Pontus feels underpowered

[TsarBG]

Pontus' unit roster is nothing compared to that of other factions. Now, I know what some of you are already thinking, that obviously certain factions will have advantages over that of others, and I acknowledge that.

However, in the case of Pontus, they have a weak Macedon + Parthia combo. Their best melee swordsmen will be absolutely shredded by almost all factions in the higher end tier, their cavalry is good, but almost all other factions can match or beat them, their pikes are decent, but are no match for other troops unless you use Thermopylae tactics. Their missile units are limited as well, which is disappointing considering the range XP bonus for eastern factions, which doesn't seem much to speak of. Even their chariots are matched by the Iceni, and they have better infantry too. The hillmen and spearmen are next to useless due to quick battles and routing times. In the case of campaign, a decent player can surmount these obstacles - though apparently open pitched battles are not a good idea.

And in the case of multiplayer, there seems to be little point in playing them unless you want to challenge yourself. I mean, Rome has praetorian cavalry which even beats or matches Pontus' Parthia's cavalry; what's the point of creating this faction with such a poor unit selection overall? I am certain that CA said that technology would be balanced so people could compete in late game - even though I'm pretty sure the only thing that balances it out now is the incompetent AI.

Where are units such as a cataphracts, as in Rome 1? Seems to me that the Pontus roster is nearly the same as Rome 1, except lacking in the face of Rome 2. I understand this is was a day one release, but if factions (not to mention the game itself) are going to be released in this state, then please delay them until they have been more fleshed out and improved.

Anyway, I'm looking forward to when the game is patched and polished more. This is a legitimate concern, don't take this as a "Grrrr CA you tricked me I'm never buying from you again" thread.

[Revan The Great]

I guess Pontus is one of those factions suppose to be the Jack of all Trades but Master of None.

I thought they were kind of weak too, but for some reason every faction known to me (except Athens) was declaring war. Even Cimmeria was launching huge naval invasions, while the Seleucids were attacking every few turns. Kind of reminded me of EB as Pontus... Not like I was being very aggressive either - I only have four provinces, one of which was a former allies' territory that I annexed instead of liberating, and another I took from Cappadocia.

[TomR199]

I would like to see a heavier skirmisher like an archer or javeline option, cappadocian cav that can beat noble blood but lose to cataphracts, and one or two other mercenary infantry that can be recruited from barracks. Pontus had quite a diverse army during Mithridates time.

[DarthShizNit]

Their unit rooster is meh, but Scythed Chariots can make up for all of that if you're patient enough to micro them...but yes they definitely got the short end of the pike.

[Pontic Pontus]

the thing with Pontus is that they've got really good medium units. WHile they are not as powerful as high tier units theres a lot of them, but they're not as weak as low tier units as to run away very quickly.
While Bronze shields can be beaten up by other pikemen, they are cheap enough to make a double line and not be too spread out, and Pontic swordsmen are in fact shock infantry, not melee infantry. Pontic Royal cav. and Noble blood cavalry are like the companions and the Thessalians of Macedon, a very powerful combination, with just slightly weaker but more pikemen than Macedon to hold the line and thureos spears and Pontic swordsmen to guard the flanks.

[jamreal18]

However, in the case of Pontus, they have a weak Macedon + Parthia combo.

Also Epirus has a weak Macedon + Egypt combo.

[ToonTotalWar]

Well there are many mods that cover Epirus, Macedon and Pontus to boost there rosters, go use them and I am sure you will enjoy these factions better

[Zwirbaum]

First of all, Pontic Swordsman are avaible at tier 2 of the barracks (Holosideros Barracks) which is pretty early - they are not the most expensive unit (pretty good upkeep) and can tear through most spear,lower tier sword units. (And in Pontus location you'll see a lot of spear units ). Scythed chariot are weapon of mass destruction - in early game, you can just faceroll small towns with only general unit, what could you want more?

The only problem i see in Pontus is I) - Their 3rd and 4th level province capitals do not have artillery (they have slots but not avaible to deploy, probably due to the fact pontus have hellenic cities, and have normally eastern artillery - probably oversight on CA).
II) - Eastern spearmen, are god awful - the only reason to have them is that they are somewhat resistant to missile fire (big shields) and pretty cheap (50 upkeep on standard) to help maintain PO.
III) - Pontus should have access to standard pikemen - there is big gap beetwen Levy Pikemen on Muster Field and Bronze Shield Pikemen on Royal Barracks (which is pretty funny considering they have standard pike dmg (20), not so great hp (45), and on a bit expensive side (150 upkeep).

