is downloading SSHIP 0.9.7 (patch G included) when he is actually only downloading the patch.

He is downloading the SSHIP, not the patch. But the SSHIP is a submod of the SS, so he's got to download and install the SS beforehand.

[Belovèse]

I don't know the TWCenter policies well on that subject, but is there something that prevent us from packaging a single SS+SSHIP download, while giving due credit to the SS team of course, and clearly stating that SSHIP is based on it as a submod?

It would avoid reports linked to faulty installation and save time both for players and SSHIP team.

Sent from my FP2 using Tapatalk

[kostic]

@JOC: Well no, the SSHIP 0.97 with patch G link leads to the SSHIP 097 patch G page, a 518MB file, while the SSHIP 0.9.7 version does a lot more (4,42Go).


@Belovèse: The idea seems good to me if it is possible. The difficulty is to make a version that works equally well for English and non-English games.

[j.a.luna]

@JOC: Well no, the SSHIP 0.97 with patch G link leads to the SSHIP 097 patch G page, a 518MB file, while the SSHIP 0.9.7 version does a lot more (4,42Go).

Yes , same opinion. It is a bit confusing for new players.

[Jurand of Cracow]

@JOC: Well no, the SSHIP 0.97 with patch G link leads to the SSHIP 097 patch G page, a 518MB file, while the SSHIP 0.9.7 version does a lot more (4,42Go).

@Belovèse: The idea seems good to me if it is possible. The difficulty is to make a version that works equally well for English and non-English games.

Ah, yes, you're indeed right. I'll prepare one install file then.

@Belo: I think the issue with DaC (submod for TATW) was exactly that. They wanted to make one instal, acknowledging that they're a submod, but they're forbidden and expelled from the TWC.

[Steward Denethor II]

That is what happened, yes, but that is because before he left King Kong explicitly said that submods need to require a Third Age Total War installation to use his work.

I'm pretty sure the Stainless Steel team did not say that; Titanium and RR/RC 2.0 beta don't require a Stainless Steel install IIRC.

[j.a.luna]

sship developers, a question regarding ships.
in this mod is it possible to block strait / channel with the ships so that the troops do not pass?
for example blocking the Strait of Gibraltar so that the Moors do not pass.
How many boats do you need?

[RodriguesSting]

sship developers, a question regarding ships.
in this mod is it possible to block strait / channel with the ships so that the troops do not pass?
for example blocking the Strait of Gibraltar so that the Moors do not pass.
How many boats do you need?

Gibraltar is not crossible. In fact, I am pretty confident, that we don't see these "crossing bridges" from EB2 in this mod at all. If you see water that's wider than a river, gotta use boats.

[Jurand of Cracow]

Gibraltar is not crossible. In fact, I am pretty confident, that we don't see these "crossing bridges" from EB2 in this mod at all. If you see water that's wider than a river, gotta use boats.

Indeed.

That is what happened, yes, but that is because before he left King Kong explicitly said that submods need to require a Third Age Total War installation to use his work.
I'm pretty sure the Stainless Steel team did not say that; Titanium and RR/RC 2.0 beta don't require a Stainless Steel install IIRC.

ok, this means we can make download in one file. Thanks!

[DavidofLaSalle]

Hello Everyone,
Long time lurker, first time poster.
First of all, thank you JoC and team for all your hard work and dedication, it is truly appreciated. I have been playing TW since my friend lent me his new game "Shogun" back at the turn of millennium. By far, this mod is the most enjoyable form of Total War I've come across. At the end of the day, SSHIP is like a comfort food; something that soothes the soul after a long day of work. Thank you all once again!
I am currently completing a Portuguese campaign using 0.97 + Patch E. I also implemented Belovese's redundant script fix from January 4, 2021. I am at over 500 turns and have encountered an interesting phenomenon. For some reason, my previous generation of family members all decided to become unfaithful at the same time. All my new male family members that come of age are illegitimate. I thought this was interesting. I was wondering what actions promote the appearance of illegitimate children? Any information would be welcome.
Thank you again!
All the best, DoL