Modding Summit report

[baptistus]

From the modding summit.
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...4#post13792961

Diplomacy

Q : Will CA modify diplomacy, for instance adding « region trade/exchange » ?
A : No

But CA said in october:

about new diplomatic options (october 2013):

There are general plans but we can’t commit to anything yet.

http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...ion-amp-Answer

And I ask answer about it since weeks and don't have any answer
http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...politic-system
So only a modder have enough courage to announce it to the community ?

So how it is possible to trust CA about the improvment of the siege battles and the politics system now ?


edit: I asked Wangrim to give to me more informations about this "no".

If I recall correctly, it was during the discussion with the CAI team.
When I refer to my notes, in the chapter about the Campaign, I can only read :

• trading region : no

When the subject has been discussed, the answer was clearly no from the CAI team.
Adding a "trading region" feature need to modify the CAI to make it able to use this features.

Modders cannot do it because they have no access to CAI.
So, only CA could do it.

About other diplomatic options, I cannot recall (Modding Summit was more than one month and a half ago).
But, each time that it involves deep code modifications, they are quite reluctant.

So, if players really want to see such feature, and they are many, maybe CA will do something, like they have done for seasons.

[Templar Knight]

Let's be honest here, when you receive an answer like "there are general plans but we can't commit to anything yet" it is a pretty safe bet that that was just some quick bs to move on to a different question. I'm not just talking about CA, if anyone gives that kind of answer to a question it almost always is not a good sign at all.

[baptistus]

they said the same about siege AI and about LUA. So we can conclude we will never see real improvment for siege AI?....
Marketing, communication, lies , name it as you want, I will not forget it.

Thank you for this long report.
There is not a lot of interesting answers (only one or two), but it is not your fault

[Templar Knight]

they said the same about siege AI and politics. So we can conclude we will never see real improvment for siege AI and politics systems ?....
Marketing, communication, lies , name it as you want, I will not forget it. And I can commit to it.

All I can say is that I sure as hell have concluded that I will never see a real improvement to those systems. Time after time I have seen "fixed siege AI" in the patch notes, and yet it still sucks and and the magic torches still exist. I hate to go tinfoil hatter, but I still think that those ****ing torches are only there to try and camouflage the completely flaccid siege AI.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't try and hold CA accountable to what they said, if fact we as a community should, I'm just saying that when i see an answer like what you quoted in your OP I just don't get my hopes up at all.

[Kinjo]

As far as what was asked at the modding summit; it was more along the lines of was it possible to mod this feature back in since there were remnants of the gift/trade region feature hidden in the game files. The answer was obviously no, one of the reasons given was there is no code for the Ai to handle it in diplomacy.

What was said in October 2013 is unrelated because one has to do with modding and the other is a feature that might potentially be implemented by the dev team. Trust me I'm all for this feature making a return, but your thread is taking things a little out of context to be fair.

[baptistus]

As far as what was asked at the modding summit; it was more along the lines of was it possible to mod this feature back in since there were remnants of the gift/trade region feature hidden in the game files. The answer was obviously no, one of the reasons given was there is no code for the Ai to handle it in diplomacy.

What was said in October 2013 is unrelated because one has to do with modding and the other is a feature that might potentially be implemented by the dev team. Trust me I'm all for this feature making a returning, but your thread is taking things a little out of context to be fair.

I had asked Wangrim to give to me more informations before to create this topic (because "no" is a too short answer). You can copy the text to the google translation. I am not very good in english (I think everybody already see it lol) so I can not translate the text.
But it talks about new diplomatic options, and not only about the possibility to add new options with mods.

[GideonAI]

As far as what was asked at the modding summit; it was more along the lines of was it possible to mod this feature back in since there were remnants of the gift/trade region feature hidden in the game files. The answer was obviously no, one of the reasons given was there is no code for the Ai to handle it in diplomacy.

Similar to how we can't just put guns into Rome 2 even though there are various files dedicated to firearms, as they cut out all the background code for it.

[Epic28]

Appreciate the write up Wangrin.

Unfortunately there seems to be very few positives taken from this regarding CA's Assembly kit and the future of Rome 2. Majority of the answers regarding modding some of the heavy factors for Rome 2 seem to be a flat-out "No" or "Not possible".

Even when there is potential to release new tools to the Assembly kit, this is the answer CA presented?

1. User Interface (UI)
   Q : Would it be possible to modify UI and even add new functionalities/things ?
   A : A UI developer confirmed that it is possible to modify UI appearance. This means you are able to modify textures and the UI layout/placement.
   But, it is not possible to add new UI linked to new functionalities.
   
   CA could eventually provide a UI placement tool. But we agreed that being able to rework UI layout wasn’t a top priority.

Really? You ALL agree that being able to change your UI, which many people have shown displeasure for constantly since release and even prior to, isn't a top priority?

I am curious as to what is defined as a "top priority" seeing that practically nothing can be made accessible from the Assembly kit.

My top 3 issues with Rome 2.

