Infinite Money? Too Easy? Am I Doing This Wrong?

[HaHawk]

Hey guys!

I am sort of a latecomer to the party. I played RTW for the first time last winter (my first TW game) and had a blast, and I just started playing M2TW a few months ago. I absolutely LOVE it! I've clocked over 200 hours in a short time span, which isn't something you should normally brag about!!



Anyway, after I finished my first campaign in vanilla M2TW, I installed SS 6.4 and opted to play as Aragon because I read that it was a decent challenge in the beginning (early campaign player here) and that I could access excellent gun powder units later on in the game.

The first 40 or 50 turns or so were quite exciting and challenging. I had to deal with maintaining a shaky alliance with Portugal, all-out total war with the Moors — who for decades were far more powerful than my struggling little state — and was always engaging in skirmishes with Leon, interrupted only by Papal orders. But after I finally conquered the Iberian peninsula, drove the Moors out, and finished Leon, everything started to become very easy by around 70 turns into the campaign.

Within perhaps a dozen turns, I beat Sicily without so much as breaking a sweat, and then turned my sights to England. At first I thought England would put up a big fight, but instead they were fighting a two-front war with Scotland (William Wallace appeared at some point), and I took all of England's holdings in mainland Europe (6 or 7 provinces). I even invaded Britain (which I had not intended!)... and beat the campaign without really trying by around turn 100.

The "win" felt very lackluster. I maintained an immaculate reputation for nearly the whole time, even after aggressively using 10 assassins on a regular basis, and my treasury is now at 900,000 florins. I'm at turn 140 or so now, but there isn't anything to spend my money on as every settlement always has a building queued, and I even have quite a few "unnecessary" high end units garrisoned in the unlikeliest places because I have no need to disband them for financial reasons.

I'm kind of bummed because, while I obviously enjoy the game, I was REALLY looking forward to the gunpowder units! I know some people couldn't care less about them and even don't like using them, but hey, to each his own! So here I am, around turn 140 (year 1230ish?) and I'm wanting to just turtle a bit so I can use gunpowder units. But it gets sort of tedious to sit around and not do much (turtling). And as far as I know it will be another 100+ turns before I even access basic hand gunners and mortars, let alone bombards.

Should I simply start a new campaign (late era?) and go from there? Or does anyone have tips for speeding up the turtling process? Even when I just flip through stuff and stay at peace, I can easily spend 10-15 minutes on a turn (which means going another 100 turns would require 25 hours!!!).

How do you guys get to the later stages of the game without running into these issues?!!! Am I just too focused on micromanaging compared to most players?

I have to stress that I really enjoyed the difficulty of SS6.4 at the beginning, but now that I'm rolling in money I can just buy settlements on a whim, and it feels like cheating. Hey, Milan. That looks nice. Pay 10,000 florins for 6 or 7 turns and it's mine. Oh, Cologne. I'll take that, too... ad nauseam. I ended up buying half of Denmark's empire this way! They were one of my larger (neutral) competitors, but I diminished their empire to nearly nothing with the power of my treasury. And not a single shot fired! Surely I'm doing something "wrong" here..??!



Perhaps I should try another campaign as one of the "harder" factions like Lithuania? Was I misled about the difficulty of Aragon? But I am really attached to my Aragonese empire now!!!

[HaHawk]

Perhaps I should try another campaign as one of the "harder" factions like Lithuania? Was I misled about the difficulty of Aragon? But I am really attached to my Aragonese empire now!!!

It turns out after my most recent bout of turtling, I've managed to get to the year 1270...

[Lord of Shadows]

Maybe you should try using BGR-IV or V?

[Vissewalde rex de Gerzika]

Yes, the game is a bit easy without BGR, but with BGR IV or V it becomes a micromanagement nightmare. You could try BGR II that is available with base SS 6.4 already.

[Duck of Death]

What difficulty level are you playing on?
If easy or medium, try it on hard or very hard. That plus BGR makes it much harder.

[Phil125]

I was also very surprised how easy SS 6.4 was Vanilla. By turn 30 I was rolling with Novgorod VH/VH.

[Strengelicher]

Should I simply start a new campaign (late era?) and go from there? Or does anyone have tips for speeding up the turtling process? Even when I just flip through stuff and stay at peace, I can easily spend 10-15 minutes on a turn (which means going another 100 turns would require 25 hours!!!).

How do you guys get to the later stages of the game without running into these issues?!!! Am I just too focused on micromanaging compared to most players?

Perhaps I should try another campaign as one of the "harder" factions like Lithuania? Was I misled about the difficulty of Aragon? But I am really attached to my Aragonese empire now!!!

If you want to see late game units (gunpowder units), you should play a late campaign. Its starting date is 1220 and you will not have to wait so many turns. "Vanilla" Stainless Steel has inherited a weakness from the base game in so far that it becomes too easy once your empire has reached a certain size. You can drag this problem out by playing with advanced difficulty settings - vh/vh, Gracul AI, longer assimilation, BGR II, IV or V and so on. BGR V claims to provide late game challenge, but I have not yet played it, my unfinished campaigns still running on BGR IV. I would suggest you try out BGR IV, which I find quite to my liking. You should read the manual though.

