The 10 things you want to see in Rome II

[GRANTO]

1:siege ai{fixed}
2:family tree{added}
3:battle ai{fixed}
4:performance{nvidia driver at least}
5:politics{there is none atm}
6:defenceless towns /citys {crap}
7:modding tools{for map ,units, buildings the whole shebang}
8:campaign ai {hopeless}
9:sea battles {garbage}
10:seasons 2-4tpy...................thanks CA{ shut the door on the way out and leave it to us modders to make the game everybody wanted..bye}
11:anything else that i cant think of atm..........dont get me started

[DarrenTotalWar]

1:siege ai{fixed}
2:family tree{added}
3:battle ai{fixed}
4:performance{nvidia driver at least}............

Glad you could join us with a real list!

[Dago Red]

8. Remove unwalled cities

14. Transport ships.

These are a little unclear. I might suggest re-wording to avoid confusion going forward as:

8. Add walls to all cities (that historically had them / or option to build)

14. Remove army ability to transform into navy / or add transport only-ships to navies / re-vamp army movement over sea zones.

[Garensterz]

Have you finished the video yet?

[DarrenTotalWar]

Have you finished the video yet?

I will be starting on it in about 6hrs. Should be done and posted by Saturday. The numbers are very close so I want as many replies as possible to add more seperation to the list.

[rhinoinsomniac]

1. Challenging Battle AI
2. Challenging Campaign AI
3. Much more modding support.
4. Transport ships are OP. For the player and the AI.
5. Avatar Conquest.
6. More Diplomacy options.
7. Victory Points are really, really stupid.
8. Naval Battles. I don't need to explain this one.

read below if you want detailed (I think they're detailed) explanations. May cause eye hemorrhaging. Forgive me. I have 461 hours on record playing this game vanilla and modded. Don't ask me how.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

1. better BAI - I don't understand many things.

• The AI shuffling its formation repeatedly is a little annoying. Especially when it makes them more vulnerable because I'm way too close to them when they do it sometimes.

• I know this is my fault for playing this way but, wtf. The AI should not find it acceptable to stand and be shot to death by arrows, javelins, sling rocks, and artillery. This is so stupid. It should either move out of range and try to find cover or it should make an audacious attack to kill the people killing them with unholy death from the skies. Unbelievable.

• Siege battle AI is laughable. I don't understand how i can attack a defending settlement/city with the enemy outnumbering me by 2 to 1 or more. And i will still win. Reliably. Realistically - the defenders should realize they outnumber me and don't need to be shot to pieces. All they have to do is - omg - leave the streets and attack me. With their overwhelming numbers they will utterly destroy me if they just zerg rush.

• Why does the AI sit in cities/settlements during battles? I have never seen them send forces to attack my attacking force other than landing parties that were close to some of my cavalry that's only there to kill landing parties.
• I would like the program to do a calculation. simple as this. if the enemy AI outnumbers player in a battle - they should be aggressive and attack. If its about equal they should either do a balanced approach of attack and defend or just one or the other. If enemy AI is outnumbered it should just either defend or have some small chance of being last stand stupid brave and all out attacking with no thought concerning survival. thats a few possibilities based on Army vs Army size. with a few personalities paired to the outcomes.

2. better CAI

• Some of this stuff is changed by mods quite a bit. But that's sad really. Vanilla R2 doesn't have mega empire AI factions in late game. I am baffled. I installed a mod that reduced money minor factions received and major factions were still floundering. WTH. They are just not aggressive and war mongering. They really need to be more bloodthirsty.
• I have had treacherous allies before. I'm confused as to why they're so untrustworthy cuz i never saw them once break an alliance with me in 1 turn, attack my undefended border towns and just overall screw me for trusting them so much. That's what treachery means to me. The only reason i don't play treacherously much in the main campaign is because it hurts my diplomatic relations with every faction. Even factions that like me ffs.
• Shogun 2 had scary late game consequences if you left a faction alone or couldn't control their expansion. So wth happened between now and then? I want my "holy , im gonna pee my pants if i fight these guys" feeling back.

3. more modding support

• forgive me if im wrong and this is present somewhere. I would really like the files to have basic explanations of what they do. I was taught every good programmer should leave comments detailing his work so other people understand it. As far as i know - this is not the case here. I see no explanations of what anything means other than by users who have just figured it out or who have the knowledge from previous warscape titles.
• modding tools would be appreciated. i love PFM and thanks daniu but i really think the official team could give us more. the elder scrolls series supports modding and oh my gawsh theyre still doing well. Their company secrets aren't all over the place losing them money. Actually i believe having such great mods is what keeps people playing skyrim and buying the expansions and dlc.