(Do not forget that Pontus can create satrapies (which in my opinion are better than Client States), and what you lack in your normal rooster, you can find in your satrapies - In my VH Pontus Campaign I made full Carthaginian Stack )

[jamreal18]

Well there are many mods that cover Epirus, Macedon and Pontus to boost there rosters, go use them and I am sure you will enjoy these factions better

Can you use them in multiplayer as well?

[ToonTotalWar]

Can you use them in multiplayer as well?

Of course, but you would need the other player to be using the mod as well

[Anna_Gein]

The thing that surprised me with Pontus roster is that their swordsmen are weaker than Parthian swordsmen. If anything, it should be the opposite and the Pontus swordsmen should be the closest unit of this kind to Roman legionaries through inferior to the latter. Maybe with a relatively weak morale compare to their combat skills.

[AnonMilwaukean]

Zwirbaum, above, explains exactly how I feel about Pontus as far as pikes are concerned: Bronze Shield Pikes are a pretty awful unit for how long you have to wait to get them.

When I won a campaign as Pontus, the Pontic Swordsmen were my bread and Pontic Peltasts were my butter. Pontic Swordsmen are a reasonable melee unit if you upgrade their armor/shield/weapon, and Pontic Peltasts do very high damage (45 missile damage!) and can take a good amount of damage as well. And chariots are always nice.

Eastern Spearmen are actually one of my favorite units in the game: they can be built incredibly cheaply for use as military police in a city, and afterwards can either be simply disbanded, or can be used to soak up the charge of an enemy unit or the missile attack. If that's all you expect out of them, they're actually very, very useful. The moment they have to do anything else, however, is the moment they typically flee despite having only 20% casualties.

The main annoyance for me, as Pontus, was the starting location: you start with an unfortified settlement, and by the time you really get anywhere, chances are either the Galatians, the Seleucids, or the Armenians are attacking you, and every few turns, someone is sending a couple of units over the sea to attack your flanks.

[Mithridates VI]

I don't think that Pontus is underpowered. Yeah it has a little bit shallow unit roster compared to Rome, Seleucid etc. but it isn't underpowered. I like Pontus.

[|Sith|Galvanized Iron]

Nah man they got chaz that chew right through that inf and their bronzes are cost effective semi-elite infantry when the enemy player has to run with levies.

[jamreal18]

The thing that surprised me with Pontus roster is that their swordsmen are weaker than Parthian swordsmen. If anything, it should be the opposite and the Pontus swordsmen should be the closest unit of this kind to Roman legionaries through inferior to the latter. Maybe with a relatively weak morale compare to their combat skills.

Agree! Pontus swordsmen should be stronger than Parthian swordsmen.

[Lugotorix]

Zwirbaum, above, explains exactly how I feel about Pontus as far as pikes are concerned: Bronze Shield Pikes are a pretty awful unit for how long you have to wait to get them.

When I won a campaign as Pontus, the Pontic Swordsmen were my bread and Pontic Peltasts were my butter. Pontic Swordsmen are a reasonable melee unit if you upgrade their armor/shield/weapon, and Pontic Peltasts do very high damage (45 missile damage!) and can take a good amount of damage as well. And chariots are always nice.

Eastern Spearmen are actually one of my favorite units in the game: they can be built incredibly cheaply for use as military police in a city, and afterwards can either be simply disbanded, or can be used to soak up the charge of an enemy unit or the missile attack. If that's all you expect out of them, they're actually very, very useful. The moment they have to do anything else, however, is the moment they typically flee despite having only 20% casualties.

The main annoyance for me, as Pontus, was the starting location: you start with an unfortified settlement, and by the time you really get anywhere, chances are either the Galatians, the Seleucids, or the Armenians are attacking you, and every few turns, someone is sending a couple of units over the sea to attack your flanks.

Yeah, I've completed a full campaign on normal (my first) and I feel just about the same as you and Zwirbaum. I wasn't underwhelmed, and I absolutely thrashed the early game, due to tier 2 Pontic Swordsmen, which are reliable fillers for melee uses if upgraded when you have access to Bronze Shield Pikes, which changes Pontus' play style a bit. Although I did finish before you could recruit auxiliaries with your Satrapies.

[Octavius Vatco]

Historically, Pontus considerably lacked native military material. Mithridates VI relied much on mercenaries during his wars against Rome.

[EdwardReynolds]

Pontus has a strong early roster, transitioning into an average late game. The idea is to focus on economics so that in the late game you can spam expendable armies.