Playing as Massalia or Sparta or Syracuse...or anyone next to Rome

[Adam the VIth]

Gang: longtime player, though usually as Rome or Cimbri (hey, I'm a hairy German tribesman, what can I say?).

I like the challenge of playing as one of the great Greek cities, but what can I do about the Romans? I understand they are the powerhouse in the game, but I ally with them, pay them tribute, declare war on their enemies.....and they still attack me.....

Is there any hope of playing as a friend/client state of Rome?

Thanks for any advice.

I play M/H by the way.

[Love Mountain]

Nope. No hope at all. The Ai is stupid.

[dvk901]

The only thing you can do is keep using forced diplomacy to make them stop attacking you.

[meerkatology]

its easy, the AI is very predictable.

just unshare borders with them.

1. take a border city, then remove your garrison so that they revolt

2. once they rebel you no longer share border with that superpower, the rebels may attack you but with only 1-2 settlements they are very easy to deal with.

3. if the superpower conquers the rebels, conquer it back and let it rebel again

4. alternatively you can also give the city for free to another weak faction instead of letting it rebel.

[Adam the VIth]

Thanks for the comments everyone.

meerk: As Sparta, I don't share borders with Rome, but usually within about 6-10 turns they are invading me.

Suki: indeed -- AI plays dumb.......

So i guess my only option is to try and kill Rome? Yeah, this should be entertaining.....

[TTRouble]

Ok.. can only comment on playing as Massila while beta testing ages back but I had some crazy battles against Rome and the Averni. Its a war of attrition against Rome/Averni so you need to be careful with unit selection and where you decide to meet and take them on. Rome will attack and its just a matter of when and theres nothing your diplomats can do to prevent it.

1. Take the nearest settlement to the left of Massila if the Averni or Rome do not beat you to it and if possible the one or two settlements to the north.
2. Make peace with the Averni if its possible and let them duke it out with the other factions.
3. Recruit a new General and aim to have 4-5 full stacks asap with a good mix of troops - heavy cavlary, heavy infantry, slngers and archers. The aim is to place 2 full stacks facing east to protect blocking both paths to Massilla. Your 3rd full stack is going to stop the attack that Rome is going to launch from the West. Its a river crossing and heavily wooded to the left of the embankment. Its likely that you'll need to defeat 2-3 full stacks with that single army and its a pretty full experience but its doable. I usually hide skirmiser cav, slingers and archers there and wait for the Romans to cross and take on the heavy infantry. My Heavy cav (3 units) would be out of the way to the right to smash into the Romans once their engaged.
4. Your other stacks go north to conquer the free people etc and hold those territories.
5. Grow that economy with Massiala your power house but don't over extend as Rome will keep on pouring armies to try and take Massilla from the east. Its a war of attrition and you'll need to constantly retain your units. I think from memory those three armies would be 2 silver chevorn experienced in no time and at some point you'll be strong enough to push into Northern Italy. You may need to pair up the stacks to put a stop to the AI from smashing its way through.
6. Launch a naval invasion and capture Sardina, it should be lightly defended but be warned they rebel constantly even after you rebuild with Greek culture.
7. You'll need to use your other 2 full stacks to fight the Averni - expect those to be hard as well.
8. When you invade Northern Italy do so on mass .. from the North and a naval invasion from Sardina simulatneously. I made the mistake once of taking just 4 3-4 full stacks form the North and found myself being pushed back from one settlement after another and taking a serious beating.

I should kick start another Massilla campaign and see if its any different!

TTrouble...

PS... I was testing on H/H

[_Tartaros_]

i played massilia in 2.5 on h/h for some time. i conquered all surrounding rebels and emporium early on, build a bigger port (for more heavy ships) and a heavy armorer tu upgrade my fighting stacks and focused on islands, blocking roman ports and alpin passes with forts. it was manageable and averni, belgae and boii are no real problem (punished there capitals).

[Love Mountain]

Just an imo. It is in my opinion that killing Rome as any of the factions close to them is ridiculously easy early on. Whether it be Macedon, Syracuse or Massalia, or a hard counter like Carthage.

[Adam the VIth]

Good advice. Thanks guys.

