Can CA recover from Rome 2 ?

[Canaris]

Can CA recover from Rome 2 ?

Hopefully not. I actually look forward to CA bankrupcy so some other ambitious developer can step up and fill the void.

[Phier]

Forum to slow to read the thread, but it survived Empire so it can survive this one too. Empire was also a bloody mess on release. I do enjoy it now, but only because of Darth Mod and the compilation of mods in it that made it possible for things like no fort battles, removing broken features and abilities, that sort of thing CA never got around to fixing.

[bigfootedfred2]

I hope so.

I really hope ROME II can be turned around.

[Tyso3]

ETW is more comparable to RTW2 not shogun.

Empire and Rome both share the 'medieval' focus of, massive amounts of units, huge campaign map, large selection of unique cultures

Shogun and to a lesser extent napoleon are more focused locations, less units, less factions and lots of clone nations


So of course shogun will have amazing ai, after they finished their first nation, all they had to do was go CTRL + C and change the colouring. The units in shogun are so generic its like being back in the 90's again. Because of this big skip of time they could spend a lot more time fine tuning all the other snazzy new gadgets.

Empire offered the largest total war map to date. 3 Continents + 4 Sea route areas. A huge achievement. The ai wasnt perfect but it was also the FIRST TIME the total war series officially had a go at lines of battles in gunpowder (yes i know medieval/shogun 1, but they were very primitive). Empire brought in so many factors but yes as you said, had a crappy ai at launch.

Rome2, Looks snazzy, has a medium amount of units, has terrible ai, but worst of all, has a broken game mechanic (When you compare the mechanics to that of the standard concensus of total war games, it is broken) However if you feel it is not broken, then you obviously are limited on your knowledge of total war games (and thats fine, not everyone was their at the start)


Rome 2 has problems, it wouldnt have so many forum posts and terrible reviews if this want the case.


In terms of success? Sure it sold a crapload.


But if i sold you all a chocolate brownie, that awesome one you saw in the shop window, with all the chocolaty goodness. You all paid for it, and in reality you got a lemon sorbet cake.

Would that make me Succesful? or a Con Artist?

[Tyso3]

And then every month id promise (sometimes id be late) to come outside, squirt a bit of a chocolate sauce on your lemon sorbet cake,

[Menumorut]

damn, they have not recovered yet?
too much money to carry at bank huh
already I feel sorry for them and I think we should create a relief fund to help them to recover from this hard job
So who wants to donate MORE money to CA?

[Scarrus]

Yeah, anyone have spare money they don't need?

[PointOfViewGun]

Shogun 2 was a disappointment on some fields. I expected more from sieges.

[Khassaki]

I have been curious as to sales and how credible the 2 million copies on pre-order was.



This is the last week.

http://www.steamgraph.net/index.php?...0q34330q214950

This is all time stats. Its interesting to compare it to the 7 million copies of Skyrim sold. Basically Rome II has sold about 2 million copies, the people with issues are a minority and it is actually getting fairly solid play. Rome II will go down as another success and people will be whining about Medieval 3 lacking the features of Rome II in a couple years time

http://www.steamgraph.net/index.php?...q214950&from=0

[Tyso3]

Also from (http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly/41525/Global/)

For those who cannont be bothered to scroll through

Week ending 7th Sep (for all game platforms, number of products sold and game ranking in terms of sales)

Rome 2. Ranked number 1 seller, 168,371 copies sold in opening week (which would include all pre-orders)

Week ending 14th Sep

Rome 2. Ranked 16th, 29,631 copies sold (82.4% Drop From Previous Week)

Week ending 21 Sep

Rome2. Ranked 28 (between Mario Kart 7 and New Super Mario Bros 2) 16,056 (45.8% Drop From Previous Week)


No one for this week.


Now here is shogun 2 (source from same site)

Week 1 19th March 2011

188,219 (Sold more copies then rome 2, despite being 2 years ago and not as new in first week)

Week 2

44713 (big drop but still 15000 more then Rome 2) (62.2% Drop Compared to Rome 2's 82.4)

Week 3

30323 (Big drop, still 15000 more then Rome 2) (32.2% Drop compared to Rome 2's 45.8%)

Week 4

21768 (Still more then Rome 2 on week 3)

Week 5

13014 (Less then Rome but we do not have stats for last week yet, plus this was week 5 not 4)



So Sorry to blow up your great speech of well rome 2 is selling, But its rate of sales has dropped Hugely since the first week. Now take into account most of those who bought Rome 2 in the first week were probably previous total war players. Now compare that to the stats i posted a few pages ago of weekly acitvity on steam for Rome 2 .