[HaHawk]

If you want to see late game units (gunpowder units), you should play a late campaign. Its starting date is 1220 and you will not have to wait so many turns. "Vanilla" Stainless Steel has inherited a weakness from the base game in so far that it becomes too easy once your empire has reached a certain size. You can drag this problem out by playing with advanced difficulty settings - vh/vh, Gracul AI, longer assimilation, BGR II, IV or V and so on. BGR V claims to provide late game challenge, but I have not yet played it, my unfinished campaigns still running on BGR IV. I would suggest you try out BGR IV, which I find quite to my liking. You should read the manual though.

What difficulty level are you playing on?
If easy or medium, try it on hard or very hard. That plus BGR makes it much harder.

Thanks for the responses, folks. I did forget to mention that I am playing on H/VH (I think that's the right order? Campaign / Battle). I also upped the unit size with a sub-mod (to a maximum of I think 191 men for militia units? or somewhere thereabouts), which should theoretically reduce my population more than normal. I am not using BGR as I've heard some annoying things about it, even though I like the concept. However, I use most everything else (Real Recruitment; no building/training after conquering a new province; longer assimilation).

I'm thinking of just sticking with the campaign and role-playing a benevolent, massively wealthy kingdom for a while before perhaps doing something ridiculous once gunpowder turns up... like taking over the papacy or conquering the entire known world. But by then I might be in a position to just buy the remaining provinces outright with my unlimited funds ^_^

On another note, I've noticed that some people have problems with the Pope, but in my game, every single Cardinal is from my empire. It is as easy as recruiting the max number of priests and sending them all to the eastern provinces... Also sort of feels like cheating ^_^ Why doesn't the AI think to do this?

[Lord of Shadows]

On another note, I've noticed that some people have problems with the Pope, but in my game, every single Cardinal is from my empire. It is as easy as recruiting the max number of priests and sending them all to the eastern provinces... Also sort of feels like cheating ^_^ Why doesn't the AI think to do this?

I also have that problem when I have a large kingdom, and the only way to stop it is to kill your cardinals.

[Byg]

Thanks for the responses, folks. I did forget to mention that I am playing on H/VH (I think that's the right order? Campaign / Battle). I also upped the unit size with a sub-mod (to a maximum of I think 191 men for militia units? or somewhere thereabouts), which should theoretically reduce my population more than normal. I am not using BGR as I've heard some annoying things about it, even though I like the concept. However, I use most everything else (Real Recruitment; no building/training after conquering a new province; longer assimilation).

I'm thinking of just sticking with the campaign and role-playing a benevolent, massively wealthy kingdom for a while before perhaps doing something ridiculous once gunpowder turns up... like taking over the papacy or conquering the entire known world. But by then I might be in a position to just buy the remaining provinces outright with my unlimited funds ^_^

On another note, I've noticed that some people have problems with the Pope, but in my game, every single Cardinal is from my empire. It is as easy as recruiting the max number of priests and sending them all to the eastern provinces... Also sort of feels like cheating ^_^ Why doesn't the AI think to do this?

Hi. Surely one solution is obvious from your question. Why aren't you using the highest difficulty level?

You are annoyed because you are finding the standard game too simple and easy: the people who are annoyed by bgr find it too hard and complex. Simple games are easy games unless they challenge your co ordination rather than your mind. You need to decide which type of player you are and find a game that fits you.

SS usually allows decent and non-novice players to accumulate lots of money.

RR effectively slows recruitment

Gracul campaign AI is the toughest in standard SS.

Bgr2 adds a little logistical difficulty

BgrIV makes you work for that money a bit and adds more logistical and governance difficulty, but experts still get tons of money.

BGRV adds in many more medieval factors to challenge the player, enhances previous versions and is unbeaten so far.

Remember also that difficulty is relative. Playing on hard does not mean the game will be hard to you, just that it is harder than easy and medium.

Happy hunting.

[GRANTO]

i found it way too easy as well ....shame as its a good,good mod

[Larsel]

As byg said, first go VH/VH ---> it will still be VERY easy tho.
Then add various sub mods (those byg suggested) and go for either bgr4 or 5.
Bgr might add micro management but that what makes it harder cause it will make you make do more mistakes.
BUT even with BGR it can become easy too once you figure out how to play it, at least for me.
So what i also do is setting rules to myself which also adds reality to the game play:
- I dont accept men of honor etc. because i want to keep my blood-line pure and stay with the same last name as the first king of the faction.
- I dont reload saves if i lose an army out of position, loses an agent etc.
- Try add a reality to the game. What i do when i start get rolling and get a lot of land, i restrict myself and instead of (for example) get all of spain if you play as portugal, try maybe get only the top half or so, then fortify your settlements and save up money to go on a crusade or make an army and set out for england, so you wage war on a faction far away which makes your army more vulnerable.
- I dont do this, but to make it harder you can choose to ONLY auto resolve battles. Because if you micro the battles yourself you can abuse your units and win (too) decisively

Try all these suggestions and then pick a faction which starts in a hard position, and for god sake start in late era (1220) its way funnier as you dont have to wait so long for the technology.

hope it helps

[Black_Rider]

You can also try this mod: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...onal-Buildings

It reduces your income from settlements by 50%.