Ars Gratia Artis - Complete Battle Overhaul, v2.7.2 - Patch 7 ready (updated 15/11/13)

[Durador]

All my mod changes in land_units and main_units are recruit time, cost, movement and upkeep. In theory I could make a version of my mod that works with this mod, if I have your permission to do so. If you give permission, I can use your values or just delete those tables depending on which works better.

The startpos changes are the main part of Hegemonia, that is where the region ownership changes occur. The other db tables are mostly just changing things to work better with 2tpy or 4tpy.

That would be cool Dresden!

[angus young]

OMG !!!! PLZ Give the permission

It would be great !!!!

[angus young]

Yeah !!! You have a great modders spirit !!

[Cochus1]

Btw, whats the meaning of armies cap in the mod?? (for example 150 oathsworns limit) I have not tried the mod on a campaing yet.

And Selea did understand the question this time??. Again, i am sorry for my bad english :S

I mean that with the last patch u could not run or charge against an enemie and after activate the hoplite phalanx, u had to be out of fight and it take about 1 sec for be active (i suppose that its for avoid the use of the phalanx in the last moment and force the player to playt it as really should be)

[Selea]

Btw, whats the meaning of armies cap in the mod?? (for example 150 oathsworns limit) I have not tried the mod on a campaing yet.

And Selea did understand the question this time??. Again, i am sorry for my bad english :S

Ah, you mean that. I removed it before because the formation broke sometimes in the middle of the fight for no apparent reason and the only way to reform it was to disable and enable it again. With the way it was you couldn't do it.

However this seems to be resolved in patch 7 (for the most part) so I can re-add the inability of enabling it during combat.

As for the caps, they mean that you have max 150 Oathsworn to use, meaning balanced 10 max for stack (but you can use them as you want: if you want to do 7 stacks full of Oathsworn you can, just remember that the other 8 will be without them).

If you lose an unit in combat you can recruit another one, but up to that maximum.

[Cochus1]

so u can have 150 units of oathsworns?? or having 150 oathsworns divided on units?? And a stack means an army?? i have searched it on the google translator but noone of the definitions has sense with the context

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

Hey guys...
Selea just a quick question...
Have you included camera tweaks or any camera mod with AGA???
Cause when I'm playing custom battle I can zoom further down and when the map is near a coastline I can see the sea underground...
Here is a pic.
I'm using only AGA and GEM for this test...

http://i.imgur.com/TgbIO2J.jpg

Please assist me with this...
Thanks...

[Kymmuriel]

Hey guys...
Selea just a quick question...
Have you included camera tweaks or any camera mod with AGA???
Cause when I'm playing custom battle I can zoom further down and when the map is near a coastline I can see the sea underground...
Here is a pic.
I'm using only AGA and GEM for this test...

http://i.imgur.com/TgbIO2J.jpg

Please assist me with this...
Thanks...

Yes there is a camera tweak into the addon-texture, so u can zoom as much as you want

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

Yes there is a camera tweak into the addon-texture, so u can zoom as much as you want

Ok Thanks...
So how I can disable it...???
Cause it's bugged as it seems...

Cheers...

[Krasnaïa Zvezda]

Hello Selea and all the Ars Gratia Artis team,

I've been playing RTWII modded with Magnar mod since the release of the mod but I have also been trying other "big" (as in complete overhauls) mods to compare them.

I tried AGA in some custom battles with the Romans and I have to say that I am really impressed with the changes that you have made (for the infantry, haven't tried yet cavalry).

The game feels and plays very differently compared to the other overhauls, the fact that you kept some special abilities and gave them a meaning is key to that.

I love the "Throw Pila" AoE and the new Scutum Wall ability, Romans now do feel like masters of formations and defence.

However, I was surprised (and also a bit disappointed) to see that the unit sizes were mostly vanilla (except for the cavalry) for the infantry in custom battles, haven't tried in campaign.

I read the OP and saw that you talk about tweaking the unit sizes but I was wondering if you were planning to increase them a bit (200 ? 250 ? 320 ? , more ?).

I haven't read through all the pages as there are 70 of them so I'm asking you if it's a planned feature or not.

I would love to play your mod but 160 men per infantry unit is just too low for me now that I have played battles with 2x unit sizes (320 infantry per unit) with Magnar mod.

I am aware of the naval bug that is still present but Magnar "solved" this by keeping the naval units at the vanilla size and by nerfing the naval transports so that naval unitshave the upper hand, even when outnumbered.