4. transport ships. lol.

• why do they take no time or resources to build? why do they travel the same speed as navies? WHY do they destroy navies? Why, even nerfed by mods - can my hardened navy melee ship board a transport ship and still lose? Why are they so damn fast on the battle map?
• ugh, typing about this made me think of all the problems with naval combat. Screw naval combat.

5. Avatar conquest.

• not a high priority of mine but it was very fun in shogun 2. Especially because it was way more challenging.

6. diplomacy options.

• why cant i bully the spirit out of other factions? huh? i want to strong arm. and i want the enemy to try strong arming me. and if i refuse i want there to be consequences. Like "accept this or i will come to your lands, rape and pillage, and generally screw up everything you love"
• there should be an option to ask a faction to make peace with a faction theyre warring. and they should be able to ask the same of you. It's so ing stupid that its not included. It's a very basic concept. "please stop hitting him. I like him." "ok, well i think you're cute so i'll stop fighting this wimp" simple.

7. victory points are stupid. In their current state.

• when the enemy AI cares more about going thro my impenetrable line of awesome ass (insert faction elite here) soldiers to make it to a victory point - i get a little upset.
• VP's in their current state ruin several things. Capture points are fine - cuz theyre needed for towers and gates. VP's are just stupid. The only thing VP's should do in a city/settlement battle is lower the morale of the defending army if captured. If held - their morale should be raised. Simple.

[rhinoinsomniac]

reread the title of this thread. Can't edit previous post cuz i haven't earned it yet lol.
4. Transport ships are either out and navies carry armies or transport ships take time to build and resources and cannot be used in naval battles. (or extremely weak)
7. Victory points are not victory points. they don't declare a winner for being captured by attacker or being held till end by defender. All they do is raise/lower morale.
8. Functioning naval battles. Barbarians should have more focus on boarding parties that are badass. And fast light ships. Naval Combat needs to be slower. It's way too fast atm.

[Tsarsies]

In order of what i feel is most important:


1. More modding potential
2. Better AI (BAI and CAI)
3. Political system fleshed out
4. Better established Civil Wars - should be included in the political system
5. Seasons - this would obviously include multiple turns per year
6. More Character Depth
7. More building options
8. More involved naval transport system (instead of insta-transports)
9. More intuitive unit cards
10. Smaller UI

But really, the above list is more what should be fixed/improved in the game...

[Rafkos]

- working battle AI
- all performance bugs fixed
- giving regions to other factions
- fixed trade system (Sparta)
- option to change the capital of faction
- working siege battles
- a familly tree
- UI from alpha version
- huge campaign map
* Ability to build roads, walls
- build PORTS for ALL coastal regions

[DragonHeart1791]

The things I would most like to see would be
#1 Family Tree
#2 Battle AI
#3 Multiple Turns per year for base game
#4 improved Naval AI
#5 Improved Civil War Mechanic

[Ataegina]

- seasons
- border forts
- family tree (so would make sense the options given on the menu "marriage,etc etc")
- Senate faction (unplayable)
- elect consuls and assign them to provinces

[Retógenes]

1. A coherent and working political system (Civil War is part of Political System = A coherent and working Civil War also) & Different political mechanics for diferent factions (Republics, Monarchies, Barbarians, etc.)
2. Better AI (BAI and CAI)
3. Settlement management, Province management and faction management that has not been designed for a 5 year old boy. (That includes more (10-15 or more) building slots, individual public order, Tax management, Culture statistics and city growth for each settlement, Walls for each settlement...)
4. More diplomatic options (Give/request settlement, End war against..., "Threaten option", etc.)
5. Seasons
6. A reason to have fleets
7. More differentiation between different types of agents
8. Random events & Decissions (Like Paradox Games)
9. Deeper trade
10. Culture-style UI (Wood for Celtics, Marble for Romans...)
...


11. CA and SEGA bankruptcy and the purchase by Paradox of the Total War franchise.

[Suomen SuurRuhtinas]

1.Better siege AI
2.Better AI
3.Family Tree
4.Better politics
5.More units
6.Fire at will
7.Sacred Band Cavarly
8.Walls to Syracusa
9.Axe animations
10.Working autoresolve

[Durnaug]

1. Intelligence intercepts that reveal plans of the enemy a few turns in advance; or their situation. Might be a ruse, rumour or fact. This could be displayed graphically or via a boring text dialogue Thus you could send a spy to the enemy with fake information about where a certain general will attack. Such activities are accounted for at least in the classical greek military histories, e.g. the famous Spartan communication that was intercepted by the Athenians "Ships gone. Mindaros dead. Men starving. Don't know what to do". Or the Athenian general Iphikrates who, on learning that a Spartan general had died, refused to believe the report thinking it might be a dastardly Spartan trick. Or Themistocles luring in the Persian fleet (sneaky git). Ah well, probably asking too much.

