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Thread: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

  1. #181
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Pericles of Athens View Post
    @Barry Alright, sounds fair to me. I was thinking Alexander Wallace, a brute unconventional-gentlemen who spends most of his available time beating those who affront the family in duels, or Andrew Wallace, lawyer-politician whom I've put forward for Presidency.
    In that case, Andrew seems the better match for Augusta, who's a powerhungry backroom schemer with the aim of climbing as high as she can up America's sociopolitical ladder (and she was already born into one of its highest rungs to begin with). Someone with political inclinations who at least stands a chance of becoming President would appeal far more to her than the family 'enforcer', no matter how much prestige he might get showered with - killing people in duels doesn't seem like the greatest way to jumpstart a successful political career in 19th century America, in fact far from being congratulated for it once he moved into politics Andrew Jackson caught a good bit of flak for his duels IIRC

  2. #182
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Something different today - the WEF-USA's starting lineup of units & standing forces as of 1845. Not that much variety in units - the States are less flamboyant and more frugal than the European Great Powers (and Mexico for that matter) so you won't find any flashy cuirassiers, lancers, Grenadier Guards, etc. here, but a versatile blend of professional soldiers with an operational emphasis on combined arms backed by mobs of overenthusiastic but ill-disciplined cannon fodder in the form of state militias and, to a lesser extent, volunteer forces.

    Maintenance costs will always be 1/2 of the unit's purchase price, as are retraining costs. Retraining a unit will also take up 1/2 of its normal buildtime. Oh, and volunteer units can be obtained through speeches, regulars always have to actually be trained; volunteer units can be retrained into regular units for 1/2 the building cost & time of their regular counterpart.

    Oh, and one last thing: units can gain extra quality stars as Experience. They have a low chance (5%, or 1d20) of gaining an extra experience-star just by actually participating in battle, but naturally these chances go up for units assigned to particularly risky missions like covering a rout (let's say 1d6), spearheading the assault on a fortified position (1d4) or capturing an enemy general (100% if successful).

    Unit types
    US Volunteer Infantry


    Strength: 1,000 men/regiment
    Quality: *
    Cost: $1,000
    Build time: 1 day

    As temporarily enlisted soldiers whose terms are usually set to end in a few months, these troops are equipped with a hodgepodge of M1816, '22, '35 and '40 flintlock muskets and a uniform similar to, but lighter in color than the M1833 regulars' uniform. Generally skilled marksmen, especially if they come from rural areas, and enthusiastic patriots regardless of whether they come from North or South, but utterly lacking in discipline & experience - even simple volunteer formations are prone to losing cohesion very quickly, and while their (over?)confidence and eagerness will drive them to open engagements, they may well lack the strength or discipline to finish them. Best used to support regular actions or to defend strongpoints; in less enlightened times these men would be little more than cannon fodder, but nowadays American public opinion will prevent commanders from carelessly throwing their lives away unless they want to lose their war.

    US Regular Infantry


    Strength: 1,000 men/regiment
    Quality: **
    Cost: $2,000
    Build time: 2 days

    The basic line infantry of the US Army, armed with Springfield M1842 percussion muskets and dressed in the peaked cap & deep blue jacket-and-trousers of the M1833 uniform. Reliable professional volunteer troops who are best deployed in lines of battle on open ground, capable of going toe to toe with their opponents (meaning, likely Mexicans) at both close & long ranges and repelling cavalry attacks with their bayonets. Unlike the volunteers, they can be relied on to not break ranks in favor of racing each other to the enemy lines or worse, and unless placed under especially heavy fire they'll generally be able to maintain cohesive formations as they advance, fight and/or retreat.

    US Volunteer Cavalry


    Strength: 500 men/regiment
    Quality: **
    Cost: $3,000
    Build time: 2 days

    Mounted volunteers can be distinguished from the regulars by the darker color of their uniforms, the distinct lack of revolvers (except in the cases of wealthier volunteers) and their inferior M1816 or '22 carbines. If one is unable to tell them apart just from their slightly different uniforms and equipment, then one should definitely be able to see who are the non-professional volunteers when these undisciplined horsemen blindly charge enemy positions without orders or when their formations disintegrate into a howling mob during an actual ordered assault. Like the regulars, these men are in truth better deployed as mounted infantry than Europe's lancers & cuirassiers.