[Durador]

Hello Selea and all the Ars Gratia Artis team,

I've been playing RTWII modded with Magnar mod since the release of the mod but I have also been trying other "big" (as in complete overhauls) mods to compare them.

I tried AGA in some custom battles with the Romans and I have to say that I am really impressed with the changes that you have made (for the infantry, haven't tried yet cavalry).

The game feels and plays very differently compared to the other overhauls, the fact that you kept some special abilities and gave them a meaning is key to that.

I love the "Throw Pila" AoE and the new Scutum Wall ability, Romans now do feel like masters of formations and defence.

However, I was surprised (and also a bit disappointed) to see that the unit sizes were mostly vanilla (except for the cavalry) for the infantry in custom battles, haven't tried in campaign.

I read the OP and saw that you talk about tweaking the unit sizes but I was wondering if you were planning to increase them a bit (200 ? 250 ? 320 ? , more ?).

I haven't read through all the pages as there are 70 of them so I'm asking you if it's a planned feature or not.

I would love to play your mod but 160 men per infantry unit is just too low for me now that I have played battles with 2x unit sizes (320 infantry per unit) with Magnar mod.

I am aware of the naval bug that is still present but Magnar "solved" this by keeping the naval units at the vanilla size and by nerfing the naval transports so that naval unitshave the upper hand, even when outnumbered.

Btw, a little teaser on what to expect on the new version:

• Reworked individual units sizes to their realistic counterparts for factions.
• Removing of the active abilities so that positioning and formations become the fundamental aspect. This is possible for the sizes that balance factions without needing of active abilities.
• Reworking of many of the formations as Hoplite Phalanx, Phalanx, Shield Wall and Fulcum (after some bit of research, this is how it was called the Shield Wall by Romans) to work much more similar to how their historical counterparts really worked. As an example Shield Wall will be a defensive formation to save fatigue to exhaust enemy units and then counterattack.
• Full reworking of Cavalry to be much more historical accurate. No more powerful melee cavalry; all cavalry will be in different measures good at charging (depending on the length of the weapon) but not able to sustain melee for long. Also skirmisher cavalry will have a place that goes beyond the mere skirmishing and entails also scouting and chasing routers.
• Reworking of some units' speeds to be more historical accurate. For example Phalangitai were not the very slow unit the majority of people think they are.

And then, naturally:

The excellent new version of the texture add-on that is very beautiful. Btw now the texture add-on is no more a compliaton as it was at the beginning and instead is something unique to AGA and for this there's no more reason to put it as separate, also because in the step after this one (the one that adds new units) the textures would be needed anyway.

[Selea]

However, I was surprised (and also a bit disappointed) to see that the unit sizes were mostly vanilla (except for the cavalry) for the infantry in custom battles, haven't tried in campaign.

I read the OP and saw that you talk about tweaking the unit sizes but I was wondering if you were planning to increase them a bit (200 ? 250 ? 320 ? , more ?).

I will give the units realistic sizes in scale but I don't like a total *X augmentation, it doesn't make sense to me.

Many units will still stay @ 160 even with the update because many people will not be able to enjoy the mod elsewhere (I kept low appositely).

Sorry but I really doubt people that insist they can play the vanilla game fine with x2 or even x1.5 unit sizes, even with state of the art hardware. The engine has a well known CPU bottleneck than neither with the late Haswell can be overcome.

With x2 unit sizes you will have at most 10 fps for the majority of users if you zoom in during a battle and this is not acceptable.

As for the naval bugs, all mods have it, also Magnar's one. It has not to do with the sizes but with the radius.

[Krasnaïa Zvezda]

I will give the units realistic sizes in scale but I don't like a total *X augmentation, it doesn't make sense to me.

Many units will still stay @ 160 even with the update because many people will not be able to enjoy the mod elsewhere (I kept low appositely).

Sorry but I really doubt people that insist they can play the vanilla game fine with x2 or even x1.5 unit sizes, even with state of the art hardware. The engine has a well known CPU bottleneck than neither with the late Haswell can be overcome.

With x2 unit sizes you will have at most 10 fps for the majority of users if you zoom in during a battle and this is not acceptable.

As for the naval bugs, all mods have it, also Magnar's one. It has not to do with the sizes but with the radius.

Well, believe me or not but I can play 4000 vs 7-8000 in open field battles with no big fps drop (or at least one that I don't notice).

The only big fps drop that I have ever had where during bugged combined land and sea battles and battles with 2-3000 vs 8000 with fog and rain (AI was attacking).