2. Hoplites correctly wielding the aspis and at least an attempt to depict a correct hoplite phalanx stance and combat mechanics (although that is a tad controversial).

[DarrenTotalWar]

Ok guys, I've gathered all the info. 50 posts of good stuff. Video coming saturday. Thank you all for participating. I'm sure many of you will keep posting your fixes/desires later, but I cannot aggregate them aswell.

I've hidden the list on the original post so people can't see the top 10 just yet I have explained how I've aggregated the scores though, so if you're bored enough you can read every single post and figure it out yourself!

Thank you all!

[perifanosEllinas]

Ok guys, I've gathered all the info. 50 posts of good stuff. Video coming saturday. Thank you all for participating. I'm sure many of you will keep posting your fixes/desires later, but I cannot aggregate them aswell.

I've hidden the list on the original post so people can't see the top 10 just yet I have explained how I've aggregated the scores though, so if you're bored enough you can read every single post and figure it out yourself!

Thank you all!

Oops! I hope I'm not too late to the party mate.My post took a long time to gather the info from testing the game and type,so I would appreciate it if you didn't ignore it.Thanks

[DarrenTotalWar]

Oops! I hope I'm not too late to the party mate.My post took a long time to gather the info from testing the game and type,so I would appreciate it if you didn't ignore it.Thanks

I'll include as much of your points as I can, at this stage the final 10 have been decided, but some of the points you raise are good and will be mentioned

[perifanosEllinas]

I'll include as much of your points as I can, at this stage the final 10 have been decided, but some of the points you raise are good and will be mentioned

OK! I'm looking forward to watching it

[perifanosEllinas]

10)Introduce inspiring and memorable music.

Noone can forget the music of RTW,while on the contrary noone can remember the music of TWR2.RTW's music made me feel strong emotions,but TWR2's music is so boring and uninspiring that I don't even pay attention to it.Something has to be done about it.

9)Reduce the end turn/loading times.
They both last frustratingly long.They actually last so long that they break the immersion of the player and make him/her want to quit.

8)Fix the unit rosters and the unit stats.

The unit rosters are very poor and generic.Most factions have way too few units to choose from and most units are copy/pasted among most factions with just differently coloured tunics.Every faction should have at least one unique unit.

About the unit stats,they're just a mess at the moment.The barbarian units are extremely overpowered (especially their elites),while the "civilized" professional units are way underpowered.There are absurd imbalances among the units.For example the Athenian "thorax hoplites" have way superior stats (including morale!) than the Spartan hoplites,which is totally retarded.Or the "oathsworn" crushing a sarissa phalanx head on is totally retarded too,especially when we're talking about elite phalangites.Another factor that messes with the unit stats is the lack of historical accuracy in certain units.For example the Spartan hoplites wore brass/bronze breastplate,while in TWR2 they wear linothorax,which obviously reduces their armour stats notably.Even Roman elite units struggle against the oathsworn and get defeated.Such imbalances are totally battle breakers and immersion killers.

7)Fix the politics.

Ridiculously high prices for useless effects

No effect for the rest of the campaign at all

Generic and expendable generals that make no connection with the player at all

Wrong modifiers (for example it says +1 influence and the result is losing 1 influnce)

Broken civil war that the player has no power or control over

Random and useless traits.For example "zeal",while the game doesn't even say what those traits do.Yeah,"warrior" is not much of information,is it?

6)Bring the cut features back.

Family tree

Skill tree.You're supposed to know what comes next when you choose a skill.

Factions intros

Generals speeches before battles

Agents cutscenes

City view

Guard mode

Seasons(including the option for 2 or 4 turns per year,so that everyone's happy)

5)Fix some stupid campaign mechanics.

Remove the transports.They make navies and admirals useless and they cancel the strategic value of land as natural defensive barrier.They also flood the sea with transports that do nothing further and mess up the AI even more.

Remove the stupid rule that only the provincial capitals can have walls,which resulted in cities with huge stone walls like Syracuse and Rhodes being portrayed in the game as tiny,wall-less villages.This doesn't necessarily mean that every city must have walls,but definitely more cities need walls than just the capitals.