    US Regular Cavalry


    Strength: 500 men/regiment
    Quality: ***
    Cost: $4,000
    Build time: 3 days

    The average troopers of the US Army's cavalry arm, dressed in the same M1833 uniforms worn by their foot-bound comrades & outfitted with sabers, M1841 carbines and caplock revolvers. Obviously a good deal more mobile than the infantry, but these troops are dragoons and should always remember that; they should not launch into a glorious cavalry charge into the teeth of the enemy with sabers flashing unless circumstances guarantee them a good chance of success, but rather dismount after riding to a favorable position and support the rest of the army from there. Alternatively, they can be sent to engage enemy horsemen in firefights, where they can also be expected to perform well.

    US Marines


    Strength: 800 men/regiment
    Quality: **, **** when participating in amphibious operations
    Cost: $4,000
    Build time: 3 days

    Elite soldiers easily distinguished from other soldiers by their shakos & white trousers, armed with M1842 percussion muskets and specially trained for amphibious operations. Whenever one wants to drop a surprise for one's enemies by sea, these men should be the first to hit the beaches and last to leave. Alternatively, they can also be deployed in riverine offensives or to defend crucial river crossings.

    US Horse Artillery


    Strength: 20 guns/regiment
    Quality: ****
    Cost: $6,000
    Build time: 4 days

    Popularly referred to as 'flying artillery', these units consist of light (usually 3- to 9-pound) bronze muzzle-loading cannons drawn by teams of horses. They are not meant to unlimber and then remain stationary on a fixed point somewhere along the battlefield or to bombard dedicated fortifications, but to provide close-range localized fire support to any units that might need it before limbering up again and moving elsewhere. They are still capable of switching between round, canister and carcass rounds on demand, but their shorter range and caliber in comparison to the heavy artillery means they'd still be better off working as fire support for the infantry/cavalry in pitched battles than in sieges.

    US Heavy Artillery


    Strength: 20 guns/regiment
    Quality: *****
    Cost: $7,500
    Build time: 5 days

    These massive, lumbering bronze cannons are the artillery arm's heavy hitters, as one can tell from their name. 12-pounders at the bare minimum, these guns really are meant to be unlimbered and then remain at a fixed point from where they can either offer the other elements of the army intensive fire support, or bombard enemy fortifications into rubble. Their superior range and higher caliber compared to the flying artillery make them ideal guns for manning defensive works, or siege guns if on the offensive. Like the horse artillery, they can switch between round, canister and carcass shot as necessary.

    Attachable companies
    These smaller formations can be instantly recruited, but they must be attached to a proper regiment to function. In turn, each regiment can have a maximum of one company attached to it.

    Sharpshooter company - $800, 200 men - A special company made up of the best marksmen the US can find, drawn from both veteran snipers and recruits who attain especially high scores in their marksmanship tests, and armed with M1819 or M1840 rifles. They can function as a cloud of elite skirmishers to cover the advance or retreat of whatever regiment they're attached to or, for the less sporting generals, assassinate enemy officers on the field of battle. Can only be attached to infantry regiments, +1 to the attached regiment.

    Shock company - $800, 200 men - A special company made up of especially hardened veterans and recruits picked for their strength & vitality, these companies are the spiritual successors of the grenadiers of old. They are prepared to lead assaults into the thick of the enemy's defenses and to overpower heavy resistance with bayonet & musket. Can only be attached to infantry regiments, +2 to the attached regiment only when attacking.

    Mounted rifle squadron - $1,200, 200 men - A special squadron of, you guessed it, cavalrymen armed with & specially trained to use M1819 or '40 rifles. These more accurate weapons may be more difficult to use than their traditional carbines, but provide their wielders with an invaluable edge in ranged combat. Can only be attached to cavalry regiments, +1 to the attached regiment only when fighting at a distance.

    Mounted shock squadron - $1,200, 200 men - A special squadron of experienced horsemen, provided with the fastest horses in the Army, who've swapped out their carbines for an extra revolver. They are less adept at long-range gunfights than most of their comrades, but their speed and elan make them especially formidable melee fighters capable of quickly closing in and butchering opponents. Can only be attached to cavalry regiments, +1 to the attached regiment only when fighting in melee.

