Mongol Horse archers using machine guns?

**High Fist** · May 07, 2014, 03:46 PM

Uh oh. I just started a Khwarezmian campaign.

**Geoffrey of Villehardouin** · May 07, 2014, 05:07 PM

Originally Posted by High Fist

Uh oh. I just started a Khwarezmian campaign.

Have fun while it lasts.

**High Fist** · May 07, 2014, 06:37 PM

I am, that's the worst part.

Looks like I'm gonna have to abandon any prospects of defending Samarkand. Any tips for fighting them? For how long do they keep spawning stacks?

**Delvecchio1975** · May 08, 2014, 08:03 AM

If surviving is your main the Mongols is your aim, you can open diplomacy immediately when they show up, offer them your northernmost settlement (your capital, if i remember correctly, so you'll need to move it first) in exchange for peace, and then second you offer your one but northernmost settlement in exchange for an alliance. Depending on the AI you play with such an alliance should be pretty stable. The Mongols then will leave you alone long enough for your to beef up your defences and conquer the middle east to the point that you don't even need to fear the Mongols anymore.

**Strengelicher** · May 08, 2014, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by Delvecchio1975

If surviving is your main the Mongols is your aim, you can open diplomacy immediately when they show up, offer them your northernmost settlement (your capital, if i remember correctly, so you'll need to move it first) in exchange for peace, and then second you offer your one but northernmost settlement in exchange for an alliance. Depending on the AI you play with such an alliance should be pretty stable. The Mongols then will leave you alone long enough for your to beef up your defences and conquer the middle east to the point that you don't even need to fear the Mongols anymore.

Hmmm... are you sure? I have a dim memory that during the first turns some Mongol attacks are scripted and are incompatible with certain diplomacy options. I once played a K-shah campaign and the weirdest things happened. I once posted it somewhere on the forums, but can't remember where...

**Geoffrey of Villehardouin** · May 08, 2014, 10:44 AM

That's a clever trick, Delvecchio. Totalwar_legend danced about in their rear with forts. However, if they decide to have a go at you with several stacks, it is doubtful you can manage to delay them forever with that tactic. As far as I remember, the Mongols spawn 5 stacks for every defeat they suffer from any faction in the first 60 game turns in a late campaign. After that they slow down and I believe they stop spawning stacks after game turn 100. You can check the campaign script.

**+Marius+** · May 09, 2014, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by Geoffrey of Villehardouin

As far as I remember, the Mongols spawn 5 stacks for every defeat they suffer from any faction in the first 60 game turns in a late campaign.

Holy Mother of baby Jesus how can I lower this value?
That is just unfair, no point in playing late campaign if half the factions I hoped to war against are dead by the time I fend off the French.

**Geoffrey of Villehardouin** · May 10, 2014, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by Marius Marich

Holy Mother of baby Jesus how can I lower this value?
That is just unfair, no point in playing late campaign if half the factions I hoped to war against are dead by the time I fend off the French.

I had worked that out some time ago but I was not all that sure last night when I checked again where the triggers were. I think the 5 stack reinforcements are available up to game turn 50 not 60, after which the Mongols receive smaller reinforcements. You should be safe, if you are playing a faction near France.

**+Marius+** · May 10, 2014, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by Geoffrey of Villehardouin

You should be safe, if you are playing a faction near France.

I do not care about my safety.
I care about the survival of the eastern factions until I arrive there.
Again, is there any way to reduce the number of spawned stacks from 5 to 1?

**Geoffrey of Villehardouin** · May 11, 2014, 04:40 AM

Originally Posted by Marius Marich

I do not care about my safety.
I care about the survival of the eastern factions until I arrive there.
Again, is there any way to reduce the number of spawned stacks from 5 to 1?

The problem with the campaign_script events is that there are many triggers, and if the Mongol reinforcements do not trigger in fives but in fours, they may trigger more often, so as to reach the same ceiling. In any case, the reinforcements are under the Golden Horde Emergent section. Somewhere there are five armies under the subheading ;--ai part. Their generals have random names. These are the reinforcements at the peak of the Golden Horde invasion triggered by that monitor. Maybe you could delete one of them.

Or just play on easy or normal difficulty.

The Mongols do not seem to destroy more factions than they did historically. The issue with this situation (which only really triggers on hard and very hard) is if the Mongols come in contact with the human player, as they will be losing some battles, they will be spawning stacks beyond measure.

Edit: changes to the campaign_script are not savegame compatible, you would have to start a new campaign.

**Delvecchio1975** · May 08, 2014, 10:57 AM

I'm sure it works, I have a campaign save to prove it, something like twenty turns after the mongols invade. it's with the average backstabber AI (can never remember the names, not the crazy one and not the lame one). It's played on M/M though, perhaps on higher diff levels the Mongols won't accept peace deals?

**Strengelicher** · May 09, 2014, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by Delvecchio1975

I'm sure it works, I have a campaign save to prove it, something like twenty turns after the mongols invade. it's with the average backstabber AI (can never remember the names, not the crazy one and not the lame one). It's played on M/M though, perhaps on higher diff levels the Mongols won't accept peace deals?

If you say 20 turns after the mongols invade, I presume you are referring to an early campaign? I was talking about a late campaign, maybe the late campaign is scripted differently? But I would not stress the point, it has been quite some time. The average backstabber campaign AI is Savage. And the difficulty settings should not affect scripted behaviour IIRC. I presume I played the late K-shah campaign on vh/vh because I have basically never changed those settings, and I can confirm they do accept peace treaties on vh/vh. The Mongols I mean.