Remove the ugly pony animation from the map.Playing as Sparta and watching my generals move around on ponies was so lame and immersion breaking.

Introduce faction specific advisors.Playing as any non-Roman faction and having a Roman advisor is so lame and immersion breaking.

Reduce the unreasonably huge negative modifiers to food and public order for every building after a certain level.

Reduce the size of the cities.It has messed up the map in many areas,like for example Euboea.

Fix the very bad relation between the campaign and the battle maps.

4)Fix the AI.

Of course I'm not expecting the AI to magically transform into a genius,it wasn't able to do so for the last 13 years or so.What I expect is a functional AI.For example seeing the AI unable to even use the ladders in sieges is unacceptable.

Make the AI able to use siege equipment.

Make the AI make reasonable decisions in diplomacy.Declaring war at a faction on the other side of the map which doesn't even interact with the AI just because it has a negative modifier in diplomacy feels so retarded and fun breaking.

Make the AI stay and defend its cities on the map.

Make the AI able to respond to different siege scenarios.

All in all,make the AI functional and reasonable.

3)Fix the UI.

The UI is just horrible and needs to be completely redone.It's totally unfitting and impractical sci fi futuristic UI in both campaign and battles.The UI has been way worsened compared to RTW in every possible way.Way too streamlined (in the bad way,not more accessible and easier to use,but actually stripped of many important information) and visually ugly in both campaign and battle.The battle UI is huge for no reason and takes way too much space of the screen.

The unit cards are ugly and impractical.They all look the same,so distinguishing the units is very hard.The many icons that hide the soldiers in the cards make it even harder to distinguish the units.And the unit card panel is way too huge for no reason and practically hides half the screen during battles,so I just turn it off and get done with it,but that's not how it's supposed to be.The UI should be helping the player,not harassing him/her and destroying the gameplay experience.

The building icons are totally unfitting and impractical.Sci-fi futuristic hieroglyphics don't fit a historical game about the ancient world obviously.Those hieroglyphics make it hard to know which building is each icon for and contribute in destroying the overall immersion.I don't feel like I'm building anything,but like I'm solving a hieroglyphics puzzle.Pretty weird huh?

A really good UI is the UI which provides the maximum amount of information in the minimum amount of space and time possible.In TWR2 it's the exact opposite.The UI provides the minimum amount of information in the maximum amount of time and space,that's why I call it horrible.Having to constantly move my mouse over each single icon to find out what it does instead of having all the information of the same subject gathered in one page is very tiring and annoying.

And lastly,give a cultural touch to each group of cultures,like for example marble for Roman,Hellenic and Hellenistic factions,wood for barbarians etc.

2)Fix the battle mechanics.

Remove the torches.They make siege equipment useless.They also contribute to the overall immersion breaking.

Remove the magic abilities.Another battle and immersion breaker.They make absolutely no sense at all.They are just magic buffs and simply have no place in a historical TW game.They are an additional unnecessary micromanagement burden for the player.Keep only the old tested ones from RTW and a couple new formations for the barbarians.Most of the rest should be removed and the few remaining ones should turn to passives.

Replace the "vehicle" ladders with normal ladders.They are immersion breaking.

Increase the unit morals notably.Battles are supposed to last a bit longer than 3 minutes.

Drastically increase the number of soldiers in each unit.160 max is very disappointing.It needs to be at least 240 like in RTW.

At last make use of the spear's true worth,the reach.Make the spearmen engage with 2 lines of spears when fighting in formation.This was the basic advantage of spearmen against non-spear melee units.It's about time we see this introduced in a TW game.

And the most important issue with battles in TWR2,FORMATIONS!!! The "civilized" units are not supposed to fight exactly like the barbarian units.

a)Introduce proper formation animations in battles for the "civilized" units,which are supposed to maintain the lines during battles,unless they are pressed at both opposite sides (front and back or both sides) or all sides obviously.

b)Something extremely important that is wrong at the moment in TWR2 is that the formation is defeated in close combat at the front!This should never happen.When two units with similar stats fight each other the formation should always win.For example unit "A" fights against unit "B" on even ground and both units have similar stats.Unit A is in formation while unit B is not.Unit A should win because of the formation,which provides great protection to the sides of each soldier within the unit.But the opposite happens in TWR2,as unit B would surround unit A and easily defeat it because of the flank attack bonuses.This needs to be fixed.The formation should even balance the casualties between units with very different stats.Let's say that in the previous example the unit A has medium stats while unit B has elite stats.The unit A fights in formation though and since they fight at the front and on even ground the formation should balance the casualties of both units and the battle should last a bit longer.What I mean by "balance of casualties" is that unit A should take casualties at a much slower rate because of the protection that the formation provides the unit and this could possibly mean that the two units take about the same casualties in a specific amount of time.The formation should provide a notable defensive bonus and reduction in casualties recieved rating.

