Battles becoming too easy mid-late game

[The_Dude]

now i dunno if its just me but anyone else have the feeling that the battles are becoming way too easy mid-late game(at least playing as rome) ?
Im not talking about the AI here and the way it reacts but rather the fact that as soon as you get Legionaires you can easily win a battle thats pitched 1:2 against you without minimal losses.

For example ... full stack consisting of 10x legionaires, 1x general, 4x vet. legionaires, 3x cav, 2x wardogs going up against a mixed unit of barbarians ... roughyl 1700 vs. 3200...the outcome was i lost about 80 guys while they lost ~3000 ... and that just one blob charging the other blob. It seems that the roman units will simply chew through anything without taking any significant losses.
It seems that this really comes into effect with the introduction of legionaires, before that the losses are roughly what you'd expect them to be.

This is on Hard Battle Difficulty btw..

[Riekopo]

No elite unit caps doesn't help either. This whole game is far too easy.

[Mahijsimo]

Also with Patch 2 Beta? I have heard that the AI is changed from very easy to very hard

[The_Dude]

Also with Patch 2 Beta? I have heard that the AI is changed from very easy to very hard

yes...with the beta 2 patch ... and read what i wrote ... im not talking about the AI but rather the fact that roman units seem vastly superior to anything else

[acm_no1]

nvm edited, my mistake

same thoughts to OP

im playing Macedon at turn 125th, and now my armies are really god-like compared to those filthy barbarians and easter hillmen...

[Jackal2233]

Well that's kinda like what happened in history so heh

Next thing you know CA might nerf the Romans then everyone will complain they suck. The problem is the AI isn't very good at training elite troops. Their recruitment is vastly improved in patch 2 then on release however, and superpowers do field better troops (gold chevrons) after many victories. Superpowers finally emerge in patch 2, but with the unaggressive CAI still in (aka, they should be more aggressive declaring war), it takes time quite alot of time for them to train an army worth a challenge.

At late game they do field artillery finally though, so even if they lose the field battle they'll still cause significant losses with their artillery.

[Mahijsimo]

Download the radious mod and try it again!

[The_Dude]

Download the radious mod and try it again!

i have his entire pack from the 14.9 installed...any more bright ideas ?
also, it doesnt make a difference since he doesnt individually alter the units but does it across the board so a superior unit will stay superior even if it has decreased stats.

There could be lots of variables why the Ai armies are getting so outclassed.

• Ai isn't recruiting tier ii and tier iii troops (although beta 2.0 is better as far as composition is concerned)
• Ai isn't using champions to train troops to get xp (which should be a priority for the ai)
• Who knows what army tradition the Ai is unlocking, but I hope they are focusing on the fighting ones mainly (they need it badly)
• Ai Generals, traits, and retainers again not sure what the Ai is doing just hope the AI isn't at an unnecessary advantage. Hopefully the Ai isn't picking the useless ones or ones that don't apply to them. For example having a retainer that gives +1 authority when commanding a fleet to a land general.

[/quote]

i think the AI not recruiting enough Tier 2 & 3 troops might be adding to it alltough i did see quite a lot of those(sword nobles for examples). i mean im not talking about going up against a stack of freeman levys here. XP might be an issue since i have a lot and they have practically none alltough i dont remember it having such a big effect in previous iterations.
the army legacys and generals also dont factor in that much i think. but then again, it might just be a lot of small factors that keep adding up.

[Kinjo]

There could be lots of variables why the Ai armies are getting so outclassed.

• Ai isn't recruiting tier ii and tier iii troops (although beta 2.0 is better as far as composition is concerned)
• Ai isn't using champions to train troops to get xp (which should be a priority for the ai)
• Who knows what army tradition the Ai is unlocking, but I hope they are focusing on the fighting ones mainly (they need it badly)
• Ai Generals, traits, and retainers again not sure what the Ai is doing just hope the AI isn't at an unnecessary advantage. Hopefully the Ai isn't picking the useless ones or ones that don't apply to them. For example having a retainer that gives +1 authority when commanding a fleet to a land general.

[Tenhi]

There could be lots of variables why the Ai armies are getting so outclassed.

• Ai isn't recruiting tier ii and tier iii troops (although beta 2.0 is better as far as composition is concerned)

I made some observations about that.

Basically the AI never builds anything that is tier 3/4... because it simply CANT. I used the "all factions mod" when it was released to look at some of the factions... and even with tier 3 barracks the only thing I could recruite was tier 2 units (the tooltip for the building also says nothing about new units). It seems the non-playable factions dont have access to anything over tier 2. While it could be a bug with the mod, or a matter of the factions being incomplete if you play them yourselfs, it pretty much matches my observations from my Pontus campaign. Even in turn 150+ I have never seen anything that was higher lvl than tier 2.

[Metallistic]

I agree. But does anyone else remember the statement from CA in the latest patch notes that they have even more plans to address AI army compositions? It seems that they pretty much fixed them for early game. Mid and and late game are yet to be addressed. Combine that with the incredibly high kill rate and there you have it.

[Kenios]

War dogs tear apart lightly armored units, which are the barbarians in your case. In addition, Rome is the noob faction with overpowered units.

[The_Dude]

War dogs tear apart lightly armored units, which are the barbarians in your case. In addition, Rome is the noob faction with overpowered units.

war dogs rarely get more then 100-150 kills each which is just about the average of any of my units.

[Eofor]

So I take it from this thread that CA went full retard and gave Rome stupidly overpowered legionaries again?

[SinerAthin]

So I take it from this thread that CA went full retard and gave Rome stupidly overpowered legionaries again?

Nope, Rome isn't any more overpowered than the other factions.

In fact, a lot of factions are messy. It's just the balance of the game that's whacky overral.

We got elite units without cap(Barbarian Oathsworn & Roman Preatorians), not to mention Elephants who are pretty crazy atm.
Elite cavalry is not capped either.

[inversive]

So I take it from this thread that CA went full retard and gave Rome stupidly overpowered legionaries again?

yep they need serious nerf. I've won a battle with 4 regular legionaries against 2300 Libyans who had a unit of Elephants too. SO OP.

[C.Maximus]

Dude, It happened in Rome 1 as well, post reform troops were just superior, they did take over most of the ancient world. Thats why most 2v2 Rome 1 games online were Rome and Rome vs Rome and X faction. In Rome 1 the only thing that I used that had a relatively effective chance against post reform roman troops were cataphracts, which was also historic. Maybe expand your empire east into Parthia and north into Sythia. The desert and plainsmen might give you more of a challenge then barbarians of the north trying to outmatch your heavy inf with their medium inf. I found Baktria can field some good armies.

[General Grievous]

well, Rome is an overpowered faction because they have overpowered untis.
But i play as Macedon and i can say that it's easy to win a battle too. (playing on hard difficulty)
i fight both romans and a capadocian faction, always at 1vs2 and i win easely.

Anyway, the whole game is too easy, even if you play on legendary.

[Mixxer5]

To be honest, for me Roman units were superior to any others since the very beginning... And considering how fast their initial units change to legionaries, that only makes them even more op.

[Korburss]

I think the real problem is that, even if you "nerf" the stats of roman troops, there troop types are generally superior. Very heavy swordsmen is currently the "elite" type. The only thing that can really match it (Other than higher stated very heavy infantry.) is flanking with cavalry, which should you be in a city or unfavorable terrain might be impossible due to the unbreakable nature of very heavy infantry type or your next best bet being trying to get them in a choke point and hit with siege weaponry.