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Thread: Shogun II Total Realism [Beta 15.10.02 released]

  1. #41

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Use of terrain should be far more important than range. A Chassepot rifle should be able to shoot across most of the map in the hands of a competent sniper - if he can see his target.

    Another request: howitzers. These were common by the game's time.
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  2. #42
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandr Vasilyevich Suvorov View Post
    Another request: howitzers. These were common by the game's time.
    Like These?

  3. #43

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    That looks like a howitzer, but why is it firing at such a low angle? Howitzers usually fired at much higher angles, though not as high as mortars.
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  4. #44
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    I've tried adding howitzers and mortars to the game, but the result was horrible.
    - There is a working mortar model in the files. However, it only works as fixed artillery. Neither is there a version with wheel nor a carrying animation.
    - The howitzer model does have two wheels and works well with horses, but the howitzer gun model itself is rotated by 90°. So the projectiles fly to the north while the cannon model aims at east. Strange.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  5. #45
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandr Vasilyevich Suvorov View Post
    That looks like a howitzer, but why is it firing at such a low angle? Howitzers usually fired at much higher angles, though not as high as mortars.
    The game engine model just don't handle elevation. Gameplaywise, It fires in an angle.


    Notice the two shells on the Upper Left portion of the screenshot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Destin Faroda View Post
    I've tried adding howitzers and mortars to the game, but the result was horrible.
    - There is a working mortar model in the files. However, it only works as fixed artillery. Neither is there a version with wheel nor a carrying animation.
    - The howitzer model does have two wheels and works well with horses, but the howitzer gun model itself is rotated by 90°. So the projectiles fly to the north while the cannon model aims at east. Strange.
    You just used the wrong skeleton for the model.

    Yes, There are entire NTW engine models in the data pack, and all works.








    I already have a working Artillery Pack. Its there under my sig.
    Last edited by weirdoascensor; December 15, 2013 at 11:59 PM.

  6. #46

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    No projectile trails, please. 19th-century howitzers did not fire tracers. Good job with implementing them, though. Howitzers were extremely useful for siege assaults.

    Have you found a way to remove the magical gate burning grenade thingies yet?
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  7. #47
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Quote Originally Posted by weirdoascensor View Post
    I already have a working Artillery Pack. Its there under my sig.
    Would you allow me to use parts of it for my realism mod?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandr Vasilyevich Suvorov
    No projectile trails, please.
    You definitely won't see them in my mod.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleksandr Vasilyevich Suvorov
    Have you found a way to remove the magical gate burning grenade thingies yet?
    No and I doubt it's possible.
    - In units_stats_land, I can't find anything connected to burning down gates.
    - In projectiles table, the torch projectile already has 0 damage. Therefore, lowering it doesn't work. Alternatively, maybe it's possible to increase the durability of gates and towers.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  8. #48

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Players could make a "gentleman's agreement" not to use magical gate burning grenade thingies, but the AI will presumably still use them...

    Most sieges did not end in assaults. Storming castles should be very difficult.
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  9. #49
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    AI would just climb the walls, apparently...

    If you want to use part of my mod, I will give you my approval...but remember that the models for M1841 Howitzer, M1857 Napoleon, and 3 Inch Ordnance are made by Primergy for ETW American Civil War mod, with Permission given by shokh of the ACW Team.

    And oh, do you also interested in some other things? Like Scabbards, Stakes, Crouching Light Infantry, Diamond Formation, Square Formation, (Problematic) Earthworks, some Building and Uniform Concepts?

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 



















    Last edited by weirdoascensor; December 18, 2013 at 02:04 AM.

  10. #50

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Bloody hell mate, this looks awesome. Please say yes, Destin

  11. #51
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Thanks for your offer, weirdoacensor.

    The other features you've mentioned have already been taken care of:
    - Light infantry fights like in Empire and can move without being seen. Shooting reveals them which allows the stupid BAI to react.
    - The only other formation I have added is square formation. The rest will be ignored like in JaM's realism mods.
    - My new Pioneer units can construct defensive structures (well, only stakes work in custom battle mode).
    - Uniforms will be as historical as possible. I managed to acquire the book "Japanese Military Uniforms" by Ritta Nakanishi which is very useful and was definitely used by CA.
    - I actually plan to reduce the number of building chains to counter the ridiculous 6 slot limit.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  12. #52

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Can scaling walls be made much more difficult? All the defenders have to do is unhook the grappling irons, or cut the ropes. This is likely impossible, but if units scaling walls receive a massive combat penalty that should improve sieges quite a lot.
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  13. #53
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    The better maps mod should make sieges more interesting as it creates real Japanese castles. Several courtyards with defenders have to be passed before you can rech the keep. Now sieges are going to be a bloody mess.
    Besides, units climbing walls lose more stamina and can even fall down and die. Unfortunately, this doesn't stop the BAI from doing it nonetheless.

