EU - A Socialist Organisation ?

[Dracula]

The far right parties are suppressed in EU. The traditionalist and nationalist ones are viewed as smth troublesome by Brussel's bureaucracy. Independance of all countries has been so far curtailed. To be suspicious of jews is a crime, even officially in some states.

Even in Austria ,when you walk downtown Vienna, the majority of the palaces are confiscated by the Republic, not private property. Even my grandmother's Palais Coburg is considered republican property.

Does EU move to repeat the Soviet Union ? Fighting people who should have property and position by inheritance and rank ? The proportional taxes ? Has the situation overturned with Russia becoming more and more capitalistic ?

http://www.presseurop.eu/en/content/article/2369111-eu-socialist-mummy





People who regulated what cucumbers to be marinated in jars. It's a dangerous party. It forbids ..in the end the development of personality.

[Greymane]

The far right parties are suppressed in EU. The traditionalist and nationalist ones are viewed as smth troublesome by Brussel's bureaucracy. Independance of all countries has been so far curtailed. To be suspicious of jews is a crime, even officially in some states.

Even in Austria ,when you walk downtown Vienna, the majority of the palaces are confiscated by the Republic, not private property. Even my grandmother's Palais Coburg is considered republican property.

Does EU move to repeat the Soviet Union ? Fighting people who should have property and position by inheritance and rank ? The proportional taxes ? Has the situation overturned with Russia becoming more and more capitalistic ?

I would argue it's rather the opposite. Yes, the far-right parties are mostly ignored or demonised (sometimes rightly so), but so are most left-wing parties. The economic right and traditional Christian parties are currently in power in the EU and they are also (at least in the Netherlands) the most vocal supporters of the EU. Here we have 1 far-right party, the PVV, and one party that is pretty left wing, SP (how far is up for debate, for me they are pretty left-wing, for others they are almost communist). Both are oppossed to the EU (PVV wants out, SP wants to completely redefine the EU and give it much less power over sovereign countries). Both are looked down upon by all the other parties that are all pro-EU. We are talking Social Democrat to rather extreme Liberal here.

The EUSSR nickname, while funny, does not represent the economic stance the EU has (which is rather pro free trade and open markets and all that), but more the authoritarian character that is ascribed to the organisation. Property getting confiscated because people can't pay their debts is capitalism in optima forma. What is and is not state-property is more likely to be due to the policies of individual countries than because of the EU. In cases like Greece, the EU has quite a say in what that country does, but the measures that Greece has to take are anything but communist. The same goes for the Netherlands and (other?) countries that are doing rather well. If my rather basic knowlegde of Sovjet Russia is an indicator, state debt and inflation are not things they cared a whole lot about.

[Dracula]

I presume the Netherlands have retained more independance, but it is not the case all through it. Besides you are a monarchy, while in all republics the situation is rather different.

[Greymane]

I presume the Netherlands have retained more independance, but it is not the case all through it. Besides you are a monarchy, while in all republics the situation is rather different.

We are a monarchy in name only.
The king has about as much power as I have and that is not a whole lot. His entire function is ceremonial.
He get's to stand on the stairs of his palace with the new government, they take a picture and that's it.
And you should see some of the debates on Dutch forums about the evil capitalists trying to sell us out the EUSSR
Not that I entirely disagree...
But anyway: we have about the same level of independence as any country that is not under EU supervision because of their terrible economic situation.

[justicar5]

The EU is neo-liberal and always has been, sometimes it is leftist, but mostly it is about capitalism.

[Mayer]

we europeans are somewhat more tough on opposition than for example the USA but that doesn't mean we live in socialism (although there are like a thousand definitions for the term..), for the eurosceptics it is harder to get a political platform because our leaders pursue a policy of european unification,i.e. aim for a United States of Europe

What i don't understand why you so dislike that palaces (and by extension other cultural property) are entrusted to governmental authorities.
At least they consider it as non-profit value and aim to preserve its condition. Whereas a random private person could sell off parts, modify the place or organize gay parties /other derogatory events inside.
Of course, states have not always preserved old buildings and it can always be that it falls victim to urban planning à la Le Corbusier.

