So, were there black legionairs?

[ROYAL SIPHAI]

Why do people find it so hard to accept black legionaries. There could be Arab Legionaries.

The Romans did not give a about colour.

[Lavrentivs]

The subject of racism has become blurred and misused in this day and age.

The fact that some of us are in agreement that there would most likely have not been any black legionaries, does not insinuate that we deem black people to be inferior/superior in any way at all. I do not know how or why some people would come to such a conclusion.

[Danius]

The fact that some of us are in agreement that there would most likely have not been any black legionaries, does not insinuate that we deem black people to be inferior/superior in any way at all. I do not know how or why some people would come to such a conclusion.

I do. Biased media has been telling people what to think for atleast 20 years.

[Hattori]

Not exactly ROYAL. There are accounts that Roman officers assumed that men from temperate climates were much more reliable as soldiers.

[Meraun]

Well its well known that in the late Empire ,about 300 A.D. and later, not too many Italians served in the Legion any more. Like in the
modern U.S. Army or other Western army not every soldier is white due migration. Same happen in the Roman army i guess. The Empire growns and more people form different origins, espacially Barbarians wich were
allowed to settle in Roman Soil, join the Legion. So it was an "white" Italian Army in the End.

But i guess in the early Republic till may 100 a.d. it was mainly white army.

[Marcus Aemilius Lepidus]

Well its well known that in the late Empire ,about 300 A.D. and later, not too many Italians served in the Legion any more. Like in the
modern U.S. Army or other Western army not every soldier is white due migration. Same happen in the Roman army i guess. The Empire growns and more people form different origins, espacially Barbarians wich were
allowed to settle in Roman Soil, join the Legion. So it was an "white" Italian Army in the End.

But i guess in the early Republic till may 100 a.d. it was mainly white army.

The number of "Barbarians" joining in to the Roman Army was very limited. At the moment people from provinces like Germania, joined in to the Legion, they were more romanized than the romans themself. The idea about "Barbarians" settle down and join the legion is a common missunderstanding. Since the Goths it was possible to give foederati status to certain tribes and allow them to settle within the empire, but they never joined the legions in large numbers. The stayed among themselfs and had independend military commands. They also didn't mixed with the local population, intermarriage was the exception.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

The number of "Barbarians" joining in to the Roman Army was very limited. At the moment people from provinces like Germania, joined in to the Legion, they were more romanized than the romans themself. The idea about "Barbarians" settle down and join the legion is a common missunderstanding. Since the Goths it was possible to give foederati status to certain tribes and allow them to settle within the empire, but they never joined the legions in large numbers. The stayed among themselfs and had independend military commands. They also didn't mixed with the local population, intermarriage was the exception.

Another one of those false affirmations , most of the Roman army of the late period was made by Germanic tribes conscripts or paid levies , as well as mercs , one of the many reasons for the abandonment of the usual legionary fight style in favour of the more barbaric / medieval singular fight style !

[Tim_Ward]

I don't find it that difficult to believe that some blacks may have somehow made their way into Roman lands and ended up serving in the legions during the imperial period. I don't think there would have been a whole lot of them, though.

[Nordmann]

I don't find it that difficult to believe that some blacks may have somehow made their way into Roman lands and ended up serving in the legions during the imperial period. I don't think there would have been a whole lot of them, though.

It would have been very rare, at least until the 2nd century AD.

[Woodrow Skillson]

Loving how people take a person with "nord" in their name seriously here, are people going to have 14/88 in their names and signatures soon as well? How about some nice SS bolts or a Death's Head avatar for Nordman there.

[Hattori]

From Goldsworthy's the complete Roman army, about the writings of Vegetius:

Vegetius describes in some detail the ideal recruit, although some views had more to do with racial prejudices and medical myths of his day. Therefore, men raised in temperate climates rather than the hot eastern provinces were supposed to prove steadier soldiers.

So there, the Romans were not exactly blind to race.

[jackwei]

Usually just say a Man of African Descent is an auxiliary soldier and earns the prize of Roman Citizenship at the end of his career then he could become a Legionary or his son can become one, plus Rome did give out citizenship to some people who fought for Rome a reward or if it was to benefit them in someway.

Usually it was down to status more than Race it is just the later Europeans Post Roman Empire have tried to make a big deal out of it.

It is very likely you have people with all different tones of skin in North Africa and hey Egypt did have quite a sizeable population of darker tone skinned people, it is just a myth created by later Europeans to say none of them were around at all during the Roman era.

Didn't Greeks call dark skinned people them Ethiopians??