    Flying artillery battery - $2,000, 5 guns - A special battery of light, horse-drawn guns designed to provide light, mobile fire support on the regimental level. The extra close-range low-level firepower will be absolutely invaluable for regiments assigned to spearhead offensives on the battlefield, but just as helpful on the defensive. +3 stars, can be attached to cavalry or infantry regiments.

    Heavy artillery battery - $3,000, 5 guns - A special battery of heavy guns designed to provide overwhelming fire support on a regimental level. The extra heavy firepower will prove critical to sustaining offensives targeted at field or city fortifications, but will still be just as helpful when deployed defensively. +4 stars, can be attached to cavalry or infantry regiments.

    Next up, rules for Officer characters. As enlisted members of the US Army, these characters will have points to spend on their Command, Influence and Combat stats, with a maximum of 5 points; Command points will be added to rolls whenever you're trying to execute complicated and/or risky maneuvers (ex. switching formations while under heavy artillery fire or being threatened by a mass cavalry charge), Influence points will be added to rally rolls, and Combat points translate to the # of hitpoints your character will have when engaged in single combat by an opposing character as well as your chances of landing hits with both melee weapons & firearms. Characters gain 2 stat points for every 10 years of their life, so we aren't going to be seeing 20-year-old military geniuses anytime soon; a 30-year-old on the other hand can potentially be a well-rounded commander with balanced stats, or focus overwhelmingly on one or two categories. Oh, and of course you can gain more points from experience if your character does something relevant to one of those categories (so f'rex killing some Mexican officer won't get you additional Command points, but it does have a chance of bumping up your Combat stat). Finally, every officer-PC must pick a background & personality trait, which will have their own positive & adverse effects (thank you Vicky I/II binges )

    Officer traits
    Background
    Aristocrat:
    Benefit:
    Higher morale.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline (ability to maintain cohesive formations while doing basically anything under fire, not charge off or otherwise act without/contrary to orders when provoked, etc.) decreases.

    Armchair General:
    Benefit:
    Higher discipline.
    Disadvantage: Lower movement speed.

    Celebrity:
    Benefit:
    Sharply increased morale.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased discipline.

    Frontiersman:
    Benefit:
    Higher movement speed.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline decreases.

    Gifted Administrator:
    Benefit:
    Able to operate for longer periods of line without a supply line (that is, when cut off from other US forces & territories).
    Disadvantage: +25% maintenance costs.

    Innovator:
    Benefit:
    +1 to fighting at a distance.
    Disadvantage: -1 to fighting in melee.

    Mad Genius:
    Benefit:
    Random rolls will be made to provide a bonus/malus to every action taken.
    Disadvantage: Random rolls will be made to provide a bonus/malus to every action taken.

    Martinet:
    Benefit:
    Sharply increased discipline.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased morale.

    Old School:
    Benefit:
    +1 to fighting in melee.
    Disadvantage: -1 to fighting at a distance.

    Rising Star:
    Benefit:
    Higher chances to gain experience.
    Disadvantage: Lower morale.

    Self-Made Man:
    Benefit: Unit's discipline increases.
    Disadvantage: Lower morale.

    Tag-Teamer:
    Benefit: +1 to all stats when working with another specific character (feel free to work this out with other players).
    Disadvantage: -1 to all stats when separated from your chosen partner.

    Personalities
    Aggressive:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls.
    Disadvantage: -1 to all defensive rolls.

    Berserker:
    Benefit: +1 to melee rolls, enemies' morale decreases when faced with your unit.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline & morale decreases.

    Brash:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls, increased movement speed.
    Disadvantage: Unit's morale decreases, sharply decreased discipline.

    Cautious:
    Benefit: +1 to all defensive rolls.
    Disadvantage: Lowered movement speed.

    Calm:
    Benefit: Unit's discipline increases.
    Disadvantage: -1 to all offensive rolls.

    Craven:
    Benefit: Sharply increased movement speed.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased morale.

    Flamboyant:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls, increased movement speed.
    Disadvantage: -1 to all defensive rolls, sharply decreased discipline.

    Inspiring:
    Benefit: +1 to rally rolls.
    Disadvantage: Lower movement speed.

    Martyr:
    Benefit: +2 to rally rolls.
    Disadvantage: -1 to your combat stat.

    Meticulous:
    Benefit: +1 to all defensive actions, increased discipline.
    Disadvantage: Sharply lowered movement speed.

