The old tactics of using foot archers against horse archers: Not so effective now?

[DanMLee88]

Many people including myself remember using longbows or other foot archers to decimate those pesky horse archers (HA). Foot archers have more numbers, longer range, and are smaller targets, and they absolutely decimate bigger and less numerous HA, especially the yeoman and retinue longbowmen.


Well, warscape engine and health system changed all that. Now both HA and foot archers seem useless if the enemy so much as sets a good portion of themselves away from the 'arc'. When that happens the whole unit needs to reform before firing, at which point the target has already moved out of the arc again. Also, the health system severely negates the impact of missile fire from longer ranges. Archers can't afford to put themselves out without stakes, and putting them behind infantry will just make it easier for the enemy to fly out of range after showering your infantry with arrows before you get ready and fire back.

What is to be done about this? Anyone have a good counter HA tactics they want to share? Also, is it that impossible to fix the warscape pattern of being so dependent on the 'arc' as to reform THEN shoot as opposed to the old style where your men simply turn themselves around (as is realistic) and fire?

Archers as they are now seem somewhat useless since they close in so fast, your range is not that great, and you are helpless if they step out of the arc and you have to adjust taking precious time - at which point they are already face to face anyway. Or horse-to-face in case of HA.

Any thoughts? Can CA or modders change and fix this? It's really pathetic seeing archers trying to act like musket infantry.

[krisslanza]

I'm pretty sure for the time period archers relied on volleys to actually do anything, so it makes sense for them to form, and then all shoot. The best way to counter horse archers is to probably use light cavalry or something - I cannot offer any real advice on a counter to them, as I have not fought any yet.

[DanMLee88]

The old system where if you clicked on an enemy within range and your men would correctly turn themselves without adjusting the WHOLE formation makes much more sense, and some would do the 'arc firing' as they shoot high up in the air if they are too far behind. They still fire off a volley either way. If we wanted to, we could just adjust the formation ourselves to lessen the 'arc firing' behavior.

Whereas now, we are forced to waste precious time for the archers to get into formation again and again. This is not musket infantry era. Warscape needs to address this. The arc should be 360 degrees, and benefits of being able to shoot straight should be the player's choice, not that of the forced reform act we are doing now.

[Winterspawn]

PrinceofMacedon did a video about this, against a full stack of heavy Parthian horse archers. He just let them run out of arrows against his hoplites and pikemen in a long, this formation, with his arches in the same formation behind them and then some light cav to the flanks. He won easily, the regular archers did a huge amount of kills. You should try to find that video.