How to survive as Pontus ? VH/VH

[tono4850]

Has anybody managed to win the campaign playing as Pontus ?
My first campaign ever playing EB(VH/VH): I got into debt within first 2 turns. At first I conqured Sinopole with my starting army without much trouble. (Greeks delared war on me, probably beacuse of this). Epirus ditto. ( I managed to build roads and train one unit of skirmishers before I went into debt)

As next target I chose Ankarya, but that was a big mistake. I tried to conquer it for 2 times, but failed. My levy phalanx, poor skirmishers and one unit of slingers had no chance against those naked fanatics. My 3rd (the last attempt) failed when my besieging army was attacked by former ally- Seleucid. I had to flee, their army was superior so then they conqured much weakened Ankarya. Within next turns they send 2 full stacks armies to my capital and then I realized that was a game over for me


I will start my second campaign, but this time I will try to conquer some settlements far away from Seleucids (maybe Crimea would be OK ?)

PS: My n1 houserule is I never reload campaign or lost battles...

[athanaric]

Pontos is one of those campaigns where you can't afford too many wrong decisions at the start. I suggest attacking the Seleukids before they attack you (because they will, especially on VH) and take Ipsos ASAP, while leaving a garrison in Amaseia (one missile unit and one pikemen unit should deter the AI from sieging for a while, as the AI doesn't like to engage pikemen unless it has vastly superior numbers). Then tae Sardis, that place is a literal gold mine. After that, if you still have soldiers to spare, take Mazaka and dig yourself in there. After building up your economy and barracks, you can think about taking Sinope and Ankyra. Like I said many times before, hire a unit of Celtic Longswordsmen mercenaries right at the first turn, because your starting units are not ideal for taking cities. Also, you have to take into account that the game is balanced for Medium difficulty battles, so VH will produce skewed results.

[Nad]

Pontos is one of my favourite factions to play on VH/M, but I never play with VH battles as that is unbalanced.

There are two ways to play: the easy way and the hard way.

The easy way is as described above. You have 3 starting armies - send one to Sardis, one to Ipsos and keep one in your capital for Mazaka. You want to attack all 3 cities at the same time (it will probably be spring 271BC before all 3 are in a position to strike). You besiege and capture all 3 cities simultaneously, and you will immediately have high positive income which will clear your debts within a year or two.

This means the Seleucids will be out of Asia Minor and can only attack you on one front now, Mazaka. You can consolidate a bit and train some units once you have some cash, and then kick the Ptolemaioi out of Asia Minor too. Leave the rebel cities until you have got rid of the Ptolemaioi. Once you have all of Asia Minor, you will be swimming in cash and it's a bog standard game.

The hard way is to play honourably and not declare war on the AI. If you play this way, you should use your starting troops to capture Sinope and Trapezous. Why these? Because they do not border the Seleucids, meaning that when the Seleucids attack you, it will only be on one front only (Amaseia). Unfortunately taking these two cities will not give you a positive income.

Once you've captured Sinope and Trapezous, send everything you have left to Amaseia and wait for the Seleucids to attack. They will eventually but it could take some time. I've been in a position before where I've had a treasury of -50k before they finally attacked. When they do, defeat their army and capture Mazaka. This should finally get you a positive income, though it will take a long time to clear your debt.

You then have to try to take Ipsos and Sardis, but it won't be easy as you will only have the remnants of your starting forces while the Seleucids have many more and better units. It's a major challenge this way. The only thing you can really do is use your general's bodyguards to their maximum effect - they're devastating on the charge. If and when you finally take Ipsos and Sardis you will then have the cash to train more units.

In the longer term, as far as your troop selection goes, your factional troops are crap while the regional troops in the area are very good. So you may as well forget about factional barracks and just build regionals. The only factional troops of any use are the pantodapoi phalangitai, which require level 3 factional. However you can only really build these in Amaseia and Mazaka.

Instead, go for level 3 governments and build regional barracks where possible. A level 3 government with gymnasium or house of strength means your fresh recruits will have 2XP! Sardis and Antiocheia are your key troop producers. Ankyra is the other key regional troop producer, but that will require a level 4 government for max benefit.

Among the regionals you can get amidst your starting area are:

Caucasian archers: Mazaka with just level 1 regional barracks
Peltastai: everywhere with level 2 regional
Kretan and Syrian archers: Antiocheia with level 4 regional barracks
Klerouchi phalangitai: Sardis and Antiocheia with level 4 regional
Hoplitai: Sardis with level 3 regional
Cappadocian hillmen: Antiocheia with level 3 regional

And from Ankyra with a level 4 government, you can get a full Galatian roster, including slingers, heavy spearmen, tindanotae and heavy cavalry.

