[Question] Diplomacy script removal sub-mod

[Ziame]

Hi, guys,

I wondered if anyone has, or has seen a submod for CoW, that would disable those diplomacy scripts (increasing/decreasing standings and forcing alliances). I would love to play this mod as a sandbox.

What I want to keep:
mercenaries, unique units, money scripts etc

What I want to get rid of:
- Alliance scripts
- Faction standings scripts
- Diplomats restrictions


As it is now:
example: Ostland(PC) breaks alliance with Kislev and declares war. Next turn script kicks in, Ostland is allies with Kislev.


Cheers!

[Grimaldus]

Yeah. Would love to see some fights between the different human nations. Isnt it lore that there are small wars here and there for land and might in the Empire?

[Ziame]

Indeed, lore supports the concept. Furthermore, some factions are just useless -- because you can't expand (Averland, Tabalecland(sp?) etc), because you can't have war.


While I appreciate all the scripting (mercenaries, chaos storm is pretty awesome), I would like to prepare for chaos storm by unifying everything.

By force.

[Ziame]

Yeah. Would love to see some fights between the different human nations. Isnt it lore that there are small wars here and there for land and might in the Empire?

Alright, I managed to do some changes in the files... Working good so far (25 turns in). Current state: Sylvania pwning Empire, Kislev pwning Nordland

What I changed:

campaign_script
- Removed Empire Heresy (because it forced wars / alliances ), basically the origin of the problem
- Chaos Dwarf Union (because it forces alliance with chaos and is weird in general)
- removed every instance of checking for heresy, to prevent crashes (none so far)

descr_strat
- buffed orks (mostly money, some more units)
- removed basically all starting alliances
- reduced faction standings changes between humans (was: 9.9, is: 2, 3)

descr_cursor_actions
- changed diplomat's actions, so that he can talk with everyone

export_descr_buildings
- added diplomat to every walls' capabilities (can be trained everywhere, couldn't be trained nowhere, prior to this)

Planned:
- Fixing Sylvania (did not do a negative faction_relations, and they are willing to go for peace)
- Changing beginning war states to:
Druchii-Asur war
Chaos vs Empire, Princes, Kislev, Asur, Orks, Dwarves
Sylvania-Empire war
Orks-Dwarves war
- Changing relations to:
Theogonist-Reikland,Averland high, Nordland, midden neutral, everything else low too much work and mostly pointless
Sylvania-everyone low
Orks-everyone low
Kislev-Ostermark, Ostland high
Within Empire - neutral to low
Border Princes - Empire low
Chaos-everyone extremely low
- Buffing factions:
Orks (by adding money and more starting armies)
Border Princes (by adding money)
-end-

I have given myself a deadline of two weeks, 14 December being "release", if i can call it that, date, after I bughunted enough for me to be sure it does not have any script bugs.


Any feedback about further changes would be appreciated

[Kahvipannu]

I like the option to have more sandbox-experience, but is it necessary to remove Heresy? It is basically excommunication of a faction, right? Just removing the (I pressume there is?) scripted war declarations with the Excommunication would be enough I think.

[Ziame]

I like the option to have more sandbox-experience, but is it necessary to remove Heresy? It is basically excommunication of a faction, right? Just removing the (I pressume there is?) scripted war declarations with the Excommunication would be enough I think.

It's not the same, because excommunication is simply pope saying FU, and the heresy thing changes your banner and forces you into war. I would gladly do as you said, BUT there's a of code to change by hand(every empire faction has it's own script), and in the first "release", it will be simply removed. There is no excomunication in CoW, because everyone has perfect relations with Pope/Theogonist and there are no Sigmarite wars.

Besides, if i am to be honest, this heresy is rather annoying. Your leader dies -> you get heresy -> your leader dies -> you are not heretical anymore... lol. It's dependent on faction leader's piety, btw.
Still, it won't be included in the _first_ version. I may try to rework it in the future, no promises though.

