Help With a (Mostly) Thrakian Army

[locoace3]

i'm an infantry heavy defensive army sort of guy and seeing if my current army composition would work, i have them in battle right now and my main line seems to be hurting against these celtic levies.

5 Triballi Infantry Main line.
2 Thracian Spearmen On the wings
2 Thracian Light Spearmen, as reserve
2 Tracian Elite Infantry, as reserve, and assault troops in a siege
2 Slingers on the wings, behind the spearmen (or if it's flat ground or a slope, then directly in front of spears)
2 Thracian Peltasts Behind Main Line
2 Thracian Light Skirmisher Cavalry, rear guard on the wings
1 Thracian Medium Cavalry, with the general in the rear
1 Celtic Lesser King
1 3 Cubit Projector (for the hell of it, this can be replaced by anything really)

[yuezhi]

What difficulty are you playing on?

[locoace3]

medium as usual. I don't go above that because it doesn't make the AI better, it just gives the AI free handouts and buffed units

[Entropy Judge]

i'm an infantry heavy defensive army sort of guy and seeing if my current army composition would work, i have them in battle right now and my main line seems to be hurting against these celtic levies.

Echoing yuezhi, what Battle Difficulty? Also, what 'Levies' are you facing? Which faction are you?

5 Triballi Infantry Main line.
2 Thracian Spearmen On the wings

Depending on how you fight, it might be worth switching these numbers and placement. Spearmen usually make for a better "Main Line" unit than Swordsmen, who are better at flanking. (As an aside, who are the "Thracian Spearmen"? I can't find them in the heimstatt unit list.)

2 Thracian Light Spearmen, as reserve

Probably not worth it. If you're going to use these, you should use them as impromptu skirmishers (swap for Thracian Peltasts?) or aggressive flankers - they're too light to serve as a useful reserve.

2 Tracian Elite Infantry, as reserve, and assault troops in a siege

Good choice, you basically can't go wrong with these guys (unless you don't use them to fight in battles where they'd be useful).

2 Slingers on the wings, behind the spearmen (or if it's flat ground or a slope, then directly in front of spears)

Depending on your enemies, might be worth swapping these with archers, or increased numbers of Thracian Peltasts.

2 Thracian Peltasts Behind Main Line

These guys should be used aggressively. If you increase the numbers of these guys (cheesy, but effective ...), you can keep 1-2 units as reserves while the others serve as aggressors and flankers.

2 Thracian Light Skirmisher Cavalry, rear guard on the wings

Good units, but not terribly useful as Rear Guards; they should be used aggressively to skirmish against the infantry line or to draw off and disrupt enemy cavalry. Remember that they have Sword secondaries, so they can't Charge.

1 Thracian Medium Cavalry, with the general in the rear

As with many of my other suggestions, Thraikioi Prodromoi should be used aggressively. They are very good, and charge nearly as well as heavier cavalry.

1 Celtic Lesser King

Should be fighting, or waiting with the Rhomphaiaphoroi as Reserves. If your General is a Cavalry unit, having him wait is forgivable, but Celtae Vollorix are close-combat monsters (Longswords help). Unless you're really unlucky, your General should survive.

1 3 Cubit Projector (for the hell of it, this can be replaced by anything really)

Siege weapons are, by and large, not worth it. Replace with ... anything, really. Triballi, T Prodromoi/Peltastai/Rhomphaiaphoroi.

[locoace3]

Echoing yuezhi, what Battle Difficulty? Also, what 'Levies' are you facing? Which faction are you?


Depending on how you fight, it might be worth switching these numbers and placement. Spearmen usually make for a better "Main Line" unit than Swordsmen, who are better at flanking. (As an aside, who are the "Thracian Spearmen"? I can't find them in the heimstatt unit list.)

Probably not worth it. If you're going to use these, you should use them as impromptu skirmishers (swap for Thracian Peltasts?) or aggressive flankers - they're too light to serve as a useful reserve.


Good choice, you basically can't go wrong with these guys (unless you don't use them to fight in battles where they'd be useful).


Depending on your enemies, might be worth swapping these with archers, or increased numbers of Thracian Peltasts.


These guys should be used aggressively. If you increase the numbers of these guys (cheesy, but effective ...), you can keep 1-2 units as reserves while the others serve as aggressors and flankers.


Good units, but not terribly useful as Rear Guards; they should be used aggressively to skirmish against the infantry line or to draw off and disrupt enemy cavalry. Remember that they have Sword secondaries, so they can't Charge.


As with many of my other suggestions, Thraikioi Prodromoi should be used aggressively. They are very good, and charge nearly as well as heavier cavalry.


