Medieval Berber-Arab warfare

[Conrad82]

I posted this in the videogame forum but was told this was a better place for it. Here is the original message:

Hello! I am very interested in the story of Al-Andalus and the Arab world in general, and as a player of medieval strategy videogames, I've always liked to play with Muslim factions. I made this thread because I would like to know more about the military strategies of the diverse Arab-Berber nations during the Middle Ages.

I am aware that as a general rule, Arab armies relied on light cavalry, ranged or not, and skirmished rather than engaging the ennemy up front. But I am specially interested in how their infantry fought and how well they fared against the infantry of other peoples (mainly Christians). For example:

- Did Arabs ever line heavy infantry that could go toe-to-toe with Christian knights?
- In general, how well did the Arabs do in battle as far as front-line infantries were concerned?
- The Arab infantry and cavalry in general were less heavily armoured than the European one. Did the fact that they tired less quickly and had more mobility make up for the lack of protection in close combat? In "European" kind of climates, I mean.
- Generally speaking, were they good at swordmanship? Who used to be better, Arabs or Europeans?
- What were the preferred weapons of the Arab infantry?
- What were the military differences between Arabs and Berbers? According to the Total War games, Berbers were mainly lightly armoured spearmen, archers, javelinmen and light cavalry skirmishers. Was there more than that? Did the Berber infantry fare well against their Spanish ennemies? Did they line "regular" infantries of swordmen as well?

I know these are very specific questions, but I will be grateful if only some of them are answered

[Edelfred]

I wonder one thing who were Berbers eventually -what language group they belonged to initially ?

Answering one of your questions - the Moors in Spain had good heavy infantry .
Most of us TW fans know about it from MTW 1

[Edelfred]

The real European mounted knights in plate armor were a rarety across the lands - even in Europe . Most of European countries did not have them or got them way too late to be of import and relevance due to lifting of ban on crossbow like ranged weapons and the development of firearms .
The plate armor , able war-horse and weapons costed around 100 dairy cows .
Nowdays a dairy cow price is :
Different breeds will cost more or less and the bloodlines of dairy cows can up the price however a median price for a dairy cow is between $1800-$3000.
So 100 cows costed around 200.000 $ , at least. How many Europeans with average income 20 $ a year could get a plate armor ?

Most of what now called knights were heavy cavalry in chain/scale armor . Inferior to plate and much cheaper too . . French knights - were mostly in chain . The Templiers for example even slept in it ,but alas not
in plate .

Wages in Henry V’s army were standardized. The daily rates of pay were: -
• For a Duke: 13 shillings and 4 pence (a sum known as a “mark”).
• For an Earl: 6 shillings and 8 pence (a sum known as a “noble”).
• For a Baron: 4 shillings.
• For a Knight (meaning a highly equipped man-at-arms): 2 shillings.
• For an Esquire(meaning a moderately well equipped man-at-arms): 1 shilling.
• For an Archer: 6 pence.

In approximate terms, the Archer’s daily wage of 6 pence would be worth about £12 or $25 today. Even a highly skilled civilian craftsman (such as a carpenter, mason or plumber) could expect to earn only between 50% and 80% of the Archer’s 6 pence per day: and the Archer’s food was also free.

[Maklodes]

Well, there's a quote from Wikipedia claiming "[The Almoravid dynasty's] main force was infantry, armed with javelins in the front ranks and pikes behind, which formed into a phalanx; and was supported by camelmen and horsemen on the flanks."

I've read that in the very first phases of Arab expansion, under Khalid ibn Al-Walid and such, Arab forces were primarily infantry (heavy infantry spearmen types and archers), but with some very good cavalry support (the Mobile Guard, and less renowned cavalry). At the Battle of Yarmouk, the Muslims allegedly had 36 infantry regiments and four cavalry regiments.

Later on, Arab warfare apparently became more cavalry focused, with an emphasis on heavy lancers. At the Battle of Tours, for instance, I think the Muslims likely had an entirely mounted force, although this could have been more because it was a raid than intended to be a real invasion. In the Great Berber revolt, we see a direct confrontation between the Arabs and Berbers. At least in the Battle of the Nobles, the Arabs were an entirely mounted force, while the Berbers were on foot -- although whether this was by choice or because the army was raised somewhat hastily in the circumstances of rebellion and hadn't time to be equipped with many horses is uncertain.

In the East, I think Turkish slave-soldiers (first Ghulams, then Mamluks) gained prominence in the Arab military establishment, bringing with them more of an emphasis on horse archery. In the West, I don't really know much of what was happening between the Battle of Tours and the little Wikipedia article on the Amoravid phalanx.

[Conrad82]

I wonder one thing who were Berbers eventually -what language group they belonged to initially ?

Answering one of your questions - the Moors in Spain had good heavy infantry .
Most of us TW fans know about it from MTW 1

Yeah, tough one must wonder how historically accurate the designers of the game were since in MTW1 the unit is slightly better than feudal men-at-arms but slightly worse than chivalric men-at-arms, and in MTW2 it is exactly on par with his Spanish equivalent (feudal and chivalric men-at-arms being mysteriously gone by the way)

[Manuel I Komnenos]

Besides of the Arabian emirates and their armies, there were autonomous Arabian tribes which had settled in Eastern Asia Minor and Northern Iraq and pledged their allegiance to rulers who promised better loot. These tribes had a certain style of fighting. For example, the Banu Habib who numbered 12.000 cavalrymen, converted to Christianity and settled in the frontier themes of the Byzantine Empire, adding a most valuable cavalry force in the manpower of the empire.

[sumskilz]

I wonder one thing who were Berbers eventually -what language group they belonged to initially ?

[ArmoredCore]

Depends on how you define "heavy" infantry. Armies over the time period had differing definitions of what consisted of a "heavy" infantryman.
Just look at the Romans for example who all but ditched lorica segmata and went to leather, scale and mail armor and later quilted armor.
Islamic armies had similar combinations of armors, complemented by varying layers of fabric armor.
Heck, even most European armies in the Medieval period had "heavy" soldiers like archers and infantrymen primarily outfitted with layers of soft armor.

I would expect Medieval Berber armies to break down into a lot of light infantry with various amounts of light fabric.
Heavy infantry with more layers of fabric and soft quilted armor. Super Heavy, where the quilted armor was augmented with scale, leather or chain mail.
Basically the "heavy" armor basically consisted of more layers of various types of armor, which was often seen in Byzantine armies of the time.
And of course being that the Muslims had the wealth and trade there were many fancy textiles in their layers, especially for the elites.


To tell the truth it wasn't much different from later "knights", except that the Europeans were much more uniform in organization and equipment.
But "heavy" has always just meant more layers of armor of different types.

As to what percentage was heavy or light in Berber armies, it probably varied, but no doubt many of the early waves were heavy infantry and some
say this was the main core of the armies in Andalus. And then the makeup varied based on the political circumstances.
The early Caliphate in Andalus probably had a large number of heavy type cavalry, which broke up and then was diminished during the taifa period.
Then the later Almoravid and Almohad likely had a good number of heavier infantry, but by the end of the Islamic presence the armies were worn
down and a lot of the forces seem to be local militias as opposed to real troops..... so the presence of heavy forces of any sort is an open question.