Amazons: Total War II mod

[parthian shot]

This is to announce that Amazons Total War II mod has been started.

The initial goal is to port the current Amazons Units to the existing faction in Rome II

Until the Rome II stabilized, the Amazons script and the culture will not be ported.

So in the initial release, you would see Amazons units for recruiting by various factions, but no Amazons factions or culture.

[Master Necromancer]

Don't get me wrong it's cool that Amazons are coming but I'm a bit sceptical how will Rome I models look in Rome II.

[parthian shot]

Don't worry, we already converted all the models for M2TW and was able to run some of them on ETW. So warscape is not a factor, if that is your concern.

[Master Necromancer]

Don't worry, we already converted all the models for M2TW and was able to run some of them on ETW. So warscape is not a factor, if that is your concern.

It was and the other one is will the aesthetics fit in Rome II.

[GRANTO]

good luck...

[parthian shot]

good luck...

Thank you Granto.

[parthian shot]

The current Amazons Total War functionality is outlined below:

Amazons Total War 8.0 allows the player to explore many modern military concepts on the battlefields of antiquity, such as

• Mobility and Stand-off Weapon capability using various women cavalry units.
• Deploying Area Denial "minefield" on the battlefield using field engineers. A first on RTW mod.
• Wagon fighting units with battle tactics not unlike German Panzer in WWII.
• Guerrilla Warfare, allowing agent to infiltrate into enemy territory to raise army deep behind the enemy line.
• Long Range Mobile Artillery, allowing artillery barrage, fire-support, and counter-battery.
• Linked Armor-Clad Cavalry, a dominating cavalry formation for centuries in Eurasia, never before depicted by any video game.
• Terrifying Super-heating Incendiary Weapons, in modern day military parlance known as the thermite munition.

Other Highlights of 8.0 Series

• Player programmable mode switch
• Newly extended campaign map, now from British Isle to Afganistan.
• Far Eastern Celt faction:
  based on latest archaeological finding and anthropological theories. first time in any video game.
• New war machines based on historical and anthropological findings.
• New weapons.
  
• Quest based game play
  
• Balanced Unit Modeling (or. B.U.M.):
• unit's recruitment location/cost, vs. unit's appearance/capability must have direct relationship.
• Resource driven army building.

The goal for Phase I is to convert a portion of the 700 some units of Amazons animation and war machines (a few of which we have tried successfully on Rome II)

Such as
Amazon, Armenian, Parthian Noble Maiden
Amazon Pathfinder
Amazon Scout
Amazon Dispatcher

Phase II
Once that is complete. Convert Amazon Culture to Rome II.

Phase III
Convert Amazons Script and special game logic, such as guerrilla war and game balance monitors.

Phase IV
I am pretty sure Granto will come up with some very rad scene-scape.

[Lieutenant Colonel Sharpe]

Very bold of you, very bold.

[Vengurd]

Hi there. I hope you don't mind constructive criticism. If not, don't click below.

[spoiler]

The current Amazons Total War functionality is outlined below:

Amazons Total War 8.0 allows the player to explore many modern military concepts on the battlefields of antiquity, such as

• Mobility and Stand-off Weapon capability using various women cavalry units.
• Deploying Area Denial "minefield" on the battlefield using field engineers. A first on RTW mod.
• Wagon fighting units with battle tactics not unlike German Panzer in WWII.
• Guerrilla Warfare, allowing agent to infiltrate into enemy territory to raise army deep behind the enemy line.
• Long Range Mobile Artillery, allowing artillery barrage, fire-support, and counter-battery.
• Linked Armor-Clad Cavalry, a dominating cavalry formation for centuries in Eurasia, never before depicted by any video game.
• Terrifying Super-heating Incendiary Weapons, in modern day military parlance known as the thermite munition.

Other Highlights of 8.0 Series

• Player programmable mode switch
• Newly extended campaign map, now from British Isle to Afganistan.
• Far Eastern Celt faction:
  based on latest archaeological finding and anthropological theories. first time in any video game.
• New war machines based on historical and anthropological findings.
• New weapons.
  
• Quest based game play
  
• Balanced Unit Modeling (or. B.U.M.):
• unit's recruitment location/cost, vs. unit's appearance/capability must have direct relationship.
• Resource driven army building.

Starting from the top:

Mobility and Stand-off Weapon capability using various women cavalry units. <- Could you please expand on this, explaining what is meant?

Deploying Area Denial "minefield" on the battlefield using field engineers. <- What? Since when have we entered the age of gunpowder? If these are not mines in the conventional, modern sense, what are they? How are these weapons considered "mines" and what sort of expectations are we to expect from these field engineers?

Wagon fighting units. <- This might need a bit of clarification, how would these units work? Why are the Amazons resorting to wagons?