    Merciless:
    Benefit: Enemies' morale decreases when faced with your unit.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline decreases.

    Patient:
    Benefit: +1 to all defensive rolls.
    Disadvantage: -1 to all offensive actions.

    Pragmatic:
    Benefit: +1 to all defensive rolls, increased discipline.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased morale.

    Reckless:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline decreases.

    Romantic:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls, increased morale.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased discipline.

    Shrinking Violet:
    Benefit: +1 to fighting at range, increased movement speed.
    Disadvantage: Unit's discipline & morale decreases.

    Wrathful:
    Benefit: +1 to all offensive rolls, unit's discipline increases.
    Disadvantage: Sharply decreased morale.

    And now, the starting US Army of 1845. It'll be up to the military players to organize these regiments into proper brigades and to decide who should command said brigades; note that the brigadier-general's bonuses & maluses will apply to those units under his command as well. However, regardless of PC/NPC control, only the regimental commander's (Colonel's/Lt. Colonel's) stats will count when the regiment is engaged unless they specifically name one of the characters under their command to take a leading role or (for the combat stat) if the PC gets into single combat with their opposite number in the enemy army. For example:

    Regiment A has a Colonel with 3/3/3 stats and two Lieutenants, one with 1/2/1 and another with 2/2/1. Regiment B is led by a Colonel with 2/3/3 stats and has a Major with 3/4/3 stats. Regiments A & B fight. 3 Command + a dice roll of 5 for Regiment A vs. 2 Command + a dice roll of 4 for B = A wins. However, if B's Colonel orders the Major to take a leading role in the battle (*insert RP here*), 2 Command + the Major's 3 command + that roll of 4 = B wins instead - unless A's Colonel orders both of his Lieutenants into standing by his side, then A's score of 1 + 1 + 3 + 5 = 10 narrowly beats B's score of 2 + 3 + 4 = 9. Also alternatively, B's Major could engage either of A's Lieutenants or even A's Colonel in single combat due to their newfound leading roles and should he kill any of them, B pretty much automatically wins.

    Note also that some units will either be commanded by NPCs (who may or may not follow your orders) or have NPC junior officers in their ranks (same). PCs can command any regiment without an NPC Colonel, or join either NPC or PC-commanded regiments if they're of a lower rank.

    US Army, 1845
    1st Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry, shock company (incl. Lt. Leonidas Saker, 1/1/5, Rising Star/Calm)
    2nd Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry
    3rd Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry, sharpshooter company (Commander: Col. Jude Saker, 4/4/4, Innovator/Pragmatic)
    4th Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry
    5th Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry, flying artillery battery
    6th Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry
    7th Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry, flying artillery battery (Commander: Col. Reginald Drummond, 5/3/4, Aristocrat/Patient, incl. Capt. William Hogg, 1/3/5, Self-Made Man/Wrathful)
    8th Regiment of Infantry - US Regular Infantry
    1st US Marine Regiment - US Marines (incl. Maj. Constantine Dowd, 3/3/3, Aristocrat/Aggressive)
    2nd US Marine Regiment - US Marines

    1st Regiment of Dragoons - US Regular Cavalry (Commander: Col. Alexander Drummond, 3/5/4, Aristocrat/Romantic, incl. Capt. Edmund Rutledge, 2/2/4, Aristocrat/Berserker)
    2nd Regiment of Dragoons - US Regular Cavalry (incl. Capt. Jonathan Anderson, 3/3/3, Aristocrat/Calm; Lt. Richard Simons, 2/1/4, Old School/Merciless; Lt. Edgar Rutledge II, 2/2/3, Aristocrat/Romantic)
    Regiment of Mounted Riflemen - US Regular Cavalry, mounted rifle squadron

    1st Regiment of Artillery - US Heavy Artillery
    2nd Regiment of Artillery - US Heavy Artillery
    3rd Regiment of Artillery - US Horse Artillery
    4th regiment of Artillery - US Horse Artillery

    For a total standing strength of 13,200 men + 70 guns. (note that the commander roster is incomplete, more will be added as I work on the families)

    Any questions, suggestions, etc.?
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; May 22, 2014 at 02:38 PM.

  3. #183

    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Will the same system apply to naval officers?