[Roma_Victrix]

To be suspicious of jews is a crime, even officially in some states.

It's one thing to be suspicious of individuals for crimes, like the American Jewish stockbroker Bernard Madoff who was convicted in 2009 of operating an enormous fraudulent Ponzi scheme that cost his clients millions (his many victims included other fellow Jews, though).

It's another thing to rant and rave on a street corner about Jewish cabals and a Jewish conspiracy to steal all the money, like Borat says:



That's the sort of thing that leads to, you know, expelling all the Jews from England for hundreds of years, random massacres of Jews in townships over the centuries, and more recently, the Holocaust of Nazi Germany.

Even in Austria ,when you walk downtown Vienna, the majority of the palaces are confiscated by the Republic, not private property. Even my grandmother's Palais Coburg is considered republican property.

That I have a little sympathy for, unless the buildings are ancient, historic national treasures and landmarks in need of UNESCO protection, maintenance, and proper preservation.

Does EU move to repeat the Soviet Union ? Fighting people who should have property and position by inheritance and rank ?

Who are you? The Prince of Wallachia? I bet you miss the good old days, right? When the monarchical Congress of Vienna (1814-1815) decided the order of the day.

At least they consider it as non-profit value and aim to preserve its condition. Whereas a random private person could sell off parts, modify the place or organize gay parties /other derogatory events inside.

The horror! The horror!

The newly appointed socialist leader of the EU in Brussels:

[Kiliç Alì]

Also to say that EU is going towards left-oriented politics is sadly (at least here) untrue.

In Italy, we've had right now one of the most right-oriented cabinets in our history (beside fascism, and even that was supposed to be an alternative to capitalism in the beginning) wich was Monti, who was praised by EU politicians but basically axed down most of the small and little enterprises. Lots of communitary funds were given to banks and big industries to avoid them failing, and then they re-localised in low-cost foregn-but-still-communitary countries, such as Poland, telling the workers they had had to move if they still wanted their job.

But seriusly, the matter here isn't about nationalisms or being suspectful towards anyone, it's about primary necessities such as health and food. To still speak in terms of "communism vs capitalism" or yelling every time about soviet russia won't bring any good, unfortunately even there politicians still scream "Help! Help! The communits!" just to cast some more votes. I guess their voters are really to blame tought, they're just doing their "job".

[Hakkapeliitta]

I wish it was.

[Earl Dibbles Jr]

I wish it was.

Please elaborate how Socialism's benefits outweight its negatives. Better yet, tell me why it should replace Capitalism.

[Greymane]

Please elaborate how Socialism's benefits outweight its negatives. Better yet, tell me why it should replace Capitalism.

Oh god... Not another debate of socialism versus capitalism without universal definition!
Anyway, I'm going to guess by his name that Hakkapeliitta is from Finland, so he probably means the social model attributed to the Scandinavian countries as opposed to the more liberal course the EU now has.
As has been covered in at least two threads since I joined this forum, in Europe such a system is called socialism.
It might not be what Dracula means though, I have yet to read the article added since the thread has been reopened...

[Mayer]

And no, old buildings are not well maintained. In Vienna you want to visit a church you pay 7-8 euro. Not to speak about palaces. It's absolutely disgusting, like selling everything at the market. it's not what these things were built and stand for.Looks like prostitution. With the owner are better 100 times.

You believe a private owner would not try to capitalize on the property? If anything he would try more ways to get money out of it (since he doesn't tolerate losses), therefore my example of hosted parties, conversion or simply sell-out.
when you talk about original owners as the royalty, well in essence they were the state at the time

[ShockBlast]

Please elaborate how Socialism's benefits outweight its negatives. Better yet, tell me why it should replace Capitalism.

Are you aware that Socialism is a political ideology and capitalism is a theoretical economy system? How can you even compare them?

Compare Socialism with Liberalism, Social Democracy, Conservatorism etc.

You compare Capitalism with Mixed Market Economy or Planned Economy.