    Otherwise, the mod is coming along fine. The mortars are functioning as well as the new Tokugawa infantry (armed with minie rifles). The bakufu vassals now only have access to inferior infantry with tanegashimas. However, some of them are able to train a limited amount of modern troops like Sendai's Gakuheitai and the Tokugawa's Denshutai.
    Still, there is so much more to do: uniforms, colours, tech tree, building chains and effects etc.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  14. #54

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Tanegashima infantry are so outclassed by rifle infantry that any battles between the 2 will be hopelessly unfair. Factions must have access to better units at some time if they are not to be swept away (though the AI will not use rifle infantry to their full effect).
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  15. #55
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    According to my sources, the Tokugawa vassals were absolutely outdated and favored Bavarian Gewehr rifles. These rifles had the same performance as tanegashimas (2 shots per minute, ~80m effective killing range). However, there is no gewehr rifle model in the game files, so I have given them tanegashimas. Still, you raised a good point. I forgot to give them a better standard line infantry for the later period. Maybe some minie rifle infantry? It's the standard weapon for line infantry in my mod.

    The Tokugawa clan will be the most modern bakufu faction and it is the only one that can initially compete with the sonno joi troops. Besides instructors, Napoleon III has sent the Tokugawa clan 2000 chassepots, modern artillery, Arabian horses and instructors.
    Sendai has Gakuheitai with snider enfield rifles and the sneaky kogekitai.
    Nagaoka has access to gatling guns.
    Aizu has many unique units. Some are modern, some are outdated.
    Jozai has Yugekitai.
    Obama clan is now a minor clan and its place is taken over by the Tokugawa clan. The leader is Tokugawa Iemochi and they can train better troops than their vassals. With access to the Denshutai, they can compete with the Imperials.

    The AI will now make better use of firearms. All those unfair abilities like rank fire and kneel fire will be deactivated as the BAI can't use them. Now every soldier shoots at the enemy thus making fights fair. This design decision was copied from JaM's Empire Realism mod where it works well. Sometimes I really wonder what kind of people CA hires for AI programming.
    My Mod:
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    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  16. #56
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Gewehr Rifles - Use minie model.Similar enough, Like anybody can see the barrel is rifled or not...and oh, The Gewehr are mainly Percussion Lock, compared to Tanegashima Snap Matchlock, sure increases reloading speed...
    I'm sure, The Shogunate Vanguards will always have The Shogunate's advanced technological backing, no? And as if the Imperials are not composed of Samurai, whose some of them that not getting any importance in the new regimes, would rebels.

    Since you have seen Nakanishi Ritta's Illustration, give Tokugawa's own Levy and Line Infantry distingushed uniforms, yeah;
    Like Hoods, Kepi, Bowl Jingasa, Darkblue-White for Enlisted and Blue-Red for Officers.
    Uniforms of The Same unit, but differing clans, should be different.
    Satsuma Line Inf wear Duncecap Jingasa and Their Officers wear Black Wigs, for instance. Aizu Units should not wear Duncecap Jingasa at all. Some Clan Infantry wear Lampshade Jingasa like their Ashigaru predecessors, some wear bowl-shaped jingasa.
    White Tigers should be teenagers. Black Tortoise should be Old.
    Shinsengumi should wear Sky Blue-White.
    Some Levy Infantry should wear Hoods.
    Some Officers could combine their modern uniform with traditional Haori Jacket.
    Wooden Ship sailor wear Traditional Clothing, Ironplated Ship Crews wear Sailor Fuku.

    Climbing chance of falling over, and Climbing fatigue can be modified...

    Cutting the number of Building Chains, does not necessarily mean not elaborating the Chain Tree...
    Last edited by weirdoascensor; December 22, 2013 at 08:42 AM.

  17. #57
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Thanks for your suggestions, weirdoascensor. I will try to implement them.

    Some changes have already been taken care of:
    - Shinsengumi wear sky blue clothes. I copied the colour from the picture in the Wikipedia article.
    - Red bears wear black uniforms with shoes and that officer cap. Wigs for bear infantry is reserved for officers and standard bearerd.
    - White bears wear blue uniforms with straw sandals and paper jingasa.
    - Black bears wear blue traditional clothes with straw sandals and the tall conical jingasa.
    - Besides, the bears now act as standard line infantry for Tosa, Chosu and Satsuma. They can't hire Imperial Line Infantry which is reserved for all other Imperial factions. Chosu will have the best line infantry.
    - I tried to give the Byakkotai younger faces, but the game doesn't offer much variety when it comes to young-looking faces. The same is true for the Joushitai. There is only one proper female face. The other ones look like geishas with strange headwear.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  18. #58

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Very often the only formations used in the chaos of battle were square, line and column (though the last of these is not really modelled in-game). The AI can use square and line. Hopefully players can use the tactic of using cavalry to force the enemy into square, then pounding the square with artillery. Yet another way to rout the helpless AI...
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    Either care about history or improve modding support.

  19. #59
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    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    I have added square formation to all modern line infantry units, but its use is limited. Cavalry is limited and fragile against bayonets and modern arms. Attacking the flanks and rear can still be useful, but if the enemy's morale doesn't break, casualties will be quite high - especially when the enemies have polearms or bayonets.

    By the way, the m1841 howitzer is now part of the arsenal.
    I've also added the first castles from better maps mod.
    My Mod:
    Shogun II Total Realism
    A realism mod for Shogun II, Rise of the Samurai and Fall of the Samurai

  20. #60

    Default Re: Shogun II Total Realism

    Cavalry was still very useful for scouting and running down routing foes.
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