Recent development:

Reworked faction standings
Sylvania vs good guys - bad relations (lore - vampires want to turn the living into undead)
Chaos, Chaos Dwarfs vs good guys - insanely bad relations (obviously)
Druchii vs Asur - irrepairable bad relations (lore - war)
Dwarves vs Asur - bad relations (lore - Dwarves hate Elves)
In-imperial relations reworked into something functional in sandbox campaign - animosities and friendships (eg. Ostermark dislikes Ostland - rivalry, Ostermark likes Tabalecland - common enemy)
Kislev has good relations with Dwarves, Nordland, Ostland and Ostermark (they need allies for the Chaos Storm)
Border Princes have neutral relations with Empire (iirc lore-wise they aren't really imperial friends, and will make for nice opponent of the Empire)
Orks have good relations with Night Goblins (because greenskins)
Orks and Night Goblins have irrepairable relations with everyone (because they want to fightfightfightfightfight)

Reworked faction diplomatic stances (at start)
Orks and Night Goblins at war with Dwarves (because it makes sense)
Chaos at war with everyone but Chaos Dwarves and Druchii (because chaos)
Asur at war with Druchii (because lore)
Sylvania at war with Ostland, Ostermark and Tabalecland (because Sylvanians want to play for more than ten turns -- gaaang baaang)
Beastmen at war with everyone but Chaos

"Reworked" diplomats
Diplomats can be recruited from "walls" (I know it doesn't make much sense, but hey, it's only for the time being... I hope)
Diplomats can talk with enemy/neutral (as opposed to not, in vanilla CoW)
Gigantic Ork Buff
Yes, you read that right. I've always felt that Orks are somewhat inferior to their lore counterparts. In my campaings as Ostermark I never even seen any Orks, save for scripted ones.
Orks got 8 full stacks of soldiers + many moneys, to simulate the ease with which they can push new soldiers out to the front. (maybe we'll finally see the green wave!)

Spoiler for Questions!: 

I am not doing it for myself I am mostly doing this for myself, but there are questions for you, potential customers

1. Would you want permament stone forts on the map (fixed from start), for the Empire? For some reason, the forts can't be placed by descr_strat (only one worked for me)
2. Do you want buildable forts (wooden) for your generals? [Wooden, because buildable stone forts are nonsensical.]
3. Do you want a generic mercenary roster (thunderers, swordmen) directly on the battle map?
4. Should I disable the greenskin union script (scripted Night Goblin - Orks alliance)?
5. What other changes would you want to see in this -sub-mod? Mind you, I am not a veteran in medieval2 modding, so don't throw new scripts or something at me.

[Ziame]

I like the option to have more sandbox-experience, but is it necessary to remove Heresy? It is basically excommunication of a faction, right? Just removing the (I pressume there is?) scripted war declarations with the Excommunication would be enough I think.

To continue my answer to you, Empire Heresy is a CoW script, initialised by new faction leader with low piety, that changes banner and religion of an imperial faction, and forces them to war with all non-chaos guys (Empire, Asur, Kislev)
Excommunication is not present in CoW-vanilla, because faction standings between empire are set to 9.9 (with 1.0 being the max in descr_strat, just for reference), and script ensure periodically that the standing is high. Furthermore, pope won't excommunicate an ally.

Excommunication will (probably, still testing) be present in my submod, just as it existed in Medieval2 vanilla. I hope I am understandable.

[Kahvipannu]

Ah yes, your right, it indeed does change the faction and such. It is just I like a lot of the Heresy feature, but as you reasoned it is needed cut out for more sandboxxy campaign. But indeed would be cool if Pope-mechanics would be re-intoduced then, and they kinda make sense.

Rest sounds good to me, only thing I'm not sure is Orcs buff, they can be very OP with AI. They were nerfed back in days, and the whole main reason Border-Princes got implemented to the game, was to slow down Orcs steam-rolling Empire.

[Ziame]

Ah yes, your right, it indeed does change the faction and such. It is just I like a lot of the Heresy feature, but as you reasoned it is needed cut out for more sandboxxy campaign. But indeed would be cool if Pope-mechanics would be re-intoduced then, and they kinda make sense.

Rest sounds good to me, only thing I'm not sure is Orcs buff, they can be very OP with AI. They were nerfed back in days, and the whole main reason Border-Princes got implemented to the game, was to slow down Orcs steam-rolling Empire.

ATM Orks get pwnd ~20 turns into the game.

I am now making adjustments to faction_standings, and will probably create new ai_label for chaos.

Also, I think this deserves a dedicated thread in sub-mod section http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...5#post13445935