Edit.
Greymane illustrated something that happens to ideologies, unlike economic systems, they evolve.In Europe when you say Socialism people will assume you are talking about Democratic Socialism more then they will assume one speaks about Totalitarian Socialism.

[justicar5]

Please elaborate how Socialism's benefits outweight its negatives. Better yet, tell me why it should replace Capitalism.

profits going to the people who do the work rather than buying a republican his third gram of cocaine and second Iraqi or Afghani war orphan to rape to death that day is a good one. The only people with human rights being humans, not violent and oppressive legal fictions is another.

It's recommended to read the link.

As for palaces, a communist state expropriates them, a normall one leaves to the owner, even if he intended to hold alien parties in there every day. Likewise, bureaucracy and sticking one's nose where is not their business. That's why people get poor, even, as I hear in Italy, planning and destruction of enterpreneurship and independance, as well as the leadership of the old high class.

And no, old buildings are not well maintained. In Vienna you want to visit a church you pay 7-8 euro. Not to speak about palaces. It's absolutely disgusting, like selling everything at the market. it's not what these things were built and stand for.Looks like prostitution. With the owner are better 100 times.

p.s. this thread is not about the jews but leftist and crazy policy

The Palais Coburg is a luxury hotel, and has been since the family sold it in the 1970s, no theft their. Are you really claiming to be a member of the House Saxe-Coburg and Gotha btw? Because that gives a really short list of who you could be. Especially with a morgantic widow (Princess Aurelia [awesome name that]) as a grand mother, the woman who sold it. That would also make you a distant relative of the British Royal family.

[ahawkTW]

profits going to the people who do the work rather than buying a republican his third gram of cocaine and second Iraqi or Afghani war orphan to rape to death that day is a good one. The only people with human rights being humans, not violent and oppressive legal fictions is another.

Because that's how it worked in Soviet Russia, right? Or what about Maoist China? Socialism only works against those providing worthwhile services and innovation that keeps the economy rolling.

[justicar5]

Because that's how it worked in Soviet Russia, right? Or what about Maoist China? Socialism only works against those providing worthwhile services and innovation that keeps the economy rolling.

So you condone the massive death toll of violated children that capitalist CEOs need to get out of bed in the morning? WOW you support child rape..nice.


On a more serious note, if you look at what is actually happening most working people in the first world haven't had a real terms pay rise since the 1970s, 'trickle down' is a lie, it is more accurately called trickle up, or to be 100% accurate: Theft, the largest systematic theft in the history of the human race. productivity is increasing, profits are increasing, wages are stagnant as all that extra work and effort is stolen by the parasitic management class.

[Dracula]

It's recommended to read the link.

As for palaces, a communist state expropriates them, a normall one leaves to the owner, even if he intended to hold alien parties in there every day. Likewise, bureaucracy and sticking one's nose where is not their business. That's why people get poor, even, as I hear in Italy, planning and destruction of enterpreneurship and independance, as well as the leadership of the old high class.

And no, old buildings are not well maintained. In Vienna you want to visit a church you pay 7-8 euro. Not to speak about palaces. It's absolutely disgusting, like selling everything at the market. it's not what these things were built and stand for.Looks like prostitution. With the owner are better 100 times.

p.s. this thread is not about the jews but leftist and crazy policy

[ShockBlast]

The Palais Coburg is a luxury hotel, and has been since the family sold it in the 1970s, no theft their. Are you really claiming to be a member of the House Saxe-Coburg and Gotha btw? Because that gives a really short list of who you could be. Especially with a morgantic widow (Princess Aurelia [awesome name that]) as a grand mother, the woman who sold it. That would also make you a distant relative of the British Royal family.

Is any member of the British Royal family visiting or staying in Bulgaria since Moesia Superior is the Roman name for a province who coincides with modern day Bulgaria, more or less.

[Condottiere 40K]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Dracula]

Modern Euro corporation - you have two cows, but you must be happy because in Europe this means that you have 200 cows.

p.s. The Palais Coburg actually belonged to Princess Clementine d'Órleans, my great--grand-mother.