Question about Modernization

[locoace3]

Well i was reading the fluff about hoplites, the new and the old, and i saw that the hoplites went through modernization, and left the days of the full cuirass and big hoplon to a more modern style. So my question is, during EB timeframe were they just starting to do this? since distinguished hoplites, spartans, and naturally the classical still fighting the old style, so was this not widely accepted? was it already long in effect and some still held to old traditions? Was it just starting to change?

Also hoplites in the far east still fight in the old style, but i can only assume it's because tactics and such spread much more slowly back then

[Entropy Judge]

Well i was reading the fluff about hoplites, the new and the old, and i saw that the hoplites went through modernization, and left the days of the full cuirass and big hoplon to a more modern style. So my question is, during EB timeframe were they just starting to do this?

Without knowing precisely what information you're referring to, it sounds like you're talking about the Iphikratian reforms and the development of Thureophoroi. According to the information in the Iphikratious Hoplites text, the 'modernization' is just starting to pick up speed at the beginning of the game, as the final developments of equipment for the I Hoplitai were around 280.

since distinguished hoplites, spartans, and naturally the classical still fighting the old style, so was this not widely accepted? was it already long in effect and some still held to old traditions? Was it just starting to change?

Just starting, and even past the full implementations of the Iphikration reforms, some groups would presumably continue to use the old styles - tried, true, and familiar. IIRC, Sparta continued to field 'Classical' Hoplites up through the Roman invasion.

[locoace3]

Without knowing precisely what information you're referring to, it sounds like you're talking about the Iphikratian reforms and the development of Thureophoroi. According to the information in the Iphikratious Hoplites text, the 'modernization' is just starting to pick up speed at the beginning of the game, as the final developments of equipment for the I Hoplitai were around 280.

Yes those hoplites so, if the macedonians showed how the old hoplites failed, then what points did they take to make them better? Flexibility, and speed over armor and cohesion? Also didn't they romanize a little?

Just starting, and even past the full implementations of the Iphikration reforms, some groups would presumably continue to use the old styles - tried, true, and familiar. IIRC, Sparta continued to field 'Classical' Hoplites up through the Roman invasion.

Hm, well i suppose the roman invasion shown how the old style held up to hastati and principes.

[Principe Alessandro]

Iphikratous and Thorakitai Hoplites having also a sword as a secondary weapon are better suited in fighting infantry and employing them in a aggressive fashion while Spartan, Classical and Epilektoi hoplites are better suited in a stationary defensive role.

Also the second group of hoplites even if has better armor gets some penalties while fighting against infantry for the light_spear attribute of the primary weapon.

My advice anyway is to recruit the reformed hoplites both for their cost efficiency and their tactical flexibility.

[Entropy Judge]

Iphikratous and Thorakitai Hoplites having also a sword as a secondary weapon

Worth noting is that the T Hoplitai's sword is a Kopis (AP, .11 Lethality), while the Iphikratians have a good Shortsword (.13 Lethality).

Also the second group of hoplites even if has better armor gets some penalties while fighting against infantry for the light_spear attribute of the primary weapon.

As the Light_Spear (if my old posts on the subject were accurate) applies a -4 Penalty to the Attack of the Spear unit, it's not that bad. Iphiktratians, for example, would have the same Attack whether they use their Spears or Swords.

My advice anyway is to recruit the reformed hoplites both for their cost efficiency and their tactical flexibility.

There was also some discussion a while ago as to the effectiveness of the Iphikratians.

[Sint]

You could play a Koinon Hellenon campaign ,that would probly answer your question

Also didn't they romanize a little

More like celtinized