    Also, a wip, but I think this may fit the potential Superintendent of Legionville - 2/3/3, Martinet/Calm. As I did describe him attempting to instill strict discipline into each class of cadets.
    Last edited by Xion; May 22, 2014 at 02:48 PM.

  4. #184
    Pericles of Athens's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    @Barry Looks like the planning stages of the game are coming along nicely. Always a good thing to see.

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry Goldwater View Post
    In that case, Andrew seems the better match for Augusta, who's a powerhungry backroom schemer with the aim of climbing as high as she can up America's sociopolitical ladder (and she was already born into one of its highest rungs to begin with). Someone with political inclinations who at least stands a chance of becoming President would appeal far more to her than the family 'enforcer', no matter how much prestige he might get showered with - killing people in duels doesn't seem like the greatest way to jumpstart a successful political career in 19th century America, in fact far from being congratulated for it once he moved into politics Andrew Jackson caught a good bit of flak for his duels IIRC
    I thought as much, Andrew it is.


  5. #185
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Minor updates to the timeline - one addition detailing Dude!Victoria-slash-Princess-Charlotte's marriage in 1822 (page 2) and a bit of editing for the section he originally appeared in (1830, page 4).

    @Rose Works for me.

  6. #186
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    And now, for the Navy's units as well as the starting US Navy:

    US ship types
    Gunboat



    Quality: *
    Cost: $1,500
    Build time: 2 days

    Ah, the classic rowboat-with-cannons that lost the War of 1812. These gunboats are little more than undecked rowboats with a mast (thus, a favorable wind could provide the oarsmen with a momentary break) and one or two 24-pounder cannons slapped on them; the surprising power of these cannons provide the gunboat with the means to at least seriously damage a larger opponent that underestimates it, but the added weight also makes them more vulnerable than ever to capsizing should such an opponent ram them - an ignominious way to go for the unlucky oarsmen and crew assigned to the boat. All this said, gunboats are also unique in that they're small enough to navigate up rivers, allowing them to provide close-range fire support to troops fighting inland and to strike at enemy positions beyond the reach of the army & bigger ships.

    Sailing sloop


    Quality: **
    Cost: $3,000
    Build time: 3 days

    Small wooden vessels packing about 20 cannons and powered solely by sail, these are the second-weakest ships the US Navy has to offer. While obviously larger & more powerful than gunboats, they cannot sail up rivers, and as they lack a steam engine & paddle-wheel they are also wholly dependent on the strength & direction of the wind; a stiff breeze blowing against them will be sufficient to render them immobile until a more favorable wind comes in.

    Sailing frigate


    Quality: ****
    Cost: $8,000
    Build time: 5 days

    The largest and most powerful sailing vessel boasted by the US Navy of this time period, the classic frigate has changed little from 1812; outfitted with three square-rigged masts, double-decked and bearing 44 to 60 cannons varying from 18 to 42-pounders, in Europe these ships would normally be classed as fourth or fifth-rate ships of the line. Nevertheless, the advent of steam power is increasingly rendering them obsolete, as they remain bound to the direction and strength of the wind for movement.

    Steam gunboat


    Quality: **
    Cost: $4,000
    Build time: 3 days

    A relatively small wooden vessel combining both sails and a steam paddle, armed with 6-9 guns. Despite their fairly low firepower, these steam-powered warships are considerably faster than the older sailing vessels, and their small size also allow them to sail up rivers to bombard inland positions that are still out of the reach of other land troops, blockade cities or support amphibious assaults.

    Steam sloop


    Quality: ***
    Cost: $7,000
    Build time: 5 days

    Like its sailing counterpart, this ship is considerably larger and heavier than the gunboat, though it still only boasts one deck lined with 20-30 guns. Powered with a steam engine and paddle wheels, it is not nearly as bound to the direction of the wind as its predecessor (though that still helps of course, hence why it boasts several masts) and is also much faster. That said, they should take care not to damage their paddle-wheels, which really will leave them vulnerable to enemy attacks. These would ideally be the rank-and-file warship of the US Navy, Congress permitting.

    Steam frigate


    Quality: *****
    Cost: $12,000
    Build time: 7 days

    Every bit as powerful as the traditional sailing frigate and a good deal faster, steam frigates are the most powerful ships the US can boast of in this time. Triple-masted, double-decked and armed with 44 to 60 cannons ranging from 24 to 42-pounders in addition to their high-pressure steam engine and twin paddle-wheels, these vessels are swift - though still capable of sinking smaller vessels just by ramming them - as well as deadly and difficult to sink. However, like all steamships, though they are no longer beholden to the wind their paddle-wheels (mounted on the two sides of the ship) are still vulnerable to enemy attack and, if blasted into scrap, will leave these frigates as little more than expensive clones of their sailing predecessors.

