Imjin mod (Korea campaign)

[huascar]

so no artillery for the Koreans???

[uanime5]

could you show us the map? i really want to see how korea map look like!

The first post has some screen shots of the map. I tried to upload some pictures of the map with roads and borders but TWcentre didn't accept them for some reason. The best place to see the new images is my Steam screenshots.
http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/7...9/screenshots/

so no artillery for the Koreans???

I'm unsure which of the vanilla artillery the Koreans used. They also used a lot of artillery that isn't in TWS2 which also makes it difficult to create an artillery roster.

[wangrin]

About Korean artillery roster, the first step would be historical document researches to define what unit you will have to create.
Then, searching for pictures or descriptions to define how model should look like.

The hardest step will be to create usable models using CA's raw materials provided with Assembly Kit.
I'm even not sure if creating new artillery engine will work or not.
I know that Primergy has had problems to import new models to S2TW and finally stop trials.

The other problem will be to create new animations.
We have no tool to export animations created, for example, using 3ds max or Maya to CA's .anim file format.

[VINC.XXIII]

@Wangrin, thats sad, so finally Shogun isn't really more modable than RomeII concerning the units??

[manolops3]

Hello Wangrin,

the artillery would be very cool,especially the " Bow-Arrow-Flak " - one on uanime5´s images.but i think this is too hard to get this to work.
But what can you tell me about the possibility to integrate new ship-models ? ( i really want this beautiful Turtle Ship )

[wangrin]

We have several problem to handle the CS2 converter.
What is possible is to create new equipments and unit (but need some more work).
What is not possible yet, mostly due to bugs or not enough knowledge is to create engines, buildings and ships.

What is not possible is to create new animation as we have no converter at all.

It would have help if CA would have had invited one or several modelers to the modding summit and organized a workshop to show how they "built/organized" theirs models.
Doing this, they could have seen that the Building_Attributes.mcr was corrupted and most of their .max models didn't work with CS2 converter.


So, I can only tell to people to try to install 3ds max 2010 and 2013 and have a look to CA's .max models.
And then, try to modify them to understand how they are built and how CS2 converter work.
I suggest to use these threads to ask questions about CS2 converter and .max models :

• [Tutorial] How to import self-made 3d models into Shogun 2
• [Tutorial] Needed: Simple Tutorial for exporting and importing S2TW Equipment model Modifications

I should have written a list of all problems we have, how we have tried to solve them and what are results to people who is able to transmit it to CA staff.
But I didn't have enough time to do it since late August.

[gookbbong]

i think i could help artillery or ship research for korea.

[manolops3]

Hi to all,

what i have expected is,that integrate a new Ship-Model would be the most difficult one from the stuff i want to make.but i hope still there is a way......

on steam there is a modder,it seems that he was able to integrate new artillery-models,and buildings.
i dont get the link yet,but if someone will take a look at this,go to Steam and search for the Mod : " S2TW Artillery Unit Pack " .
this is one of his artillery-mods,he also made a building-mod.his username at steam is " The_Yogi "

[wangrin]

Yep, I remember.
He had add artillery engines from NTW.
Maybe is it possible to use NTW models (.animatable_rigid_model, .rigid_model_animation and rigid_model).

For example, NTW was able to managed ETW models (.variant_weighted_mesh).

[manolops3]

Oh,from Napoleon-TW ?
so it will not help,except where it is possible to make Models and use NTW-files as a base,and then integrate this in Shogun 2......could this be ?

[wangrin]

To create NTW/ETW engine models, you will need UU3D + ETW plugin.
I dont think that VPM converter for MilkShape is able to handle them.

What you can try is to look at the "artillery" mod for S2TW.
It should give you an idea about how to add ETW/NTW artillery models to S2TW.
I suppose that S2TW is able to handle NTW/ETW engine model file formats.

[manolops3]

this might be a stupid question,but what is and what do " engine-models " ? this is not a animation i suggest ....

another thing:

my plan was it,to use CA´s Ship-Max file as a base,and change as less as possible,build the Turtle Ship-model-parts up around,and about the Cannons i orientate towards the CannonBune-Ship ( for the right
Placement of the Cannons ).i start today to open the 18 ( !!! ) CannonBune-rigidmodels ,and convert them to fbx and obj,but there are files i cannot open with Unwrap 3D.

bow_wave.rigid_model_v2 ( RIGID_MODEL_V2-file )
logic.xml.rigging ( RIGGING-FILE )
placement.placement ( PLACEMENT-FILE )

and at this early point the problems begins.......

[wangrin]

What I name "engine" are, mostly artillery models.
It's how CA name folders were you can find them.

Even modifying the only ship .max model, you will have several problems :
1. we have no information about how to place guns ;
2. we have no tool to create our own EFlines ;

I suppose that the .xml file that contains EFlines data (type, coordinates and direction) is also use to define where to place guns.
But we have no example we can use to know how to write these data.
CA has "forgot" to give us a ship model with guns.

It is likely that information about guns is in models_naval tables.
These tables are the most complex of all db tables.
They contains 3d data such as EFlines, gun position, rigging model, etc.

So, to understand how to create more complex ship, we need some more .max example from CA.
This is the very same for buildings.


At least, we absolutely need a models_naval tables editor/converter.
This tool should convert models_naval table into a 3d model, if possible .fbx or .max and vice versa.
And this is also true for NTW and ETW.

I agree that is a very complex work and it's hard to "convince" tool creators to work on this.

[weirdoascensor]

Yes, S2TW can still use ETW-NTW enginemodels. To Implement them, follow this Tutorial by Primergy:
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...w-Cannon-Model
This is the method which I use to mod in his Civil War Artillery Models.