Guerrilla Warfare. <- This entire concept is purely over powered and highly ruinous for the simple fact that it will break the game unless some serious rebalancing is done.

Long Range Mobile Artillery. <- Again, since when have we entered the age of gunpowder? Since when have the Amazons gone so far east they've met the far easterners? Do I have the wrong implications? Are you referring to mangonels, trebuckets and other siege equipment being used as some archaic shotgun? (Lets admit it, its not only doable, but fun)

Terrifying Super-heating Incendiary Weapons. <- Why? Just why? Are the Dwarves on the Amazonian's side as well? Or is it gnomes? I'm sorry for not being constructive in this one so much as just plain rude, but this is going seriously out of the realm of acceptable divergence. No where am I able to find that the Amazons have been that far east, the wiki only mentioning Scythia and Pontus to the east, not nearly far enough to have contact with those whom have discovered the black powder. Again, if I am wrong, explain please.

New war machines, weapons, quest based, etc- The rest of this is relatively easier to make any connection to, and is rather more interesting.

The goal for Phase I is to convert a portion of the 700 some units of Amazons animation and war machines (a few of which we have tried successfully on Rome II)

Such as
Amazon, Armenian, Parthian Noble Maiden
Amazon Pathfinder
Amazon Scout
Amazon Dispatcher

Phase II
Once that is complete. Convert Amazon Culture to Rome II.

Phase III
Convert Amazons Script and special game logic, such as guerrilla war and game balance monitors.

Phase IV
I am pretty sure Granto will come up with some very rad scene-scape.

This looks good. A solid table of organization and it helps structure the goals. Regardless of what I've said, this is all very interesting and I look forward to seeing more progress on this project.

[spoiler]

I'm pretty sure someone else could come up with a bit more articulation in what I've said, but there you have it.

[McCarronXLD]

Very interesting for flavor's sake I am looking forward to seeing female warriors take to the field. I thought for sure there would be the option for female leaders/Generals at least for the Celtic peoples. We have female agents, after all. Would be nice to have female Generals/Admirals/Units as well! Also interested in seeing mixed gender units, if that is possible?

[parthian shot]

Female generals are possible with the addition of a new "culture" introduced where the genders are flipped in that culture, meaning all the generals must be females in that culture and all the consorts are males.

It works relatively well in the current Amazons Total War mod in Rome I, with few known issues.
For Rome II we just need to add the functionality once the tactical aspect is done, that would be in Phase II and Phase III.

[Puerkl8r]

Sounds interesting, especially since i fully expect CA to put in at least one Amazon unit via DLC, hopefully more than one, that an entire faction could be made out of.

The only thing is, for me, as a great lover of Subrosa's original 3.0c mod, no offence but I didn't like the updated version as much, it feels less like a realistic take on Amazon factions and more like 'lets just add stuff because we can and it sounds cool' for instance the "thermal ammunition" or adding tons of units to the amazon factions that seem fairly redundant/unnecessary with little thought of overall game balance. Granted, I played a much earlier version of the remake than the current 8.0. Sure it's fun and has some cool factor, but i prefer an amazon faction that is similar to all the other factions in unit variety and type, basically take a basic hellenistic faction, switch out regular models for amazon models and than add two to four specialized amazon units.

Don't get me wrong, it's great that you are making a mod for people that enjoy it, I just hope that somebody makes an Amazon mod for Rome II that follows the original mods more realistic take on it, with amazons having similar tech and units to ones that already exist in the game.

I'll keep an eye on it though and definitely give it a try at least.

[Khassaki]

Sounds interesting, especially since i fully expect CA to put in at least one Amazon unit via DLC, hopefully more than one, that an entire faction could be made out of.

The only thing is, for me, as a great lover of Subrosa's original 3.0c mod, no offence but I didn't like the updated version as much, it feels less like a realistic take on Amazon factions and more like 'lets just add stuff because we can and it sounds cool' for instance the "thermal ammunition" or adding tons of units to the amazon factions that seem fairly redundant/unnecessary with little thought of overall game balance. Granted, I played a much earlier version of the remake than the current 8.0. Sure it's fun and has some cool factor, but i prefer an amazon faction that is similar to all the other factions in unit variety and type, basically take a basic hellenistic faction, switch out regular models for amazon models and than add two to four specialized amazon units.

Don't get me wrong, it's great that you are making a mod for people that enjoy it, I just hope that somebody makes an Amazon mod for Rome II that follows the original mods more realistic take on it, with amazons having similar tech and units to ones that already exist in the game.

I'll keep an eye on it though and definitely give it a try at least.

Yeah, the artillery chariots and thermite bombs everywhere made it unplayable if you were just after a bunch of female units in your army. I liked the idea and especially the horse archers, but could not play it due to these added units.

[parthian shot]

Sounds interesting, especially since i fully expect CA to put in at least one Amazon unit via DLC, hopefully more than one, that an entire faction could be made out of.

