Updated 12/12/2014 LAVRENTIVS ROMAN UNIT RE-SKINS

[krazysigmarite]

Oh my god, HBO ROME Legionaries, so gorgeous.

[Lavrentivs]

@ Caprera,

Hi, the reason why I use celtic armour with my marian legionaries is mainly for 3 reasons:

1) I cannot bear to look at uniformed Roman soldiers, because (for me) it is a detestable image that is utterly false and a misrepresentation of the period. Therefore, celtic chain mail has been utilised within he unit give an alternative to the "Roman" hamata variation. Within rome 2's models files there is a nice 'caped' version of Roman hamata, but the military belt is unfinished, and would also be out of place in the Marian period. (I'll post a pic of it soon)


2) The second reason I am using celtic armour (and helmet variations) is to illustrate the immense cultural influence that the celtic peoples had on Roman equipment, particularly in this period. During the 1st Century BCE, the Roman soldiery would have been in more and more contact with Celtic peoples, through auxilia and other encounters. Their choice of equipment would have been heavily influenced by heavy celtic equipment. One example of this is the new coolus helmet which starts to appear in the gallic wars, again influenced by Celtic models like the Mannheim.


3) During the 1st Century, we all know one of the greatest events was Caesar's gallic wars, where legionaries adopted/looted/wore a lot of celtic clothing/equipment (at least for the duration of that campaign and even in the civil wars perhaps). Ceasar mentions himself in his commentaries, that legionaries started adopting celtic garments, which he refers to as "tegimenta".


People often forget that roman legionaries would have had regionalised equipment. My legionaries' equipment is regionalised for gallic frontier.



@dom385, I am putting up the units without the colour changes today.

As a note: all the colours I use on the coloured version of the legionaries are authentic and reflect colours produced by natural dyes such as those produced by madder and kermes, both used in the Roman army. I'll be presenting the historical context of these colours soon, it has all been carefully researched.


@ (Decoy), I plan to do that at some point, so keep a look out. I usually have my files separated for flexibility in cause some one prefers my version of one unit and somebody else's version of another.

[Lavrentivs]

Okay guys, just a quick update on what's going on at the moment:


- I'm about to submit my re-skinned Marian units (Legionaries; Veterans; First_Cohort) WITHOUT RE-COLOUR, as individual units, they will be up shortly.

- Due to my in-inexperience as a modder I'm unsure as to what I can do about my veterans' compatibility issue with Radious' Battle Mod. I was able to change around the weapons on VariantsMeshes, but they are always getting over-ridden by Radious' Augustan-equipped veterans. The only way that I could get my skins in the game would be to actually release an edited version of Radious' mod, which, as far as I am aware, breaks the rules.

Does anyone with more experience than myself know what I can do about this?

[Jean-Roch Coignet]

Well your mod is incredible Lavrentis, I do not know how to change the Veterans and evocatii back to sword units any other way then editing/changing Radious Battle mod, which i did and works perfetly, veterans and evocatii are again sword wielding units for me with my corrected stats ofc.

[Lavrentivs]

UPDATE 20/09/13

Marian units submitted as individual .pack files, without individual colour schemes. They will be subject to your Rome faction colour scheme (faction recolour mods recommended, my units in vanilla colours look hideous, some with bright yellow tunics).

[dom385]

I would like to use your colours but it's a choice between having a nice looking roman faction or nice looking everyone else. Although I did get another roman recolour mod to work which is basically the same as yours.

[Wolar]

Excellent work, the historic background material is especially impressive.

[Lavrentivs]

Thanks, there are more things I would put into units, but I am unable to create my own pieces of armour or do textures for now


Apologies for the lack of information Historical Context sections, they will all be filled in during the course of this weekend and into next week.

[The Border Reiver]

Hey Lavrentivs, I can't seem to find the extraordinarii download link? Or is this still being worked on?

[Lavrentivs]

INFORMATION UPDATE:

- A lot of the historical context sections for my re-skins have not been filled in, I look to rectify this soon.

- Currently I have been looking back at my Italian socii units and I personally find them to be sub-standard and poorly researched.


Socii Hastati:

- The high proportion of lamellar armour within the hastati will be rectified, i.e. the lamellar will be taken away. Initially, I included it for the sake of variation, but it appears that this armour was usually worn by higher castes of warriors within Etruscan society, who would not have been in a hastati unit, but allied Principes or Triarii/Hoplite units. (see Historical Context section on Italian socii).

- I will be taking away Italo-Etruscan helmets and will replace them with plain montefortino helms.

- Basic linothorax armour will be replaced by quilted gambesons, which were cheap to produce and worn widely throughout the ancient world

- You will see more pectorals within the unit. I will include some of the basic pectorals (not the ones with Iberian patterns) from the Iberian units if I can, so that there is more variety.