c)Another major problem with formations in TWR2 is that units abandon them immediately when the fight begins,or even when the player orders the unit to attack.This is one of the major factors as to why the battles in this game are blobbing mess instead of proper battles.This must be fixed.

d)The "loose formation" button should be given to all factions and not just Rome.

e)Either fix the new "formation attack" button or just bring back the guard mode.

f)Give the "fire at will" button to all the melee units carrying javelins or pilla.

1)Fix the damn phalanx already!!!

Sigh...The phalanx in TWR2...It's been 3 months and 7 patches already and both versions of the phalanx are still broken.They both function wrong,look wrong and have the wrong role on the battlefield,which practically means that they are wrong in every aspect.This is a very serious problem of the game,as it destroys all the Hellenic and Hellenistic factions and since we're talking about the Hellenistic era they are many.

Hoplite phalanx

looks: It looks nothing like a hoplite phalanx.In fact it looks like any generic barbarian unit.No shield walls of interlocking shields.No dorys walls.No dorys pointed towards the enemy.Only the first line gets in battle stance while the rest lines just stand there watching the scenery.While fighting it looks like any generic barbarian unit too.There is no formation,no lines and every hoplite fights individually as if he is not part of a unit.Really poor representation.

function: They engage with only 1 line of dorys,there is no shield wall,they abandon formation when they engage in battle or when ordered to,they deal casualties at a very slow rate and take casualties at a very high rate.But their most stupid and annoying issue is the restriction to the length of their front.This causes them to always be surrounded and easily defeated.It's anti-historical and immersion breaking.

This is how they are supposed to be like: They should engage with 3 lines of dorys,they should form multiple layers of shield walls,they should always fight in formation and never abandon it unless the player orders them to,they should cause casualties at a very high rate (they are attacking with 3 lines of dorys),they should take casualties at a very slow rate (they are protected by a wall of brass/bronze from head to toe,including the armour and the shield wall) and they should definitely be able to widen their front as much as they want,even to the level of 2 men deep.This is how they fought historically in most of the times anyway,with wide front and reasonable depth,not the opposite.

role on the battlefield: In TWR2 they are a defensive unit and a very underpowered one actually.In reality they were an aggressive unit,designed to cause massive casualties to the enemy while taking the minimum casualties possible.Of course they could also operate as a defensive unit,as for example did the Athenian center in Marathon,but the main purpose of the formation was attack and this needs to be fixed in the game.

Sarissa phalanx

It's not as bad as the hoplite phalanx,but it's still quite bad and after the patch changes it's actually even way worse than it used to be on release.

looks: It doesn't look like it's supposed to either.No sarissa walls,huge gaps between the men,huge gaps between the lines,wrong deployment within the unit.It looks quite bad.

function: They only engage with 3 lines of sarissas,there are no sarissa walls as there are huge gaps between them,they cannot hold the enemy at distance,their enemies ignore the sarissas and pass right through,they can run while in formation and they cause casualties at a high rate.

This is how they are supposed to be like: They should engage with 5 lines of sarissas,they should fight in a very tight and dense formation so that there are no gaps between the sarissas and sarissa walls are shaped,they should be able to hold the enemy at a distance and for a very long time actually,their enemies should struggle to get through the sarissa walls,they should not be able to run while in formation and they should cause casualties at a rate according to their level,for example levie pikemen low rate casualties,normal pikemen normal rate casualties,elite pikemen high rate casualties etc.

role on the battlefield: In TWR2 they are an aggressive unit that causes massive casualties to the enemy.While in reality they were a defensive unit that was designed to keep the enemy at distance for a very long time to give the necessary time to the flanks to act.Its role was to pin and delay the enemy for as much as possible and not annihilate the enemy unit as the sarissa phalanx currently is in the game.

With every aspect of the 2 versions of the formation wrong in the game I certainly have the right to call it broken and I definitely expect it to be fixed,as it was way superior in RTW,which was released 9 (!) whole years ago.

[Aenima]

Saturday has come and gone, Darren! Video, o, video, where art thou?