Balons First rebellions background and some AAR/fiction

[Mithridate]

I know its been touched upon but Im unaware if it has been properly discussed as to why Balon attempted his first rebellion, all ive read is that he supposedly thought westeros weak and still divided from the civil war. Something i find rather absurd after 10 years of peaceful rule and recovery under Robert... I mean, Balon does not live under a rock after all and the ironborn are based upon some of the worlds finest traders ( and warriors ) of all time.

So, ive come up with my own headcanon as to why Balon did what he did and was wondering if theres any real support for it anywhere in the lore ( or any other reasons for the folly ). Im using this headcanon for my GJ plays to fuel the fire of vengeance against Lannister, and for some AAR mentioned at the end of this post.

Is Balon the intelligent and utterly ruthless man as he is made out to be, or a narrow minded old fool living out a grudge?


This is completely my own headcanon, dont mistake it for anything else

Balons first rebellion was instigated as a ploy with Tywin and Balon, they would start a war that would spread and shatter Roberts rule and advance bouth houses whatever the outcome. Balon would ignite the flames and Tywin use his influence to cause civil strife. The war should become very profitable for both houses, yet when Balon not only ignited the flames but sunk the entire lannister fleet. Tywin worried things would get out of his control, the entire coast undefendable due to the loss of it when but some coastal castles where supposed to fall, or the odd town sacked before the Joys focused on other fronts to leave the lannisters mostly alone ( thus eradicating any suspicion of GJ and Lannister actually being in league ).

Thus, he never did what he promised as to spreading unrest and Seaguard was forewarned of the attack. Balon was crushed, and only Lannister benefited from the ordeal.

If this and the latter bolded part above the pic where true, he would naturally want to attack the westerlands. Its not really a problem tho as all i see of Balon aside from the disaster of his first rebellion goes in line with it and the former bolded part. Intelligent and utterly ruthless, my kind of guy

Keep posts free of mere opinion, im not interested in what you think but what you can support.
( pardon the rudeness, but too many pointless discussions and circular arguments have been had before on related Ironborn subjects )


Now, i also wanted to bring attention to some AAR/fiction ive written from some hotseats we play humans play humans Campaigns.
Feel free to read it in the spoilers below but do not comment on them here. If you want to comment, PM me.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Balon Greyjoy, Lord of pyke and king of the isles

Too few, too few have answered our summons. Renly refuse to even acknowledge us while those whom would see him king promises everything between heaven and earth... The Wolf hollers in the north with little being spoken, the fish yet to rear its ugly head... All while the lion paws in the dirt.

"Lets move to support the wolf, i know Robb and with our help he would be king. The riches he would grant us..."

With a sneer, balon spoke up "grant us? I piss on grants, we are ironborn and i will see us take what is rightfully ours and earn our keep the old way. We are not mere soldiers or sellswords, we are ironborn!"

Surveying the exchange, Asha spoke up

"Yet, payment for services rendered is still paying the iron price. Our men clamor for fighting, the gold would fund it as well as keep unwanted enemies at bay... Dressed as whores or not, they would jump at the opportunity with glee. Lets see if the wolf is as willing to pay as he is to have us attend his bed."

Scoffing, Theon looked away while Balon looked more furious than ever albeit nodding.


"Lets hear them all out then, but i shall have them served piss in a cup should they not start bringing pleads to the table instead of this incessant bleeting of "friendship". Love and tolerance is not my business, i seek plunder and war and little more... For that i need but resources." Making a pause and looking out through the stained window, balon muttered "war is upon westeros, i shall teach them to fear us again as is proper, they give us what we demand or see us take it."

Looking upon theon, Balon spat "I will carry no gratitude, no debt or gratitude to anything but the shackles of my words. I can only hope my successor will relearn our ways and not be blinded by the constraints of friendship and debt."