    And your starting ships as of 1845:

    US Navy, 1845
    USS Massachusetts - Steam frigate (Commander: Capt. Claude Rondelle, 4/2/2, Innovator/Patient)
    USS Connecticut - Steam frigate
    USS Virginia - Frigate
    USS Maine - Frigate
    USS Nevisian - Steam sloop
    USS Messenger - Steam sloop
    USS Azure - Sloop
    USS Baltimore - Sloop
    USS Michigan - Steam gunboat
    USS Bermuda - Steam gunboat (Commander: Capt. Hadrian Dowd, 3/3/4, Martinet/Brash)
    USS Missouri - Gunboat
    USS Nantucket - Gunboat
    USS Philadelphia - Gunboat
    USS Detroit - Gunboat

    Naval officers have the same rules for gaining stat points & traits as army officers, btw.
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; May 25, 2014 at 06:59 PM.

  7. #187
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Triple post, but as the end of May approaches we really need to get our list of Presidents done before we launch the game proper. So, please vote or propose roles ASAP, if nobody is willing to take X role then I'll just have an NPC fill it in.

    1789-1797: Hammitt Poole/Edward C. Lamberth (Non-Partisan/Pro-Administration)
    1797-1805: Federalist #1 (R. Braxford - 3, Jacb/Perry/Rose; E. Lamberth - 2, Watercress/Aggy)
    1805-1813: Jack Eggers/? (Democratic-Republican) (already chosen over J. Richardson by a pretty strong majority last I checked; perhaps Richardson could be his VP instead?)
    1813-1821: Federalist #2 (R. Braxford - 2, Jacb/Aggy; E. Lamberth - 1, Watercress) (whoever loses the vote for 1797-1805 should get this role unless Jacb & MMM reach an agreement over how to split things up, and/or their guy is dead by this time; heck, they can even die in office from old age and thus pass the buck on to Federalist #3, who would have to be their veep at this time ofc)
    1821-1825: Federalist #3
    1825-1829: Democrat #1
    1829-1833: Whig #1 (F. Amsel - 2, EB/Aggy; J. Lamberth - 1, Watercress)
    1833-1837: Democrat #1's second term
    1837-1845: Federalist #4
    1845-: Democrat #2 (A. Wallace - 2, Perry/Jacb; C. W. Lamberth - 3, Watercress/Rose/Aggy)
    Last edited by Barry Goldwater; May 27, 2014 at 09:31 PM.

  8. #188

    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    1845- Lamberth
    Anything without a player claimant I think should be a NPC.

    As for the navy, can I submit a Rondelle to be a Frigate(either type)'s captain?

  9. #189
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Sure, full name + stats/traits + assigned ship?

  10. #190

    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Claude Rondelle, 4/2/2, Innovator/Patient. USS Massachusetts - Steam frigate

  11. #191
    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    TBH, I don't much care who gets the contested presidencies. I'd be cool with having Richardson as VP if Chesser wants or he can be prez later, whatever he wants. Heck, he could be VP multiple times. For the candidates, since you want votes:
    Fed 1: MMM
    Fed 2: Jacb
    Whig 1: EB
    Dem 2: Depends how fast we want a civil war, I see Perry as by far more polarizing, so he'll probably cause an 1850s civil war.

    I do have one request for the civil war. It's probably going to happen early, so the armies should be using Mexican War equipment historically, but as real civil war equipment is 1.) way more awesome in every way and 2.) much easier to find pictures for, could we speed up the development of 1860s uniforms and equipment?

  12. #192
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Let's not have the anachronistic 1860s tech & uniforms too early lol. So if the ACW starts post-1854 (OTL founding of the GOP) then yeah, we can use the M1858 uniforms; as for weapons, the Springfield M1855 looks similar enough to the M1861 that pics of the latter can pass for the former IMO, so that also wouldn't be a problem. Sound fair?