[Megasalexandros]

The Greeks called all dark tones "ethiopians", and there are many racial descriptions in ancient texts such as of Platos and Aristotles.
But to stick to the point, the Roman citizenship was given away to all the inhabitants of the Empire in 212 AD When the mullato and half crazy Caracalla took over the Empire, the fact was that the Roman empire did declined rapidly after that.
Untill then the only major Auxilliary units would have been that of northern Europeans guarding the borders of the Empire and taking the citizenship after 25 years of Service within the 28 legions of Augustus, we are talking about a number of some thousands every generation.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

....When the mullato and half crazy Caracalla took over the Empire, the fact was that the Roman empire did declined rapidly after that. ....

Caracalla??
Mulatto???
Are you even Serious?
Thats one another of those gossip magazine sensationalistic and basically Ignorant factual affirmation like Septimius Severus the BLACK Emperor !!!And that the Son was a Mulatto !

REALLY ...

Septimius Severus was born on the Lybic coast and from an Equestrian Family , it was hardily possible to call him a BLACK man !
Just the PSeudohistorians who advocated Pan-Africanism, have referred to Severus as "the first black Roman emperor". This is entirely accurate for his equestrian roots
as his roots are at the best of Phoenician kind ... that could be hardly called "Black" !


This just shows the level of bias and mixed Ignorance of Some pseudohistorians that base their knowledge on the gossip papers and sensationalistic titles to grab attention!

[Megasalexandros]

Caracalla??
Mulatto???
Are you even Serious?
Thats one another of those gossip magazine sensationalistic and basically Ignorant factual affirmation like Septimius Severus the BLACK Emperor !!!And that the Son was a Mulatto !

REALLY ...

Septimius Severus was born on the Lybic coast and from an Equestrian Family , it was hardily possible to call him a BLACK man !
Just the PSeudohistorians who advocated Pan-Africanism, have referred to Severus as "the first black Roman emperor". This is entirely accurate for his equestrian roots
as his roots are at the best of Phoenician kind ... that could be hardly called "Black" !


This just shows the level of bias and mixed Ignorance of Some pseudohistorians that base their knowledge on the gossip papers and sensationalistic titles to grab attention!

NOO iam not sayint that Sevirus was black!
Iam saying that he was half Roman half "carthaginian' or rather north African, thats why i called him like that, you have judged me wrongly.

[jackwei]

The Greeks called all dark tones "ethiopians", and there are many racial descriptions in ancient texts such as of Platos and Aristotles.
But to stick to the point, the Roman citizenship was given away to all the inhabitants of the Empire in 212 AD When the mullato and half crazy Caracalla took over the Empire, the fact was that the Roman empire did declined rapidly after that.
Untill then the only major Auxilliary units would have been that of northern Europeans guarding the borders of the Empire and taking the citizenship after 25 years of Service within the 28 legions of Augustus, we are talking about a number of some thousands every generation.

Some Tribes who were loyal to Rome or set of people could have been given citizenship for their service or who have helped Rome in the past in some special cases, but at the end of the day it down to whether you were a Roman Citizen or not.

It is just like you had people complaining about the guy who played the Centurion from Numdia in that film Centurion 2011 Movie because some thought he his skin tone was too dark to be Roman and didn't take into regard maybe his family earned Roman Citizenship or he did.

I am pretty sure if we had a game set in the era of Egypt and Pharaoh's soldiers skin were the same as those of African you would hear an uproar about it by some who feel people who feel completely insecure about, because they've been taught a certain way that it is impossible.

[smoke]

The Greeks called all dark tones "ethiopians", and there are many racial descriptions in ancient texts such as of Platos and Aristotles.
But to stick to the point, the Roman citizenship was given away to all the inhabitants of the Empire in 212 AD When the mullato and half crazy Caracalla took over the Empire, the fact was that the Roman empire did declined rapidly after that.
Untill then the only major Auxilliary units would have been that of northern Europeans guarding the borders of the Empire and taking the citizenship after 25 years of Service within the 28 legions of Augustus, we are talking about a number of some thousands every generation.

Caracalla was a mullat? Is that why he looks so grumpy?

Anyway I think Greeks were very fond of Ethiopians. I think Herodotus called them the "most gracious people known to us".

[Woodrow Skillson]

Caring this much about the goddamn shade of skin on a virtual video game man is absolutely ing racist. This is literally the dumbest thing possible to be upset over. You are getting all angry because of the skin color of a pretend person. The only reason to get your panties in this much of a bunch over this issue is that you are somehow offended by the association of a dark skinned person with your "white" nation.

[Valerius Maximus]

This is literally the dumbest thing possible to be upset over.

you haven't been around much lately i guess ......

[Meraun]

well, prom,

You have to admit taht the average Englishmen or Swedish or Swiss (like myself) has more lightskinned than the average Italian... just due the fact of living in a Country wich is closer to the Equator, you lucky guys. Woud love do live in a sunnier country than cold old Switzerland.

This has nothing to do with racism