Theon could only glare, our word is iron yet words are wind... I shall see us more

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The sea mercilessly hammered Balons flagship, the weathered captain standing tall on the rolling deck. A coin being flipped between his fingers.
Gold talks, lannister gold more-so than most... Another flip of the coin, lazily rolling over his leathery fingers.

Sail south, south to wage war, the sea is ours by right we said. In return for tribute, he gave us land to lessen the tribute.
Turning his hand, he grasps the coin tightly in his palm.

We have sailed south to wage war, but why should we leave the isles defenseless and fight the reachmen over lions?
Never did I say whom to attack, nor when... No promise of peace was ever made or a binding duration set... We demanded, he gave.

Releasing his grip on the shiny piece of metal, he opened his palm and eyed it.
My word is iron, iron can bind even dragons... yet my shackles are unbound and this is but gold, an inferior metal.
Snorting, Balon flicked the coin over the railings and into the churning sea, the hungry depths swallowing it whole.



The Ironborn have landed, despite the lannister fortifications made and two armies readied to prevent any ironborn Landing,
Lannisport is besieged by Victarion himself. The crows eye and a band of unproven youths laying siege to Faircastle.

I shall place the driftwood crown upon my head once i have taken Casterly rock itself... Indeed,
I shall repay you in kind Tywin, for my first rebellion... We remember and We do not sow.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The fog lay heavy over Lannisport and its surroundings, much like that day so many years ago... Balon clenched his fists behind his back and nodded to his brother "commence the attack, bring me the head of every Lannister within those walls" His rough voice muffled into near nothing by the devouring mists.

Victarion picked it up however, nodding with a grin and called his chosen men forward ahead of the main force, equipped with grappling hooks they would pave way for the main assault. The defenders where unlikely to expect such a blatant and early assault without proper siege equipment. Why should they worry behind their high walls? After all, the westerlands fielded the best drilled and equipped soldiers in all of Westeros and these where but raider scum.

"The city will be ours before the sunrise, the time for our redemption is nigh"

Balon made no reaction to the comment and merely watched him and his men be engulfed in the oppressive and dank night.
Im coming for you all, in the name of my two lost sons and the ever hungering drowned god himself... I shall have my vengeance

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

( loud in the very end, enjoy as you read and if you dont know what the ponification its based upon go watch Dr.Horrible, right away! )

Turning to the amassed men and the awaiting captains whom would lead them in the coming charge he thought back on that failed rebellion, a decade old bad memory ever haunting him. All he had sought and foolishly grasped for, all his dreams yet none of his plans... This time would be different, this time it was him pulling the few strings that where!

The rebellion... the glorious rebellion that would spark another civil war, turn fragile brother against brother in a glorious fight. Yet he had been deceived, the mainlanders acted as one and the agreed wedges between them where seemingly absent. Indeed, the enemy where warned and influence used to unite rather than cause discord as promised! Profit had been his motivation, but after Lannisport he must have found something more profitable to seek, or the loss control was too much for a man such as him...

No, this time would be different

Around Balon stood a dozen captains along with his two remaining children, all familiar faces and leading over a hundred men each. The entire Iron fleet and his personal forces united, awaiting his command. "At the strike of two bells, begin the attack. Where theres lannister bodies at the wall by a rope, climb. Focus around the gates and await my brothers horn" Nodding the commanders bashed their right fist over their hears "what is dead may never die..." But Balon raised his hand, silencing them. Too long have we been scorned for the wrong reasons, for too long thought to be weak... lets give them a reason to scorn us, a reason to hate us as we take all that is theirs.

"Every family with a serving lannister is to be purged, spare no one" Some of the captains seemed to hesitate and Theon looked horrified, but Balons gaze brokered no argument and as one the captains thumped their chests again "But rises again, harder and stronger!" Yet as Balon turned, a hand grasping his arm, Theons hand. Slowly he met the upstarts gaze with malice in his eyes.