The only thing is, for me, as a great lover of Subrosa's original 3.0c mod, no offence but I didn't like the updated version as much, it feels less like a realistic take on Amazon factions and more like 'lets just add stuff because we can and it sounds cool' for instance the "thermal ammunition" or adding tons of units to the amazon factions that seem fairly redundant/unnecessary with little thought of overall game balance. Granted, I played a much earlier version of the remake than the current 8.0. Sure it's fun and has some cool factor, but i prefer an amazon faction that is similar to all the other factions in unit variety and type, basically take a basic hellenistic faction, switch out regular models for amazon models and than add two to four specialized amazon units.

Don't get me wrong, it's great that you are making a mod for people that enjoy it, I just hope that somebody makes an Amazon mod for Rome II that follows the original mods more realistic take on it, with amazons having similar tech and units to ones that already exist in the game.

I'll keep an eye on it though and definitely give it a try at least.

Your point is well taken, however, the original mod is based on fantasy and legend, the later Amazons TW is based on archaeological and anthropological findings. We merely showcased the possibility, to do otherwise would be to do entertainment for entertainment sake. rather empty minded in my opinion.

[Puerkl8r]

Your point is well taken, however, the original mod is based on fantasy and legend, the later Amazons TW is based on archaeological and anthropological findings. We merely showcased the possibility, to do otherwise would be to do entertainment for entertainment sake. rather empty minded in my opinion.

I guess realistic might not have been the right word, but rather something that feels like it fits into the game as if it belongs, without any unique and new tech that is specific only to that faction. Either way, I personally preferred the more simple 3.0c, to the newer version that i tried awhile back, maybe ill try 8.0 and see if it has changed at all since then, but in general, i like mods that keep things simple, or change everything completely....so i guess consistency is what I like.

[saxnot]

Your point is well taken, however, the original mod is based on fantasy and legend, the later Amazons TW is based on archaeological and anthropological findings. We merely showcased the possibility, to do otherwise would be to do entertainment for entertainment sake. rather empty minded in my opinion.

I'm sorry, what?
Based on archeological and anthropological extrapolation? thermite weapons? Artillery? land mines? What, because the vandals once used fire pots to sink some ships it's reasonable to extrapolate a culture that regularly uses thermite explosives? They might as well be firing thermonuclear penguins. There were no firearms or explosives in regular use during the classical era. There were never any systematic attempts to develop them. The only artillery that was ever used in ancient times were wooden machines like scorpions or catapults. You’re not extrapolating or developing from archeological evidence, you’re just adding random units and mechanics based on your own imagination.

Also, in what universe is your mod not a fantasy mod? You do realize that amazons weren’t real, right? They didn’t exist? Some Scythian women were buried with arms, yes. That might mean some of them were warriors. That’s not exactly the same as a matriarchal society. There’s about the same amount of evidence for the mythical amazons as there is for centaurs or satyrs. Again, not extrapolation, imagination.

[TheRomanRuler]

The mod sounds interesting, but for the sake of knowledge there is no proof that a well-established Amazonian society ever existed. Graves have been found of women buried with weaponry and the like yes but no where near enough to support the hypothesis of an Amazonian society. The Greeks also believed in Minotaur and what not and to my knowledge they aren't real either...

Also some Women from noble families were buried with weapons, despite never using them. But still novadays there are some primitive cultures where women are warriors, so it is highly likely Amazons really existed. Anyway, good luck!

[Causeless]

I really want to see someone put the original Rome 1 models into Rome 2, just to see what it'd look like.

[parthian shot]

Well, Puerkl8r The primary reason of the mod is to explore the Matriarchal Equestrian Society and the Goddess Cult. The Thermite Jar along with countless other weapons are the result of anthropological data extrapolation.
As such the mod is quite playable and has been quite popular outside of this TWC.

The mod is not just about female units, it is an integrated scheme of things.

Some of the army is not intended to be Greco-Roman army, and it tends to be more mobile. The real problem players are facing, not realizing the root cause is the AI. Simulation after simulation, we can demonstrate that the Amazon units are quite beatable when one player is deploying conventional army against the Amazons factions, with or without the thermite weapons.

Thermite weapon itself is as realistic as we can make them, and there are several discussion thread on the Rome I Amazons Total War forum as how to tackle such weapons.

I think I am hearing two players who are not able to come up with ways to deal with rather unconventional challenges in the mods. So I probabaly try to publish more paper on these concerns.

BTW, although some playes express same concerns at the beginning of their games/campaigns, most players have little issues after they played through the game.

[SinerAthin]

Historical accurate or not, I think it'd look great to have some crazy, hysterical women screaming and going 'zerk on the ancient battlefield xD
Definitely good entertainment value, and I don't mind the extra unit diversity!