  13. #193
    jacb547's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    1st Whig: J.Lambert
    2nd Democrat: A.Wallace
    "We all know whatmy brother would do. Robert would gallop up to the gates of Winterfell alone, break them with his warhammer, and ride through the rubble to slay Roose Bolton with his left hand and the Bastard with his right. I am not Robert. But we will march, and we will free Winterfell … or die in the attempt."

  14. #194
    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Darn, alright. So let's do everything in our power to delay the war.

  15. #195
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    I suppose then, going by what you said earlier ('depends on how fast we want a civil war') that you'll be voting Lamberth for the 1845 POTUS?

    Also, the Texan land order-of-battle. Texas's units will be identical in function to their US counterparts, both b/c most Texan settlers are first or second-gen Americans and to enable an easy transition in case of union.

    Texan Army, 1845
    1st Infantry Regiment - Texan Regular Infantry, sharpshooter company
    2nd Infantry Regiment - Texan Regular Infantry
    3rd Infantry Regiment - Texan Regular Infantry
    4th Infantry Regiment - Texan Regular Infantry

    Texas Ranger Division - Texan Regular Cavalry, mounted rifle squadron
    Texan Legion of Cavalry - Texan Regular Cavalry

    1st Texas Light Artillery - Texan Horse Artillery
    2nd Texas Light Artillery - Texan Horse Artillery

    For a total standing strength of 6,400 men + 40 guns.

  16. #196
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Taking this to the proper thread, and so that Aggy can comment on it as well...
    Quote Originally Posted by chesser2538 View Post
    this might help you on determining the boundaries and the disputed boundaries. I realize some things have changed from the OTL but from what ive read the border dispute is still a pressing issue. And aggy just to clarify, my character is probably going to be toward asserting the "true" Texas territorial claim, that being the Rio Grand as well as the northern territories of its claim. I plan for him to be pro war against the Mexicans, but with the overall goal of establishing territorial dominance. I don't want for it to be a long drug out costly war. Once Mexico's next regime change comes we will need a strong trading partner. As for the slave issue I'm thinking that since slavery was the lifeblood of the country he would not be opposed to it. He would also be for the settlement of freed blacks as well as any Indians who will abide by Texas laws. They would be under the same requirements of any other settler. ( the sooner that we get the western frontier of the state occupied and settled the better) I would want for the state to remain it's own sovereign nation and not be annexed. This should help to provide some more contrast between the parties.
    Well the big problem I'm seeing is his advocacy of black/Indian settlement of the western frontier, which has to go if he's to be a plausible Nationalist candidate; not only are most Texans not big fans of either group - at best they're ambivalent but would still listen to racist arguments - but Agg's already become the pro-Indian/black/Tejanos candidate, or at least the closest to such positions, which means any Texan who doesn't have a problem with Indians or free blacks or Tejanos could easily just vote for him anyway. A lot of Texan Nationalist whites will be clamoring for the white-only settlement of those frontier territories regardless of how much more sense it'd make to have it settled quickly with non-whites, and will be rightly pissed if they see it going to 'damn injuns/s'. Thompson of course doesn't have to personally buy into their racist beliefs, but since Eggers has already cornered the socially liberal (by the 1840s definition of 'socially liberal') market of voters he'll have to pander to them to not become a political nobody, at least during campaign season.

    That said, a scenario where Thompson isn't a racist himself and only bothers to scoop up racist voters during elections would explain why he lost out to Eggers in the 1844 election; his racist base finally realizes that he isn't actually one of them and thus either runs a third party or sits out of the election entirely, but in the former case Thompson might well still have enough support to make sure the election goes to the relatively non-racist Unionist Eggers instead of the Racist Nationalist Party Who I'll Name Later, and in the latter case well he just plain loses due to there being not enough difference between the candidates to persuade people from voting Thompson over Eggers + the shutdown of a large potential base of voters.