Having the choice is always a good thing so increasing the unit sizes won't harm other people as they can decrease the size with the IG slider.

I'll see what you come up with and will still try it out as it's your mod, your rules.

[gutmasher]

I will give the units realistic sizes in scale but I don't like a total *X augmentation, it doesn't make sense to me.

Many units will still stay @ 160 even with the update because many people will not be able to enjoy the mod elsewhere (I kept low appositely).

Sorry but I really doubt people that insist they can play the vanilla game fine with x2 or even x1.5 unit sizes, even with state of the art hardware. The engine has a well known CPU bottleneck than neither with the late Haswell can be overcome.

With x2 unit sizes you will have at most 10 fps for the majority of users if you zoom in during a battle and this is not acceptable.

As for the naval bugs, all mods have it, also Magnar's one. It has not to do with the sizes but with the radius.

First time post after lurking for 10 (?) years, but had to put my 2 cents in so here goes:

I have been using magnar mod x2 unit size with no problem and my machine is fairly modest (all options arent "extreme"). Also keeping naval units at vanilla size has worked fine and has not created any naval bugs as far as I can tell ie no floating guys in the water! However, modding TW games is not my modding specialty so could be missing something.

Point being that the audience for this and other fine mods would open up quite a bit if x2 unit size is available. Other players will not be alienated as you can scale the unit size via the graphics options to taste. Appreciate all the fine mods / modders here but I can tell you that after you get used to larger unit sizes, it feels strange to go back to vanilla sizes. Keep up the good works folks, it's the only thing saving RTW2 right now imo!

[Cidalsleepwalker]

Hey Selea,

Once again loving your mod, however I just fought a battle against Carthage and a 45-man Libyan Hoplite (with 2 mob units) unit routed 1 of my 120-man Hastati and nearly wiped out my other three (one had only 26 men left); keep in mind these units all had at least one silver chevron too. They routed when there were 15 or so of their men left. Is this working as intended?

[Selea]

Hey Selea,

Once again loving your mod, however I just fought a battle against Carthage and a 45-man Libyan Hoplite (with 2 mob units) unit routed 1 of my 120-man Hastati and nearly wiped out my other three (one had only 26 men left); keep in mind these units all had at least one silver chevron too. They routed when there were 15 or so of their men left. Is this working as intended?

A) Hoplites are powerful from the front, don't attack them from the front.
B) As for routing with 15 men, I tried it now and they rout very early (with 45 men they should have already routed), so I don't know what's happening to you but it's not usual. Naturally depending on the circumstances they can rout more or less; if they are surrounded by many friendly units while you are alone and they are winning they will rout much later than normally.

[Cidalsleepwalker]

A) Hoplites are powerful from the front, don't attack them from the front.
B) As for routing with 15 men, I tried it now and they rout very early (with 45 men they should have already routed), so I don't know what's happening to you but it's not usual. Naturally depending on the circumstances they can rout more or less; if they are surrounded by many friendly units while you are alone and they are winning they will rout much later than normally.

Yes, I'm wondering now if it was just a fluke. They started with only 45 because it was a garrison unit, but they were in a (phalanx?) formation. Perhaps I just didn't get enough men around their sides.

[Kymmuriel]

It is not bugged, you just dont need to zoom super in lol, u can tweak it if you want, open texture addon with pfm, go to db and youll see a sub foler named battle_cameras_table, then you clik onto battle camera and you change whetever u desire, be it in zoom in and zoom out,
Theres only 3 columns, land, mixed and naval so its fairly easy, then save and taste it ingame to ure desires

[♔Greek Strategos♔]

It is not bugged, you just dont need to zoom super in lol, u can tweak it if you want, open texture addon with pfm, go to db and youll see a sub foler named battle_cameras_table, then you clik onto battle camera and you change whetever u desire, be it in zoom in and zoom out,
Theres only 3 columns, land, mixed and naval so its fairly easy, then save and taste it ingame to ure desires

Thank you...I will try it...What if I delete the battle_cameras_table??? the game will use the vanilla values then right???
I said it's bugged cause it's not very realistic for the sea to coming out of the ground right???
Maybe someone should fix it for the next version for good???

Cheers...

[Selea]

Thank you...I will try it...What if I delete the battle_cameras_table??? the game will use the vanilla values then right???
I said it's bugged cause it's not very realistic for the sea to coming out of the ground right???
Maybe someone should fix it for the next version for good???

Cheers...

I am not a fan myself of the battle camera as it is now.

I already decided to remove it for next version because the default zoom sizes work well and enlarging them causes bugs.