Should be fighting, or waiting with the Rhomphaiaphoroi as Reserves. If your General is a Cavalry unit, having him wait is forgivable, but Celtae Vollorix are close-combat monsters (Longswords help). Unless you're really unlucky, your General should survive.


Siege weapons are, by and large, not worth it. Replace with ... anything, really. Triballi, T Prodromoi/Peltastai/Rhomphaiaphoroi.

Epeiros for faction, and celtic spear levy


Ah, i usually have spearmen (or in the case of my main hellenic army, pikes) wanted to see how swords worked
Also i was thinking thrace, they're illryian spearmen

I want to have a decent reserve that is cheap, they make up the third line, these are last ditch men, who also are used as fodder sometimes


indeed, i always have some elite units with me


I prefer slings for the range, and AP, also my area doesn't have any archers


I'm usually rather static, with the peltasts as extra dakka before the lines meet, usually them meeting me, not the other way around


I actually use light cavalry, as again more dakka, and some mobile forces, to flank and chase down light infantry/archers/fleeing


I will generally try to maneuver them around in a drawn out battle, as flankers



i rarely use generals in combat, unless they are cavalry.


Yeah i just wanted to see if they were any fun.

[Entropy Judge]

Epeiros for faction, and celtic spear levy

Unless you're simply getting overwhelmed because you aren't committing enough troops to the fight, you really shouldn't be having trouble dealing with Lugoae.

Ah, i usually have spearmen (or in the case of my main hellenic army, pikes) wanted to see how swords worked

Swords can work, but they usually require a bit different timing and some practice. The unit mix is usually a bit different as well.

Also i was thinking thrace, they're illryian spearmen

Ah, they're a nice tough unit.

I want to have a decent reserve that is cheap, they make up the third line, these are last ditch men, who also are used as fodder sometimes

Frankly, you have contradicting goals; a "last-ditch reserve" should be made up of high-quality units, not fodder. Might I suggest something like the Gallo-Thracian Infantry? Smaller and more expensive, but better-able to serve both roles - they're good enough to serve as a useful 'Reserve' unit, but not so high-tier that you feel bad throwing them into the teeth of an assault. I would have suggested Galatian Shortswordsmen, but they're probably a worse choice.

While more expensive and more rare, Agrianians are another unit that work effectively as a 'Reserve' unit.

I prefer slings for the range, and AP, also my area doesn't have any archers

Fair enough, it's just that slings are only of limited use against some unit types; against low-armour units, slingers aren't particularly cost-effective. (Also, if you're in an area you can recruit Thraikioi Rhomphaiaphoroi, you can recruit Sotaroas or Scythian Foot Archers nearby; the latter are quite good.)

I'm usually rather static, with the peltasts as extra dakka before the lines meet, usually them meeting me, not the other way around

If you're going to do that, I'd suggest moving them to the inside wings, so they can throw their javelins all along the lines, then move out to flank the attackers.

i rarely use generals in combat, unless they are cavalry.

The thing is, the Infantry Generals are really good at it. If you're going to have them in the army, you should be using them, because their stats and weapons allow them to chew through a lot of units.

[locoace3]

Unless you're simply getting overwhelmed because you aren't committing enough troops to the fight, you really shouldn't be having trouble dealing with Lugoae.

That's probably it, the enemy made a concentrated push against my right flank

Swords can work, but they usually require a bit different timing and some practice. The unit mix is usually a bit different as well.

Something different, i'll keep it up

Frankly, you have contradicting goals; a "last-ditch reserve" should be made up of high-quality units, not fodder. Might I suggest something like the Gallo-Thracian Infantry? Smaller and more expensive, but better-able to serve both roles - they're good enough to serve as a useful 'Reserve' unit, but not so high-tier that you feel bad throwing them into the teeth of an assault. I would have suggested Galatian Shortswordsmen, but they're probably a worse choice.

While more expensive and more rare, Agrianians are another unit that work effectively as a 'Reserve' unit.

Agrianians are part of my main army actually, i do like the look at the gallo-thracian infantry, i like them. mostly i like their snappy uniforms

Fair enough, it's just that slings are only of limited use against some unit types; against low-armour units, slingers aren't particularly cost-effective. (Also, if you're in an area you can recruit Thraikioi Rhomphaiaphoroi, you can recruit Sotaroas or Scythian Foot Archers nearby; the latter are quite good.)

best i have, don't mind that though, i'm rolling in the mnai

If you're going to do that, I'd suggest moving them to the inside wings, so they can throw their javelins all along the lines, then move out to flank the attackers.

hm, alright

The thing is, the Infantry Generals are really good at it. If you're going to have them in the army, you should be using them, because their stats and weapons allow them to chew through a lot of units.

I suppose i can make him more prominent