If this still doesnt convince you, your on bloody coo coo land with fluffy bunnies everywhere and no evidence will ever change your opinion, ever ever. So please stop posting in intelligent discussions.

[stackero]

Jesus was resurrected, why not CA. Except CA may need a lot of divine help to pull it off.

No offence to you Lord. No I didn't mean CA, I was apologizing to Jesus for using his name and CA in the same post.

[PointOfViewGun]

Also from (http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly/41525/Global/)
For those who cannont be bothered to scroll through
Week ending 7th Sep (for all game platforms, number of products sold and game ranking in terms of sales)
Rome 2. Ranked number 1 seller, 168,371 copies sold in opening week (which would include all pre-orders)
Week ending 14th Sep
Rome 2. Ranked 16th, 29,631 copies sold (82.4% Drop From Previous Week)
Week ending 21 Sep
Rome2. Ranked 28 (between Mario Kart 7 and New Super Mario Bros 2) 16,056 (45.8% Drop From Previous Week)
No one for this week.

Now here is shogun 2 (source from same site)
Week 1 19th March 2011
188,219 (Sold more copies then rome 2, despite being 2 years ago and not as new in first week)
Week 2
44713 (big drop but still 15000 more then Rome 2) (62.2% Drop Compared to Rome 2's 82.4)
Week 3
30323 (Big drop, still 15000 more then Rome 2) (32.2% Drop compared to Rome 2's 45.8%)
Week 4
21768 (Still more then Rome 2 on week 3)
Week 5
13014 (Less then Rome but we do not have stats for last week yet, plus this was week 5 not 4)

So Sorry to blow up your great speech of well rome 2 is selling, But its rate of sales has dropped Hugely since the first week. Now take into account most of those who bought Rome 2 in the first week were probably previous total war players. Now compare that to the stats i posted a few pages ago of weekly acitvity on steam for Rome 2 .

If this still doesnt convince you, your on bloody coo coo land with fluffy bunnies everywhere and no evidence will ever change your opinion, ever ever. So please stop posting in intelligent discussions.

How could they possibly now how the sale are? Steam doesn't give much stats on sales and I doubt retail stores tell them their sales too.

[Khassaki]

So Sorry to blow up your great speech of well rome 2 is selling, But its rate of sales has dropped Hugely since the first week. Now take into account most of those who bought Rome 2 in the first week were probably previous total war players. Now compare that to the stats i posted a few pages ago of weekly acitvity on steam for Rome 2 .

If this still doesnt convince you, your on bloody coo coo land with fluffy bunnies everywhere and no evidence will ever change your opinion, ever ever. So please stop posting in intelligent discussions.

So your saying that a company with this many staff can stay in business by making a game that sells 200,00 copies every year or two? Reality may not mean much to you as you sit there in your mum's basement, but sadly whatever is left of the $12 million once Valve and SEGA get their share isn't going to pay the bills. 2 million copies on the other hand might just do that.

[stackero]

So your saying that a company with this many staff can stay in business by making a game that sells 200,00 copies every year or two? Reality may not mean much to you as you sit there in your mum's basement, but sadly whatever is left of the $12 million once Valve and SEGA get their share isn't going to pay the bills. 2 million copies on the other hand might just do that.

I'm flabbergasted and shocked. This many people worked on Rome 2? All the more shame on CA

[wangrin]

Also from (http://www.vgchartz.com/weekly/41525/Global/

VG Chartz statistics should be use cautiously, as this site provide few informations about its sources and method to calculate sales statistics.

