Seige weaponry can break this game

**Gongsunzan** · September 02, 2013, 10:34 AM

Some factions have ridiculously overpowered seige weapons. The zora come to mind with their mage cannons. They tear through lines of soldiers. Fighting them as hyrule there is no viable strategy. If a cavalry unit was readily available then i could possibly counter them. The ai puts 5 mage cannons in a stack which outranges, has better accuracy and more kill power than the hyrule trebuchets or balistas. My two stacks of almost 2000 men won against 500 zoras but i lost over 1500 troops. The cannons and octo platforms in one stack is just too much destructive force. Hyrule cannot match that. Imagine a human player with that kind of power against hyrule. Possibly ordana or gerudo could use its cav to win but any infantry based faction seems screwed most of all the darknuts who are slow as is. I cannot defeat the zora at this far into my campaign.

**Kahath** · September 02, 2013, 06:41 PM

I do agree with the fact that some siege weapons are very powerful, but I think that the problem is not that they are too powerful.

Siege weapons should be in my opinion very powerful, the problem is that in making siege weapons such as cannons realistic in terms of accuracy and power they shred an enemy force to ribbons because it is very easy to acquire large numbers of them.

A solution is not to reduce power and accuracy, but to greatly increase building requirements, initial cost to produce, and upkeep costs. Mage cannons should have an initial cost of 2000 rupees, and an upkeep of 500 rupees. Cannons should also require a tier 2 or tier 3 siege workshop or equivalent building to be produced. The idea being that if a player or A.I. has lots of cannons or other siege weapons they are pretty much already winning. Most siege weapons should also require two or three turns to be produced, these are very powerful weapons that can devastate an enemy force so they need to have some pretty big cost requirements to ensure that siege weapons are not abused.

This is just one way of doing it however, I have always been frustrated at how weak cannons are in M2TW so I would prefer the units to be useful but much harder to acquire.

Also cannons are best fought using the terrain to your advantage, placing your forces behind even a small hill can really help you. The cannons will usually have to move in order to get a clear shot at you and that takes time. Don't know if you already know this, but I figured it would be worth mentioning.

**niveksirrah** · September 02, 2013, 07:36 PM

You might also want to try reading up on some cannon fighting tactics. Like Kahath said, use hills. Split your forces up into groups of two or three and spread them out to charge from different points. It takes time but will save you a lot of troops in the long run. Also make sure to use things like wide formation.

**Gongsunzan** · September 03, 2013, 10:34 PM

Yea the battle feild terrain unfortunately in this instance was bowl shaped. There was no where to hide. I did not expect the kind of power some factions seige weapons have. Also the ai doesnt seem to care that it was killing scores of its own troops with the cannons either.

**Eldren** · September 08, 2013, 06:58 PM

In My experience. Having too many siege weapons in your army will get you killed. The units that push them around are some of the weakest of each faction and fewer in numbers than a normal unit. So any time I have 3-5 or more. I get massacred. Any time I fight an army that is doing the same tactic. I Will All ways win.

The trick is to Loosen formation of your hole army. And close the distance fast. once your in melee with superar numbers and better troops. you win hands down. Cav are the best. but a single unit of infantry can make 1 or 2 units of Artillery not able to rain hell(depending on how close they are to each other.).

2 more things.
1) Zora mage cannons run out of ammo fast. I can't seem to win with the zora vary easily ether.
2) The Darknut bird men slaves. Will make almost any attempt to use artillery against the darknut an Epic fail.

If you don't believe me, try it out in custom battles.
So in my thoughts. Artillery are not overpowered, nor do they need to be Nerfed. But that's just me.

**Kahath** · September 08, 2013, 10:12 PM

Originally Posted by Eldren

In My experience. Having too many siege weapons in your army will get you killed. The units that push them around are some of the weakest of each faction and fewer in numbers than a normal unit. So any time I have 3-5 or more. I get massacred. Any time I fight an army that is doing the same tactic. I Will All ways win.

The trick is to Loosen formation of your hole army. And close the distance fast. once your in melee with superar numbers and better troops. you win hands down. Cav are the best. but a single unit of infantry can make 1 or 2 units of Artillery not able to rain hell(depending on how close they are to each other.).

2 more things.
1) Zora mage cannons run out of ammo fast. I can't seem to win with the zora vary easily ether.
2) The Darknut bird men slaves. Will make almost any attempt to use artillery against the darknut an Epic fail.

If you don't believe me, try it out in custom battles.
So in my thoughts. Artillery are not overpowered, nor do they need to be Nerfed. But that's just me.

You have obviously never had a lot of the hwatchas to just blow away your enemy. Zora cannons are basically the same thing, in one battle I only got off one volley with three Zora cannon units. Slaughtered 18% of their force and killed their general in the first few seconds of the battle, it was funny as hell.

On a side note it seems the Total War devs have a rather unusual take on what the hwatcha was actually like. They basically portray it like it's a guided rocket launcher, it can even destroy stone walls with ease. Never saw that on Mythbusters.

**Drazule** · September 17, 2013, 08:10 AM

My problem is that artillery is very spotty in its reliability. Like zora mage cannons can destroy a charging force and cause them to rout, while the Sol Cannon can destroy a general and 3 adjacent units, if it actually hits anything. I understand that these things are like the energy of a sun made manifest, but no matter how satisfying it is to get that huge kill, I'd rather be able to rely on them to constant damage, not the one off half army wipes.

**Totalimmortal** · October 10, 2013, 07:27 AM

[QUOTE][The holy pilgrams release only fixes the rams and towers, it doesn't fix the walls which are currently counted as buildings (neph said it is a simple miskeak by him) this means that the only way you can get in a settlement is to attack the gate, the AI doesn't even try to attack you /QUOTE]
Hi people, I'm new here, I have a question about ram/siege towers, I also have that problem in which they get destroyed in one fire arrow shot. Now, I saw this post by Jakeford on page 32 in the Bug Center thread, but I can't seem to find that fix by Holy Pilgrim (maybe I overlooked it somewhere). If someone can help me I would really appreciate it, ty in advance