Carthage steamrolled by Snaish Tribes ? WTF !

[Morfans]

Third campaign (VH) as Rome and all three times by 252BC (20 turns) Carthage is gone, destroyed by Spanish tribes' invasions.

Where are my Punic Wars !?!?!
That's total nonsense.

I can't see any mod (or patch) fixing this: are you all happy with it or is it just my misfortune ?

[[N2]Kami]

So what's wrong with that?

[biohazardcake]

carthage is sopossed to be more powerful than rome in the begging but they are really underpowered

[PitaboyDK]

I haven't seen that in my Roman campaign, actually Carthage won over the Celtiberian Confederation in Iberia.

[Lord Mongsworth]

I haven't seen that in my Roman campaign, actually Carthage won over the Celtiberian Confederation in Iberia.

Haha what a load of BS. Seriously pics or STFU... sigh

[Sherm]

Carthage usually is steamrolled by everyone. But reapper often (more great than at start) becouse the AI is bad to manage the public happiness.

[Morfans]

Carthage usually is steamrolled by everyone. But reapper often (more great than at start) becouse the AI is bad to manage the public happiness.

Ok, that's palliative, sort of. It spoils the immersion, though.

The Spanish didn't have (and couldn't have) any expansionist tendency in the 3rd century, so their AIs should "fortify" but stay where they are.

Carthage was a superpower and should dominate - a larger and cheaper set of mercenary units should be made available to them, perhaps.

[Kenios]

Ok, that's palliative, sort of. It spoils the immersion, though. The Spanish didn't have (and couldn't have) any expansionist tendency in the 3rd century, so their AIs should "fortify" but stay where they are. Carthage was a superpower and should dominate - a larger and cheaper set of mercenary units should be made available to them, perhaps.

Might as well just get rid of all minor factions then, and bring back the rebel faction. That's what the rebels are famous for, just sitting in their province, minding their own business and waiting to be gobbled up one by one.

[krisslanza]

This is how the game works. Sometimes factions get steamrolled. It's not like the "major" factions are any stronger then the "minor" ones. Sometimes they get a string of bad luck. Just how it happens.

[Crymson]

To those asking what's wrong with Carthage being easily steamrolled: Carthage was the preeminent power in the Mediterranean until Rome grew large enough to challenge this. Even then, it took Rome two brutal, grueling wars to establish dominance. In the interests of having each faction start off on roughly equal footing, CA has wrongly portrayed Carthage as a collective of only moderate power.

[krisslanza]

Personally I don't see the Spanish tribes usually expanding that way. Typically I see one of the minor factions down in Africa doing it, or sometimes Carthage's client states overtake it, and this leaves Carthage very weak as it ends up abandoning them usually.

[ScytheRayne]

I haven't gotten to the 150 turn mark yet, but usually by turn 50 a number of supposed "superpowers" have gone under and minor factions have become fairly well established. The Seleucids seem to manage well enough because most of their satraps withhold from entering any sort of conflict besides Cyprus (who is competing with myself as the Galatians and Pontus in my current campaign for supremacy in Asia Minor) who probably has the most freedom in moving its troops due to being on an island at the start.

Rome tends to fall to The Etruscans or even Massilia, Carthage just has.... waaay too many enemies to deal with, spread over a large area. I'm not quite sure about the Ptolemaic Kingdoms yet, haven't had much to do with that region.

[Zenky]

I haven't gotten to the 150 turn mark yet, but usually by turn 50 a number of supposed "superpowers" have gone under and minor factions have become fairly well established. The Seleucids seem to manage well enough because most of their satraps withhold from entering any sort of conflict besides Cyprus (who is competing with myself as the Galatians and Pontus in my current campaign for supremacy in Asia Minor) who probably has the most freedom in moving its troops due to being on an island at the start.

Rome tends to fall to The Etruscans or even Massilia, Carthage just has.... waaay too many enemies to deal with, spread over a large area. I'm not quite sure about the Ptolemaic Kingdoms yet, haven't had much to do with that region.

This game is about re writing history, in my Roman campaign I destroyed Carthage early on. Egypt was destroying everything in my campaign , I guess its random.

[Spaxspore]

not for me playing hard starting a new campaign with the beta 2 patch as rome vs carthage. Carthage had a huge strongholds throughout africa with alliances with libya and nova carthage. They had holdings as far reaching up into spain, and all of his allies were backing him up with navy and army support. Best fun i have had since the game came out.

Only mods i am using is the 4 turns per year and radious battle mod. The war targets worked great to.. had two armies sail from one of my greek allies all the way to carthoage so we did a joint attack while beating off his client states as well as his navies sailing in from spain.

FYI game started from scratch.. i am around turn 80-100

[Pontifex Maximus]

I've played through four campaigns so far and Carthage has never survived past about 200 BCE. Sometimes they re-emerge only to be put down several turns later.

[Humble Warrior]

I've played through four campaigns so far and Carthage has never survived past about 200 BCE. Sometimes they re-emerge only to be put down several turns later.

Ah, now this is one area in which I actually like Tw games for. There is always a possibility for a `great` nation to be beaten by a smaller one that failed in history. I think it`s a mistake to always assume that just because it happened in history that it MUST happen that way every time. Even the Roman empire could`ve been wiped out if history had had a rerun. Significant things can happen from minor causes.

You guys probably won`t get it, but that`s always been a part of Total War games and a few others.

[Pontifex Maximus]

Ah, now this is one area in which I actually like Tw games for. There is always a possibility for a `great` nation to be beaten by a smaller one that failed in history. I think it`s a mistake to always assume that just because it happened in history that it MUST happen that way every time. Even the Roman empire could`ve been wiped out if history had had a rerun. Significant things can happen from minor causes.

You guys probably won`t get it, but that`s always been a part of Total War games and a few others.

I understand that but from a gameplay standpoint sometimes people do want to have a Punic War scenario. In my experience Carthage tends to not even be a contender for even regional power status, yes that isn't a very historical situation for them but no I don't think Carthage should always, in every campaign, be a super powerful faction. The flip side of that is that I don't want to see it getting destroyed so early on in every single campaign (which so far as I've seen it, it does!)

[Bobz]

Ah, now this is one area in which I actually like Tw games for. There is always a possibility for a `great` nation to be beaten by a smaller one that failed in history. I think it`s a mistake to always assume that just because it happened in history that it MUST happen that way every time. Even the Roman empire could`ve been wiped out if history had had a rerun. Significant things can happen from minor causes.

You guys probably won`t get it, but that`s always been a part of Total War games and a few others.

This is true, there's no reason why another nation shouldn't rise in Carthage's place and form it's own empire. While some factions do similar things from game to game - particularity on the older titles with fewer factions - by and large no campaign should be similar, and that's the way I like it.

Incidentally, in my current campaign Carthage went through a tough patch threatened by the African tribes, but have now regained the African cities formerly held by Libya and are slowly becoming a stronger faction. Weirdly enough, they didn't seem to start counter-attacking their other enemies until I declared war.

[PlPs]

And in Anatolia, Bithynia and Galatia destroying every single factions.

[Tim_Ward]

The problem, I think, is one of the more insane design decisions made by CA: splitting Carthage up into Carthage, Nova Carthage (which doesn't have Qart Hadasht because... because... uh, "game balance") and Libya, which seems to lead to it being at war with the entirety of North Africa and the Iberian peninsula which Meta-Carthage can't seem to fight effectively because its' resources are split between three powers, and the main Carthage faction isn't interested in fighting wars in Iberia, it wants to concentrate on what's really important: making as many tiny armies and navies as possible and then moving them around the Mediterranean at random while its cities are picked off.