VGChartz provides tools for data analysis and charting and regular written analysis of the data referencing major news in the video gaming industry. Sales figures on VGChartz are based on estimates extrapolated from small retail samples.[4] While offering some information about their methodology through their website,[5] VGChartz does not publish any sources on how they get their data. Some sites, including Gamasutra and Wired News, have questioned the reliability of the information presented by the site.[4][6] VGChartz has defended the credibility and reliability of its sales data,[7] often comparing their numbers with the ones published by NPD Group,[8] although some charts have been retroactively adjusted to better match NPD's monthly reports.[4][9]

[4] a b c d Carless, Simon (2008-06-23). "Analysis: What VGChartz Does (And Doesn't) Do For The Game Biz". GameSetWatch. Retrieved 2010-11-18.
[5] "VGChartz Methodology". Vgchartz.com. Retrieved 2010-11-18.
[6] Previous post Next post (2008-06-23). "Why We Don’t Reference VGChartz". Wired.com. Retrieved 2010-11-18.
[7] "Response to Internet Comments about VGChartz". Gamrfeed.vgchartz.com. Retrieved 2010-11-18.
[8] TheSource (2007-10-19). "NPD Data vs. VGC Data for the September 2007 Sales (9/2/07 to 10/6/07)". Retrieved 2007-11-10.
[9] Walton, Brett (2007-11-10). "Where do VG Chartz North American Numbers Come From?". VGChartz Ltd. Retrieved 2010-11-12. "If we believe that a particular data set differs significantly from other sources of data (data released into the public domain by tracking firms, manufacturers, analysts) then we do re-check our data and make adjustments to the methods / scaling factors used"

Wikipedia

At least, despite their weaknesses, VG Chartz statistics could eventually provide an idea about sales and how they evolve.

ETW/NTW/S2TW/FotS/R2TW sales stats :



ETW/NTW/S2TW/FotS/R2TW sales stats : firsts 10 weeks after release



ETW/NTW/S2TW/FotS/R2TW sales stats : yearly sales



*Take care, last year sales cannot be considered as representative as the year is not ended


If I remember, a document leaked from (or by) Sega seems to claim that Empire: Total War was sold up to 810 000 copies during 2008 fiscal year.
If peoples are able to read Japanese, they can look at this document : 200903_tanshin_20090513_final.pdf
For the same year, VG Chartz speak about only 478 571 copies, nearly half of Sega stats.

[Radzeer]

Basically Rome II has sold about 2 million copies, the people with issues are a minority and it is actually getting fairly solid play.

True about the sales, but I wonder how many of that was getting people preorder based on marketing bs and laughable gamer magazine reviews, and more importantly whether that strategy could be repeated with the next title.

[stackero]

True about the sales, but I wonder how many of that was getting people preorder based on marketing bs and laughable gamer magazine reviews, and more importantly whether that strategy could be repeated with the next title.

Precisely. Still people will preorder, but to what extent next time?

[Tyso3]

Cool, now correlate that first graphics with each update on radious's Battle mod, im sure you will see a pattern.

[AlyssaFaden]

Cool, now correlate that first graphics with each update on radious's Battle mod, im sure you will see a pattern.

I'll take that wager.

People posting on forums are a minority among RTW players. People aware of mods and how to use them, even rarer. People using mods that also see Radious as some kind of saint? Even fewer in number.

He may have tweaked some settings to give some people an entertaining game (granted his mod has also caused some bugs), but it is not as prevalent among the player base as you make out.

SOURCE: Common Sense.

[Incontinenta Buttox]

I think the TW franchise is over.

Firstly, they guys who made Rome 1, and medieval 1 & 2, are not the same guys who made Rome 2. Neither is Creative Assembly the same company it was a decade ago.

Secondly there is the fallout from releasing what is a very very bad game in such a terrible state. The player base is in uproar, and I don't think the real fans who have been with TW since the beginning will forgive CA this time around.

There have been comparisons with Empire. However I believe that Empire was a very good game once it was rescued by the modders. But I don't think there is a modder out there who is going to be able to save the twitching corpse that is Rome 2.

Last thing is, Where could the TW franchise go from here anyway? What other historical periods haven't already been done. A 20th century TW would never work because by that time warfare had changed. TW was supposed to be about leading armies and units and formations. If you want 20th century warfare you might as well play company of heroes, or call of duty.

I'll remember the early TW games fondly. I played hotseat campaigns for M2TW on this forum for years. But I'm done with TW. Rome 2 was the last straw.

P.S. It's obvious where the big budget for Rome 2 went. Bribing reviewers on gaming sites to lie through their teeth about haw bad Rome 2 is.