Modification of 3d Meshes

[PROMETHEUS ts]

I am opening this thread to discuss themodification of 3d models .


I woudl like to distinguish between the following things:

• 3d model of unit rigged ( perhaps tunics , animals , men etc )
  
• 3d model of unit unrigged ( perhaps helmets, crests , weapons etc )
  
• 3d model of buildings ( with needs of editing AI paths and interactions )
  
• Animations ( needed to replace or add new animations )
  
• skeleton and rig ( fundamental to rig new armors and animated objects )
  
• morphing not sure if there is anything at all for facial expressions or if is used a bone system .

It is important to decode and be able to import and export the 3dmodels because

it will allow to change the uvmapping and allow eventually some retexture works by knowing how textures are mapped on the models
it will allow creation of new replacement models
it will allow new buildings
it will allow new creatures
it will allow new campaign models
it will allow new animations

For those reasons the importer exporter needs to be able to import skeleton and reexport, animations and models .


I have opened a model of one of the 3d models with an hex editor and eventually the Texture paths might be changed with that , allowing to duplicate a model , insert a new path of texture and resave , this might actually have the sole use of creating a new model using a different texture but will not allow to change uvmap or else .

for example I opened wolf_pelt_2.rigid_model_v2

Looking in the directory I coud see the usage of two models, wolf pelt and mask those have two different patsh so for example replacing the texture of the mask , it might allow to make a golden mask ( just making an example ) and resave the file as wolf_pelt_variant.rigid_model_v2

I have not tested this as I have not the time right now but I think is possible .

The path of texture are like

variantmeshes/_variantmodels/man/pelts/tex/wolf_pelt_2_diffuse.dds

variantmeshes/_variantmodels/man/pelts/tex/test_mask.dds

etc....


Important is the version of importer exporter ...

I personally do have 3dsmax 2011 64 bit
some have max 2012 and others less , so I wasn't able to mod anything in STWII couse I didn't have older versions of max and the importer exporter did not work for me .

also some Setup 3d files of examples woudl work , to show how are setup , collision , dummy objects, skeleton , rigging , models , polycount , uvmapping etc ...

[Magnar]

Do you want to add campaign settlement models to that list?

[PROMETHEUS ts]

already did but those are simple models and woudl not even require AI path things , apart perhaps some animations for some of them .

[wangrin]

First of all, it seems that, contrary to previous TW, and particularly warscape engine based ones, CA use now a single file format for unit parts, equipments, buildings and ships : .rigid_model_v2

Opening "eastern_cone_helmet_a.rigid_model_v2" model with hex editor, it look like :

1. model refers to a skeleton : here, it refers to rome_man_game, lion model refers to a lion skeleton (or .anim reference pose)
2. it's quite hard to tell if the model is composed of several lods or not, but it look like it is composed of two groups
3. textures (materials) are defined for each groups

[PROMETHEUS ts]

are we stuck?

[wangrin]

the good news is that CA use only one file format for models.
And .rigid_model_v2 from S2TW and R2TW present some similarities.

But now, we should try to figure out how file is "built".
It would help if someone has information about .rigid_model_v2 file format from S2TW.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

It seems to be counting the occurrencies of the diffuse textue in one of the models that there are 4 lod levels .

[wangrin]

It would make sense to have 4 lods.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

so hexediting I managed to change the texture file path of a model , that can at least allow to have a duplicate unit using a different texture and so do not burden on the vanilla setup and not risk to get overwritten by other mods or update changes ...
but that's all for now .

[warman222]

so hexediting I managed to change the texture file path of a model , that can at least allow to have a duplicate unit using a different texture and so do not burden on the vanilla setup and not risk to get overwritten by other mods or update changes ...
but that's all for now .

I tried that same thing to test out a theory of mine that you can override the color system is you add variations that have a color built in already. I duplicated a cloak mesh and changed the path through notepad. When I got it into Rome 2, the unit in question(companion cavalry) was invisible! Did you get your change to work? If so, what did you do?

[PROMETHEUS ts]

I tried that same thing to test out a theory of mine that you can override the color system is you add variations that have a color built in already. I duplicated a cloak mesh and changed the path through notepad. When I got it into Rome 2, the unit in question(companion cavalry) was invisible! Did you get your change to work? If so, what did you do?

The color can be overriden by working the mask textures I think.

[Actus Reus]

Any news on how to extract 3d models and import custom ones? I have a tonne of assets ready on my HDD and I want to start playing around in Max again..?

[wangrin]

I've just installed Maya 2014 and try to open .anim files :



Sadly, it said "unrecognize file type"
But as it's the first time I use Maya, i'm probably not reliable here.

It could be kind from CA if they could answer to the question about .anim file format : did they use .anim from Maya or did they use a modified file format.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

u tried with max?

[wangrin]

I've tried to import .anim first.
Then, I've tried to import .max models from Assembly Kit and some of mine but I have the same error message.
At least, I've been able to import a .fbx model.

It seems that .max and .anim are not recognized by Maya.

I have to search for informations about 3ds max to Maya workflow.

[wangrin]

OK, I've found why I had this error : the animImportExport plug-in wasn't loaded.
To do this :

1. Launch the Maya application. Click "Window" in the main tool bar. Highlight "Settings/Preferences" and select "Plug-in Manager" from the drop-down menu.
2. Click the "Auto Load" check box for the AnimImportExport plug-in. Click the "Close" button at the bottom of the Plug-in Manager window to return to the main Maya workspace.
3. Select "Exit" from the File menu to close the Maya application.

Maya user guide :

• Import and export animation curves in .anim format
• Plug-in Manager

But, right now, I've still errors when I want to import .anim files :

file -import -type "animImport" -ra true -mergeNamespacesOnClash false -namespace "onager" -options ";targetTime=4;copies=1;option=replace;pictures=0;connect=0;" -pr -loadReferenceDepth "all" "D:/MODDING - TOTAL WAR/TW_GAMES_EXTRACT/EXTRACTS_R2TW/animations/skeletons/onager.anim";// Error: Nothing is selected for anim curve import. // // Error: line 0: Error reading file. //

As it is the very first time I use Maya, I'm certainly missing something.

[TuranianGhazi]

Yeah, many factions are missing religious building line altogether. I was thinking to fill that hole first... but then many of those factions really could use custom, new buildings instead of the Barbarian or existing "cultures" that don't fit exactly too well

I'm getting myself Maya now to poke around... Yes, we need a clear, straightforward working pipeline for working with CA models, ALL models.

As always, wangrin you're leading the charge, mon ami

[PROMETHEUS ts]

Well I am a 3dsmax user so I dont have maya.

[HunterWolf]

Why do you think that the name of the file "anime" says that the file can unearth through Maya? Get the file from Maya .anim and file of the game and compare, they are different

[wangrin]

.anim is a file format extension.
Maya use a file format that have the same name.
So, one of the possibility was that .anim from TW and Maya could have been similar.

Before installing Maya myself to test this, I've asked several time CA to confirm if this supposition was true or false.
Of course, I've had no answer, they were probably too busy to "polish" R2TW.
It would have saved me some time from downloading, installing and testing Maya and TW's .anim.

Here is .anim pattern : ANIM file format
But, as I have no .anim examples from Maya, I can hardly compare them to TW .anim using a hexadecimal editor.

I'm not a file format expert.
If you are, your help is welcome.