    As for foreign policy...Thompson's more aggressive policy could actually go well with the Mier Expedition thing I talked about a few pages ago, which iirc will be happening under a Nationalist presidency. Basically, the Mexicans have just launched a raid into Texas; same invasion as OTL with a slightly different excuse, as Emperor Agustin is gunning after Mexican republican rebels he thinks are based out of Texas (and who might actually be if Thompson is providing them with arms & shelter so they can effect a favorable regime change down south or something). Cue a Texan reprisal ordered by Thompson, which ends just as well as the real Somervell/Mier Expedition if not worse, on account of the Mexican army being more competent without Santa Anna - and an instant excuse for the Nationalists to lose the 1844 election as determined by the dice earlier, even if the racists haven't yet become fed up with his apparent inaction vis-a-vis kicking the black man/the Indian in the nuts enough for their tastes. Perhaps Eggers could become the candidate of peace & a negotiated solution to Texas's border woes in the lead-up to this, and Agustin seeing Thompson's retaliatory expedition end in flames + whatever new domestic problems might be plaguing the Lone Star Republic in the fallout gives him the idea that he could easily invade Texas to start the Mexican-American War soon after the game's start?

    There's also Aggy's proposal that the Regulators/Moderators end up transforming into paramilitary clubs backing the Nationalists & Unionists from a few pages back, which if done could give Agustin yet another excuse to start the Mexican-American War and thus get the first big show of the game (soon to be followed by trying to digest whatever you've managed to conquer from Mexico/the fallout of a defeat, naturally) rolling; if it looks like Texan democracy is falling apart within less than half a decade of independence, he can possibly get the idea that a reconquest will be a walkover and (having determined that Texan political strength is disintegrating) thus launch the raid that leads to the Not!Mier Expedition with the ulterior motive of probing Texan military strength.

  17. #197
    Agamemnon's Avatar Comes Limitis
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    It all sounds good to me, make it so insofar as I'm concerned.

  18. #198
    chesser2538's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Barry

    I didn't think that the settlement issue was that huge at the time. To keep things more balanced id be OK with having my character be a little more Nationalist.
    So basically Supports white dominance in the country, and advocates for restricting rights on blacks and Indians; at least in the eyes of the voters. I still plan to stick with my defensive/expansionist agenda concerning Mexico. However due to my characters command experience I could not see him launching an offensive against well armed troops while vastly outnumbered and out-manned. He would of instead set up an entrenched defensive perimeter supported with cannons as well as strategically positioned sharpshooters. The claimed territory cannot be gained through one decisive battle but must be gained through the establishment of settlements as well as a sysyem of forts to defend the claim.

    Under the Patronage of the venerable General Brewster

  19. #199
    Barry Goldwater's Avatar Mr. Conservative
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    Alright, seems good to me. The dice have determined that the Unionists are to be in charge of Texas as of game start, so the Nationalists must still lose the 1844 presidential election, but their loss will be a bit softer if they're 'only' under fire for seeming too cautious in the face of Mexican provocations instead of for running off and getting a ton of Texans slaughtered in a stupicidal raid on Mexican turf (ironically the Texan jingoists who'd be giving you the hardest time for the former would also have been the biggest pushers for the latter, so this is one crowd neither Thompson nor Eggers can please ).

    So how's this for a chain of events:

    1843: 300 dragoons of the Imperial Mexican Army ride into Texas late this year, looting/torching some frontier settlements and routing the odd militia that comes out to face them, before heading home, all on the suspicion (accurate or otherwise) that then-President Thompson is allowing Mexican Republicans to camp on Texan soil & providing them with supplies in hopes that they'll be able to overthrow Agustin & found a more Texas-friendly government; unofficially, Agustin also intended the raid as a probe of Texan defenses. Many Texans howl for Mexican blood, but Thompson is aware of the Texan Army's dismal chances against Agustin's forces and refuses to authorize a retaliatory raid, instead focusing on fortifying the border and redoubling border patrols.

    1844: President Thompson is defeated by returning challenger Eggers in this year's election, having come under fire for apparently not doing enough to counter the Mexican intrusion of last year. Still, it is clear from the closeness of the election (where he gained 48% of the vote in comparison to Eggers' 52%) he retains a good deal of support, which he likely would not have had if he'd allowed a probably-doomed counterattack into Mexican territory.

    What d'you think of the R/M proposal btw?

  20. #200
    chesser2538's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: WEF 3.0 19th-Century Iteration Planning Thread

    I see the R/M issue to be a domestic issue, since the event seems to be occurring during Thompson's presidency I would have him send in the Texas Rangers to break up the feud and to restore order. Throughout Texas history they have been the premiere law enforcement authority within Texas, and at that time period they were the equivalent of the FBI within the country. Largely in part due to their ability to be both highly combat efficient and also diplomatically skilled.

    Under the Patronage of the venerable General Brewster

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