Socii Extraordinarii:

- Will do a historical review and make corrections where necessary

- I will research more as to the possibility of Illyrian type helmets in the 3rd Century, and if I find the evidence lacking (though there is some there through coinage), I will make corrections.

-General Corrections will be made where necessary.



I will also make a Southern Italian version of the extraordinarii for those who prefer their more traditional Samnite image.

From what Polybios (6.30 - http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/...extraordinarii) says, it seems to me that the extraordinarii would have been a whole mix of different Italian allies.

Within the socii you would get a lot of armour variation, and a lot of the armour worn would be regional (e.g. an Etruscan soldier could be in a linothorax/negau helmet, and a Samnite would have his feathered italian attic, pectoral, and unique shield). It wouldn't be possible to do this within a single unit and all the armour types would be mixed up with one another on different soldiers. Now, this is not to say that the allies each had a strict code of uniform - it would be ridiculous to claim that - but I think you would generally have been able to tell them apart.

Livy (34.47) seems to suggest that this allied and allied extraordinarii units were themselves split up into cohorts just as the Roman legion was( http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/...3Achapter%3D47).

It would only make sense to split these units into cohorts/maniples by region. Therefore, my theory is that the extraordinarii cohorts were also separated by region, since recruits from each allied tribes/city-states were allocated if deemed suitable for service.

So essentially, you would have the extraordinarii as one collective unit, but it split into cohorts consisting of the selected men from each regional group/city-state.

e.g. an Etruscan cohort, a Lucanian cohort, Samnite etc. etc.






As far as I know, the extraordinarii were organised into their own cohorts

[Aodh Mor]

From what Polybios (6.30 - http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/...extraordinarii) says, it seems to me that the extraordinarii would have been a whole mix of different Italian allies.

Within the socii you would get a lot of armour variation, and a lot of the armour worn would be regional (e.g. an Etruscan soldier could be in a linothorax/negau helmet, and a Samnite would have his feathered italian attic, pectoral, and unique shield). It wouldn't be possible to do this within a single unit and all the armour types would be mixed up with one another on different soldiers. Now, this is not to say that the allies each had a strict code of uniform - it would be ridiculous to claim that - but I think you would generally have been able to tell them apart.

I think what you're talking about here may actually be possible. If you look very closely at the definitions the hierarchy goes like this
<VARIANT_MESH> - Parent File
<SLOT name="base">
<VARIANT_MESH/> - This would contain all of the detail currently available
</SLOT>
</VARIANT_MESH>

What i've been wondering lately, is whether it would be possible to put multiple Variant's childed to the name="base" slot, so it has a set of explicit references to choose from, i'll test it and tell you how it goes

[Lavrentivs]

The Border Reiver

:

Hey Lavrentivs, I can't seem to find the extraordinarii download link? Or is this still being worked on?

Hi, they are all part of the Italian Socii pack in the links list. Within the unit pack you will find 2 versions socii v1 (including socii hastati v1 and extraordinarii v1) and socii v2 (including socii hastati v2 and extraordinarii v2).

I will get down to releasing them as individual units, since some may want to use socii hastati v1 with extraordinarii v2 and visa versa - this will be done TODAY, as in I am going to do it right now


However, I will be making another version of both, as I am not satisfied with the way they look. Feel free to have a go with the older units though


EDIT:

Done.

[3enrique]

Hi, I think you haven't put any image of your "Marian Veterans" ...?

[Aodh Mor]

update, my hunch was right

[The Border Reiver]

Looking good Aodh Mor, well done good find.

Laurentis, I found the pack thanks for that. The units look great in game thankyou. I was having trouble matching your skin pictures with mine in game and realised that if I place your files higher than the Gaul skin and shield pack in mod Manager, then everything looks perfect. thanks for your help!

[Cell7]

Hey, thanks for the HBO Reskins! They look great! You should consider just doing a mod that features all the uniforms used in HBO's Rome - like a massive HBO re-skin or something

[MaximusTW]

Congratulations laurentius great mod, really a reskin refined and historically accurate!

PS:a question, but because the thread is no longer visible?

[Entotz]

first thing to open is this thread cant wait for the new things LAV!! keep up the good works!!!

[dom385]

Ok, I just have one last question. I'm using the natural dyes mod, with the colours for rome from the roman reskin mod (and the rest of the files but they just add some cloaks and armour to post marian units). However the first cohort all have white shields, everyone else is how they should be, with dirty white colour tunics and reddy brown shields. Can you think of anything that could be causing this? Could it be the decals for the first cohort in your mod?

[MichaelTotalWar]

Your units are one of the best I've ever seen. It is very different and more detailed than Vanilla.
Do U use 3ds max or other 3d program?
Congrats