Siege AI
Unfinished Political System
User Interface

[wangrin]

If I recall correctly, it was during the discussion with the CAI team.
When I refer to my notes, in the chapter about the Campaign, I can only read :

• trading region : no

When the subject has been discussed, the answer was clearly no from the CAI team.
Adding a "trading region" feature need to modify the CAI to make it able to use this features.

Modders cannot do it because they have no access to CAI.
So, only CA could do it.

About other diplomatic options, I cannot recall (Modding Summit was more than one month and a half ago).
But, each time that it involves deep code modifications, they are quite reluctant.

So, if players really want to see such feature, and they are many, maybe CA will do something, like they have done for seasons.

A top priorities could be, for instance :

• tools to edit/create campaign map
• tools to edit battlemap
• More raw models to understand how to create buildings (non-garrisonable, garrisonable, positioning artillery), ships with artillery on board, siege and artillery engine, etc.
• plugin to create EFline for garrisonable buildings
• tools to edit/create our own music
• LUA/LUAC sources
• etc.

Moreover, you can already modify UI appearance.
The tool would only allow to move button and windows, not to create new ones.

Siege AI and "unfinished" Political System are not in the modders' range.
Only CA can do something here.

[baptistus]

If I recall correctly, it was during the discussion with the CAI team.
When I refer to my notes, in the chapter about the Campaign, I can only read :

• trading region : no

When the subject has been discussed, the answer was clearly no from the CAI team.
Adding a "trading region" feature need to modify the CAI to make it able to use this features.

Modders cannot do it because they have no access to CAI.
So, only CA could do it.

About other diplomatic options, I cannot recall (Modding Summit was more than one month and a half ago).
But, each time that it involves deep code modifications, they are quite reluctant.

So, if players really want to see such feature, and they are many, maybe CA will do something, like they have done for seasons.

thank you very much to give more informations
so no hope. The Q&A was only a marketing communication, nothing more.

[Dago Red]

Modders cannot do it because they have no access to CAI.
So, only CA could do it.

This is fairly intolerable given the context of the game. I'm not even talking about the "most moddable" label that has been mis-attributed to the title by some, but the specific game mechanics in Rome II. Who thought of a province system and then thought this particular diplomatic option should be removed? The province system itself demands such a feature.

We are left with a game in which owning full provinces is a main feature, and yet the game makes it impossible to achieve with diplomatic means even though it was a standard TW feature. Failure on epic levels here.

[krisslanza]

We are left with a game in which owning full provinces is a main feature, and yet the game makes it impossible to achieve with diplomatic means even though it was a standard TW feature. Failure on epic levels here.

The game is called Total War. There's a really easy way to go and take that land if you really want it, you know. I cannot say TW has ever boasted having a very robust and in-depth diplomacy system, as anyone who has played Rome 1 could tell you with the "Accept or we'll attack. Or demands are do not attack!"

And then they attack you.

Just sayin'.

Still, great to see your write up wangrin! We've been waiting for it.

[baptistus]

The game is called Total War. There's a really easy way to go and take that land if you really want it, you know.

I agree ! I think CA should delete diplomacy menu, economic menu, management of towns and regions and everything which disturb the player to the war.
I only want to move my armies and make war, nothing more ! total waaaaaargh !!
sorry, I thought we are talking about warhammer ....

There are also ways to diplomatically absorb a nations lands into your own. So to say there are no diplomatic means to acquire land from the AI is just incorrect.

confederation. But you put a "s" to "ways " so what are the other options ?

[wangrin]

If I'm not mistaken, trading region is removed since Total War: Shogun 2.

[baptistus]

If I'm not mistaken, trading region is removed since Total War: Shogun 2.

I don't remember to be honest, but the scope of shogun 2 is smaller than the other total war.
And there are other diplomatic options ("accept or we will attack", trading technologies ect...). If CA really didn't want to add this kind of new diplomatic options, why they said in october there were general plans ? only to calm down the players ? because they already knew it is "hard" to code.

And the politic systems is "hard" to code too, so what about the improvements they promised ?
It is a problem of trust. I am a consumer. If I can not trust the communication of a company .... well I know what to do.

[Karnil Vark Khaitan]

1. TeD
   
   Needed by modders, but not yet available.
2. Campaign Map tool
   
   Needed by modders, but not yet available.
3. Sounds (.wem)
   Q : What CA could do to allow the modding ofhelp us mod game soundtracks ?
   Up until now, it is not possible to modify the new sound file format, “.wem”.
   This file format is a proprietary one, tied to Wwise (Audiokinetic).
   Wwise is a costly tools to purchase : product pricing
   But Audiokinetic company allows free licensing for non-commercial projects, but it there needs to be an agreement between both companies.
   A : CA confirmed they use a new third party tool, Wwise, to create soundtracks for TW:R2.
   A side effect is to makes impossible the modification of soundtrack without Wwise.
   They have noted the need for an agreement between CA and Audiokinetic to allow modders to use Wwise for free, allowing them to mod soundtracks.
   CA will work on contacting Audiokinetic to see if an agreement can be arranged.

I hope it will be available soon, would love to see what can be done this time around. Don't know what to do with the sounds files.