"My King, lets not waste an opportunity like this. We have use of able bodied hands, and the women could use female aid back at the isles too. What more grievous insult but to take their children for our own? Raise and train them to become our warriors and fight in our name, in only half a decade we would have thousands additional troops at little cost." He let go of his fathers arm, eyes pleading as much as his face showed nothing but anger. "Those unworthy would become slaves, or die."

Balon sneered "Hear that men, seems my son has a taste for little boys and girls!" Silence was all that greeted his humorless outburst. "Let it be so, spare the children yet to become men or women, they shall serve as much as hostages as to piss Tywin and his subjects off. Theon here shall take care of them, Asha will see to the task of collecting them and getting them to the Isles. Now, get ready and await the horn!" Without another sound, he walked back to his post. Quickly once again being devoured by the fog leaving everyone behind to see to their tasks.

It did not take long before a horn sounded, as if miles away and the assault began in truth.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

(skip to 0:55 for the beautifully sung message, scroll down if you dont want the professional animation )

Lannisport burned, smoke rising to the skies as the now conquered population tried to stench the flames. Thousands lay dead in the streets, entire families wiped out for their service and only the youngest that where able to walk by themselves still living. Wordlessly herded through the streets by blood smeared warriors.

Asha approached her brother, standing in the middle of the square and just as blooded as the men around him. Harras Harlaw sitting on a fountain and sharpening his sword. "You saved a lot of lives today brother, clever. But what will you do with so many?" She touched his shoulder, only to have him slap it off and turn towards her.
"Spare me your pity and see them brought to Ten Towers, the reader will find them homes on the isles and his house see to those he cannot. Make no mistake, I will make them ironborn and show that fool of our father what I can do even if I have to build my army from nothing." Scorn was the only thing she could see in his eyes, as he turned and limped away.

Harras merely laughed at the flicker of sadness and hurt in her face, before she sat down beside him. "That boy will see himself to an early grave, or raise us all to greatness".


Casterly rock is under by Euron Greyjoy. Theon was sent to secure the pass to the Golden tooth where he encountered a regrouping Lannister army formerly holding Casterly rock, they had heard the news of the fate for any family that fought for Lannister however and where eager to accept his word of their own and families saftey in addition to some gold. They lay down their arms and returned to Casterly rock and its surroundings.

If the spoilered content interests you, i suggest you check out this and PM me thoughts and writing tips.

[The Guy With No Imagination]

How did Lannister benefit in any way from Balon's first rebellion? Cersei was already queen by then, Tywin rich, Jaimie pardoned in the Kingsguard..

Besides Tyrion, the Lannisters were as perfect and powerful as can be before the rebellion, and after, well they found themselves without any fleet.

I fail to see where's the benefit though.

[Mithridate]

The lannisters losing their fleet was unlikely ever planned, indeed i state it as the reason as to why Tywin never went through with it but settled for financial gain.

Much as the Lannisters position was strong it was rather unchanged, sacking KL and betraying the king when embraced as an ally ( mad or not ) was not something looked kindly upon and the only things better than wealth and power is... more wealth and power. We all know that Tywins one goal is to secure the future of his house, preferably at greater heights than before. The benefits of civil war would be to further strengthen their standing or primarily further indebt the other houses. Waging war is expensive and whom to turn to but the Lannisters ( the crown in particular), whom had little to lose on it but money even in a worst case scenario.

Robert had no love for the Lannisters and should he die by some accident or in a battle, the lannisters would have a puppet on the throne of their very own to shape as they wanted. Something i hardly think Tywin would want to pass up on and getting rid of Robert in KL would probably not be easy or end well even if successful. ( precisely due to the Lannisters hold on the throne ).

[The Guy With No Imagination]

In all likelyhood Balon's first rebellion was probably just placed there because it gave Martin a reason for him to invade the North. I know you don't want opinions, but there really is no logical sense as to why Balon revolted, and he was indeed very lucky that all he had taken away from him was Theon. His lands and title remained in tact.

And we all know he cares very much for titles, since that's essentially what the King of the Isles is. The Greyjoys have been able to get away with reaving whilst still Lords of Pyke and the Isles, and it makes more sense politically to stay that way and not be crushed by the eventual forces later on of Stannis, Daenerys, or the Tyrells since he would still be a part of the "kingdom" so to speak.

I'm of the mind that he's a pissed off old man who needs to get let off some steam.

[Mithridate]

As you say, not very interested in mere opinion so please put some meat on it Most likely as with an disturbing amount of things, its all for the conveniance of plot indeed which is why i clearly state it headcanon and searching for support. Wish G.R.R would rely less on plot bullets and armor. Its possible however that the first rebellion was the character changing event for Balon tho from the descriptions of the younger him that seem rather unlikely.

"We all know he cares very much for titles"? I find Balon to be one of the least material men of all, what makes you say titles are an exception? His motivation for wanting to become king seem more one of necessity of tradition and thus to leading the ironborn back to glory than merely wanting to say "I am king". Their raiding under the Iron throne was non-existent as "quiet vassals" btw. However surely the major reason as to why they want independence, their culture all but demands it.

If he was a pissed old man whom needed to let off steam, then why did he seek to keep the north and not simply kill as many northmen as he could ( Starks in particular)? Or kill as many westerlanders as he could for little to no real gain, it would certainly mess up things for Tywin. Or raid south and butcher reachmen, test the 10:1 saying. ( or, all of it but holding the north ).

Instead, he went for the one option where he would reasonably be able to gain and hold land, cause the most chaos... And to state he lost little in the first rebellion is a bit delusional... The ironborn forces where battered and he lost two sons, I imagine keeping his influence on the isles was a bigger concern than remaining the lord of Pyke alone.

[jacb547]

I don't think it likely was a plot like that. The Westerlands and the Iron Isles together would never be able to withstand the entire realm thus I see little reason that Balon would start a doomed rebellion just for the sake of expanding his influence until he was destroyed, neither would Tywin I think. In my opinion Balon was as you say "a narrow minded old fool living out on a grudge" who dreamed of glory.

[Mithridate]

You didn't read it all, did you?

[jacb547]

I did. Thought I might have explained myself wrongly because I was kind of tired.

[Aenima]

I strongly doubt that he'd do any such thing. He's the most Ironborn of the Ironborn, and holds contempt for the mainlanders. I would assume he was that way before his rebellion, too. Also, considering how the Lannisters paid with gold, and not with iron (and were famous for paying with gold) he likely thought of them as a house of pussy cats to be looked down on, not lions to be reckoned with. He might be the kind of man to attack an undefended kingdom, but he doesn't strike me as the type to plot in the shadows.

As for his original rebellion, I think that it's very easily explained; he's an arrogant idiot. He doesn't leave the Iron Islands to fight in the north, and yet talks about "the strongholds I have seized, the lands I have taken," or words to that effect, when Ramsay's demands are delivered to him, which reeks of arrogance to me. And when Theon tells him that Robb is willing to let him be king of the Iron Islands and would let him seize and take Casterly Rock (and, I'd assume the lands around it) he refuses the offer, believing that he has the strength to make himself king and get what he wants, and instead opts to raid the north, which is known to be far poorer and of less importance. He proudly refuses to earn himself much richer lands than he what he independently attacks, so it doesn't strike me as impossible that he'd have genuinely thought that he could have won his independence for good the first time around. After all, with that Lannister fleet sunk and the Ironborn being considered the greatest sailors in all of Westeros, what did he have to fear? Without a fleet anywhere else, I'd expect that anyone without much foresight would consider themselves unassailable if they were to destroy the Lannister fleet at anchor, and so that's why I think he did it.

[HannibalExMachina]

i guess thats true, the ironborn are raiders, not conquerors. he surely was convinced that victarion could beat stannis and redwyne, and after that, they would take isles and coastal regions they could easily hold. and he may have assumed the rest of westeros would take the chance to weaken the central authority. not a good judgement.....