About Artillery Rosters:

KOREA
Fire Bomb Slingers
Wangu Mortar - ETW Mortar model shall suffice, but Custom-Made would be better.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Hwacha Rocket Launcher - Need Wheelbarrow MLRS Model. Use Gatling/Puckle Gun Fire animations?(Need Testing - must able to launch up to 100 rockets in quick sucession)

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Hyeonja Black Class Medium Cannon - Need Small Four Wheel carriaged Cannon Model
Chonja Heaven Class Heavy Cannon - Need Large Four-Wheel carriaged Cannon Model

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

MING CHINA
Mortars
Crouching Tiger Light Gun - Need Small Two-Legged Cannon Model.
Folang Zhi Breechloader Cannon - S2TW breechloader cannon model may suffice, but custom-made one would be better.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Great General Heavy Cannon - Need Four-Wheeled carriaged Cannon Model

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Not by me.

Chinese Flamethrower? - Use Gatling Gun animation to stream fiery projectiles.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

From All Under Heaven M2TW mod.

Poisonous Smoke Bomb Trebuchet?- Obsolete? Not sure if still used at the time.



Now - Animations.

For the most of the cannons, it's no problem - boshin_engine_parrot_cannon, shogun_engine_fixed_cannon, and even old NTW engine_cannon works.

For Mortars I opted to use boshin_wooden_cannon animation rather than the old engine_mortar; for some reason, when I tested it, The Crew do the crucifix pose - The engine are doing well: It turn and fires, but the crew just stretches their arms.

Hwacha...The most probable alternative are using boshin_engine_gatling_gun. The Problem is that the animations do not have RELOAD, only FIRE_LOOP(yes, Gatling gun in FoTS never reloaded their top magazine, as if they are belt-fed machine gun); meaning the artillery will only be an one-barrage weapon( and one of the crew will crank the wooden cart under blazing rocket exhaust)

The other alternative are trickier...Puckle Gun animation. puckle_gun_barrel_anim_fire.anim are in the data...Is it actually usable? I suspect the engine itself will fire, but the crew still do the crucifix pose, just like the old mortar animation. If this animation used, then the engine will fire in... 7 to 9 burst?(I don't remember it in ETW) then reloading - so we should make the projectile shoot about 5 rocket per fire.

[manolops3]

oh man,i see.a lot things are possible to make,and all this is very interesting.but for now i have to concentrate on the things that are the first ones in the queue.
1.the wider headbands for the Korean Units.
2.the Hat for the Korean Units.
3.my Samurai-Armor
4.figure out how to tell the game,that it have to use the right Texture for my Katana.
5.the Chinese Armor and a modified one for the Korean units,and before that get the permission to do it from the Author of this Armor.
6.the Turtle Ship

and about the Turtle Ship,thats are bad news,it seems that it is a lot more difficult as i expected,
so i ask you Wangrin,would you say it is impossible with the capabilities we currently have ?

but i want also to try to make korean artillery...........

[wangrin]

I fear it will not be possible to place guns because we don't know how to do.
CA didn't provide example of ship or building with guns, so we have nothing to figure how to do.

Even using the cannon bune, or something like this as a base is not possible because we need an example of the logic.xml to place them (looking at <cannons> </cannons>).

[manolops3]

i took a look now on the cannon bune in 3DS Max,and the Cannons not there,so it seems that the Cannons are not a part of the Model.so when this logic.xml file tells the game where to place
the Cannons,maybe when i build a ship model,and place the cannon-shot-gaps in the model-walls at exactly the same place like it is in the CannonBune-Model,and use this CannonBune-logic.xml file copied
for my new Ship too.............maybe then.........but i could imagine that i am a lot too optimistic here....

[wangrin]

Problem is we have not the cannon bune logic.xml, only the logic.txt that didn't contain all the information from the logic.xml.
I suppose that logic.xml and .max models data are combined into .CS2 after having run CS2 converter.
And then, CS2 is used to create files (db, rigid_model_v2, etc.) after runnin BoB.

Data about cannon places are certainly send to models_naval tables.
You can export it using PFM and then open it using an hexadecimal editor.
If you search for c.a.n.n.o.n (63006100 6e006e00 6f006e), you will fin field composed of what look like 3 set of data (maybe x, y, z coordinates ?).
It look like fields are :

• 63006100 6e006e00 6f006e (field name : c.a.n.n.o.n)
• 00 (separator)
• 0x (number, probably cannon n° as it progress from 01 to 0c (12) for L'Océan ship)
• 000000 (maybe a separator again)
• 0x (number, between 01 and 02 in this example, maybe related to deck ?)
• 000000 (maybe a separator again)
• probably 3 sets of 64 bits, but not necessarily. To place a cannon, the game certainly need {x,y,z} coordinate and a direction.
• 0600 (end of cannon fields)

[manolops3]

hmmm.....

so when im open with PFM the models.pack and go to rigidmodels/naval/cannon_bune/ and in this folder there is the " logic.xml.rigging " - data , then this data is not the logic.xml , instead of this
a downgraded logic.txt data ?

[wangrin]

Raw model (eg. .max model) is tied to a logic.xml and both files (.max and .xml) are used to create the .cs2 one that is then used by BoB.
This logic.xml is not the same than the logic.xml.rigging you can find in S2TW model pack.

Open these both file and compare them.
The logic.xml contain data about pieces, collision model, eflines, etc.
The logic.xml.riggin contain only data about sails and ropes (particle models).