Uh, one problem....I cannot get Massalia to start on 0-turn. I can get Syracuse and the other "swaps" to start that way.

Any trick I need to try? I click 0-turn on the launcher and then swap faction.....Rome has stacks everywhere....so I feel like I'm the only one playing on 1-1turn! Talk about a challenge!

BTW: I tried building forts at the strategic points and it was working.....but that's when I noticed the huge Roman army and realized something was amiss.

I also took Syracuse in that game....basically trying to make that another pillar....but it feels like I simply trapped an army there.

Anyway.....hopefully I can get 0-turn to work and try the strategies you all are providing.

I like those Celtic Axemen....tough hombres.

[Love Mountain]

Good advice. Thanks guys.

Uh, one problem....I cannot get Massalia to start on 0-turn. I can get Syracuse and the other "swaps" to start that way.

Any trick I need to try? I click 0-turn on the launcher and then swap faction.....Rome has stacks everywhere....so I feel like I'm the only one playing on 1-1turn! Talk about a challenge!

BTW: I tried building forts at the strategic points and it was working.....but that's when I noticed the huge Roman army and realized something was amiss.

I also took Syracuse in that game....basically trying to make that another pillar....but it feels like I simply trapped an army there.

Anyway.....hopefully I can get 0-turn to work and try the strategies you all are providing.

I like those Celtic Axemen....tough hombres.

Rome is a challenge only because of the number of armies it has. It's a very slow grind to take over all of Italy especially as you get closer to Rome. However, if you have access to any type of heavy xyston-armed cavalry then it's a total joke. Roman armies use a lot of heavy infrantry and missile units. Simply spamming archers, something to hold the line, and heavy cavalry is an easy way to demolish any and all Roman armies with minimal casualties. Unless something goes horribly wrong, I only suffer maybe 250 casualties in a big battle with full stacks. I play exclusively on H/H as well.

I also suggest not to take over any islands. In my experience, it's really annoying to have either Carthage or Rome send half a stack or a full stack every other turn. Just go through Italy and kill all Romans. It's not particularly hard. Ask away any questions you have. The people of this Forum are more than happy to share advice and provide saved games and/or screenshots.

[Sertorio]

Not all swap factions are 0-turn. Massalia is probably one turn only.
Sicily can be a pillar, it's easily defendable, from there you can go Africa, Italy or Greece. I think is worth a stack, but you need to take the whole island.

[_Tartaros_]

it´s best to conquer the island if you own the see. i kill every enemy ship with reinforcements that come near my islands. Massilia is perfect for own concentric reinforcements. just make sure you kill every ship and your island are secure. i also raided alot. sacking rome and burn it to the ground with my siege engine was epic

[Love Mountain]

it´s best to conquer the island if you own the see. i kill every enemy ship with reinforcements that come near my islands. Massilia is perfect for own concentric reinforcements. just make sure you kill every ship and your island are secure. i also raided alot. sacking rome and burn it to the ground with my siege engine was epic

That is true. However I find it tiresome to build a navy and prepare the "expedition" to numerous islands. To be honest, I just find my time better spent invading over land and organizing my logistics that way. Both ways are sound however, nothing is out of the reach of a resourceful player.

[_Tartaros_]

It was more a roleplaygame and i didn´t intend to build up an empire. my intension was to conquer the british islands and crete+rhodos, but then 2.6 showed up

[LoGaL]

yeah anyways, this is not a RS2 fault but a RTW's fault: the AI is stupid, and when you share a border with her ( or in some cases , also a sea area, but i don't understand how it works) ,you will get attacked in 5-10 turns no matter what

[Searry]

It's too bad the AI can't be helped. In my latest Rome campaign I managed to get an alliance with the Gallaeci because I thought I want them to be a better enemy in the future because barbarians are a cakewalk early on, but nope, they attacked me after I took all hispanian provinces from Carthage. Now I've nearly conquered them(they have a single city left) with minimal casualties but I don't want to keep northern and the middle Hispania yet. It would be nice if therew was a way to give complete autonomy to cities, like they'd be a part of rome but you wouldn't get any money from them and you'd just let them be there. I'm sure the protectorate thing doesn't work either as they'll still stab you in the back. I'd be ready to give them back their lands.