Hope that helps.

[tono4850]

Thanks for your help, it´s much needed because as I a new EB player I still don´t understand some aspects of the mod, especially things regarding governmental buildings and how recruitment works. After taking an enemy´s settlement should I destroy their buildings ? (Seleukids satrapie etc.).

I have started a new campaign and followed your advice.Within first ten turns I conqured Mazaka, Sardes, Ipsos, Antioch. In fact I still haven´t recruited a single unit (coz those available are crap) only hired 2 mercenary celtic swordsmen (trying to understand the AOR system)
Eleutheroi rebels are plundering Sardes region, but I dont have any army to fight them Antioch is still revolting although my ENTIRE army is in there (I guess it has something to do with different culture ?) Finances are really tight I have 5 settlemets now and one almost full stack army and still gaining only about 2k a turn

I will post some screenshots when I am back at home.

[the man, the myth, the legend]

Taking a town like Antioch, that probably has a considerable population, it might have been a good idea to enslave after you took it. The game is still early and it will build up it population quickly enough and it would have probably helped to control the order issue that you're having.

[tono4850]

Yes, I enslaved its population, also moved my entire army there. I survived their first wave heading to Antioch and beat their superior hoplites.

Now if only they agreed to ceasefire, so that I can raise some money and start taking surrounding rebel settlements.

[tono4850]

Seleucids besieged my Antioch, they broke the gates, but did not enter the town, just sit there . Is this a bug or what ? I had two reinforcements armies, so maybe this was the reason why they performed so stupid ? I also placed my phalanx closely to the gates.

(using 1.2EB with fixes, EB.exe and Sinuhet´s formations)

[tono4850]

OK, one more question: Can I build regional barracks in settlements with level 1 or 2 governements ??? Or should I destroy them and build level 3 governements instead ?

[athanaric]

OK, one more question: Can I build regional barracks in settlements with level 1 or 2 governements ???

Yes. Type I government = tier 2 regional barracks max.; Type II = tier 3 max. and so on.

Or should I destroy them and build level 3 governements instead ?

Depends on the region. Definitely not in Amaseia, but some of your homeland regions have interesting local troops.

[tono4850]

So this is my second campaign in EB playing as Pontus VH/VH

Now I don´t know what I should do next: A: taking remaining rebel settlements B: Attack on Ptomlemaioi.
/trying to get ceasefire with Seleucids each turn but they still refuse

Ptolemaioi are second strongest faction, but they do not attack me yet (kind of surprising) Few turns ago they made an alliance with Seleucids.

In 260 BC I also managed to take Antioch, but I lost it....

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[athanaric]

I'd say build the remaining mines and ports ASAP. Also you should consider taking Trapezous, where you'll be able to build ships. The next target should be the two Ptolemaic provinces (Side and Tarsos), and while you're at war with them, take Kypros as well (them allying to the Seleukids means they want to attack you). After they no longer share a border with you, they'll want to make peace. You can accept a ceasefire and trade rights in return for map information (always useful). Only then should you think about taking Antiocheia.
If you take Pergamon, you might wanna think of taking Mytilene as well, or bribe it, so you don't have to fight on two fronts.

[tono4850]

I shouldn´t have attacked Ptolemaioi, Within few turns they hired top quality mercenary (galatian wild men- fought them in Ankara and suffered terrible casualties+ VH diff penalty) so I had to stop my attempt to conquer Side. Instead I managed to take their Tarsos, but it rioted within next turn. Near Antioch was poorly defended so I besieged them and attacked next turn. Palmyra wit no walls ditto. In the last picture I have no idea what I should do : The terrain in that battle is TERRIBLE and AI places their phalanx on the highest mountainpeak....+ 8 stars general with immortal hellenistric bodyguards

If it was possible I would change battle difficulty to Hard or Medium... 1:1 battles are usually even

My all settlements except Amaseia and Mazaka are close to rioting so I have to keep all taxes on minimum. (haven´t built any temples/theatres, but built military and economy building first)

I am in debt again ( lost income from trading with Ptolemaioi)



(that full stack Ptolemaio army was passive for good 5+turns so I didn´t expect they would attack my Sardis- the best town I have. As you can see I dont have ANY army in that area of map as I had to defend Ani-Kamah in the East. The biggest surprise was when Eleutheroi attacked Sinope


Loss of Antioch will surely hurt a much my finances...To make it worse, Macedonians finally( after lots of trying) conqured Pergamon.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: