Smart Decisions

[Sun Jetzu]

So ive played through the majority of an Otomo camp and have had every Shogun 2 General charge my yari wall head on!
EVERY SINGLE TIME. Now this thread isnt about this little annoyance from the AI.
I have one simple question? Will the AI be good enough to go for YOUR general if he's on the field?
Obviously this could be broken, we dont want the army just aiming for the general, but would it be hard for the AI to know when its a good time to go for the general
If he's alone?
If he's not alone?
Will it outflank to get to him if the opportunity arises? Or is this just something that will never happen in a total war game?
Because ive never had the AI kill my general if he wasnt in combat first. Let alone take the opportunity of killing him if he's alone by outflanking ect.
All I know is, if I went into every battle knowing that there was at least an 80% chance the AI would actively go for my general then I would plan my tactics better. And enjoy the rush of knowing your family member who've you worked on for some time may be killed by an outflanking cavalry force.
Just a thought, but i guess this goes into the bucket next to "Will the AI use ambushes effectively on the battle map?" and "Will the AI form proper Battle formations?"

[Captain W. Handberg]

DESS TO TEH DISHONORABL MAN.

CAVARRY CRURSHED. SHAMFUR DISPREY.

[babydoc]

DESS TO TEH DISHONORABL MAN.

CAVARRY CRURSHED. SHAMFUR DISPREY.

HAHA made me lol hard

@OP I dont think that anyone here has no clue whatsoever.
Only the devs know.

They said they made the best AI as of yet but that doesnt mean a thing.
What matters is how the AI will behave when we , the games are playing.

[Bobhead]

What difficulty do you play on? That really affects how the AI think. Most people play and Normal/Normal and complain about the AI

[SamueleD]

What difficulty do you play on? That really affects how the AI think. Most people play and Normal/Normal and complain about the AI

The AI on normal is already at its maximum intelligence, increasing the difficulty only adds to its cheats, which can make for a challenge, if that's your cup of tea.

@OP What can I tell you, I really hope so, but I'll be content if the AI is at Shogun 2 level without the suicide general bug, if they improve it even more good, but I don't have my hopes up for huge AI improvements.

[Sun Jetzu]

What difficulty do you play on? That really affects how the AI think. Most people play and Normal/Normal and complain about the AI

The Difficulty doesnt matter.

[TotalWarker]

What difficulty do you play on? That really affects how the AI think. Most people play and Normal/Normal and complain about the AI

The AI isn't hampered mate, difficulty is adjusted via buffs to things like morale etc.

On topic, the only thing I've seen on the AI is that rally point. It certainly sounded as if there was at least a partial overhaul, but this of course is no guarentee. That guy (apologies but cant remember his name) specifically mentioned better decision making within sieges as an example, ie they look to exploit your weaknesses. The general certainly comes under a 'weakness' if exposed, but it's not exclusively the only way to win.

If this was one of the strings to the AI bow then awesome, but tactically I'd hope more for a cohisive defense/attack which responded to flanking, openings and unit match ups.

[SturmChurro]

In most of my games I don't really get the enemy general suicide charging in my battles as often in SHOGUN 2 (it does it in FoTS against my lines though), it does suicide it's light cavalry like that. I usually see it trying to flank with it's stronger cavalry and actually sitting behind the battle inspiring the troops in front with it's generals. In sieges it just waits until all the melee units are destroyed or routed to come up and fight.

I kind of want to see the AI doing more in battles, burning gates, more flanking, etc.

[SamueleD]

I kind of want to see the AI doing more in battles, burning gates, more flanking, etc.

Yeah, me too, I'd just like to see it do more of the basic stuff, like putting archers on loose formation, taking some time to skirmish, particularly in sieges, valuing generals for more of their fighting capabilities, more flanking, avoiding suicide charges and pick better fights, fights it can actually win, etc. I don't expect some genius tactics and strategies from it, but I would like to see a certain understanding and use of basic game mechanics, in Shogun 2 the AI did use its units abilities, but I've never seen it burn down a gate or tower or use loose formation.

[Sun Jetzu]

but I've never seen it burn down a gate or tower or use loose formation.

you know what i loath more than even general suicides. When the Ai masses its units into one hug mob, archers intermingled with infantry.
I can always surround them and cut them down like pigs. i feel it shouldnt be too hard to make AI be tactful, just code the entire Art of War and the 5 rings into the game lmao

[eskil]

Yeah, me too, I'd just like to see it do more of the basic stuff, like putting archers on loose formation, taking some time to skirmish, particularly in sieges, valuing generals for more of their fighting capabilities, more flanking, avoiding suicide charges and pick better fights, fights it can actually win, etc. I don't expect some genius tactics and strategies from it, but I would like to see a certain understanding and use of basic game mechanics, in Shogun 2 the AI did use its units abilities, but I've never seen it burn down a gate or tower or use loose formation.

Talking about sieges, who want the AI to actually understand when an assault is over and retreat???

It pisses me off that all the sieges i win end with the enemy army annihilated...i expect that after i routed all their enemy unit they continue to use the archer till the ammo are depleted and then retreate( unless they have the means to win)

[osros]

On a related question in Rome 2, How will you all play with your faction leader? Will he be risked as head of an army or will he be somewhat taking a backseat and commanding other generals in the field? Just curious since we will only 300 turns, shorter life of the Generals.

[Sun Jetzu]

On a related question in Rome 2, How will you all play with your faction leader? Will he be risked as head of an army or will he be somewhat taking a backseat and commanding other generals in the field? Just curious since we will only 300 turns, shorter life of the Generals.

I always use a very hands on leader. So he will be the pillar of every battle

[SturmChurro]

On a related question in Rome 2, How will you all play with your faction leader? Will he be risked as head of an army or will he be somewhat taking a backseat and commanding other generals in the field? Just curious since we will only 300 turns, shorter life of the Generals.

He will probably always be the head of my main army, with the faction heir always commanding the second army. Of course however, with the shorter lifespan after awhile those two armies may get mismatched with the second army now becoming the faction leaders and giving my new faction heir the original main army. I'll use them like I do now, more of a flanking force who obviously moves all over the battlefield to keep lines from breaking. For foot* generals I'll probably use them more as shock units and throw them into melee quick. I'll still flank with them when the need arises.

[Sun Jetzu]

He will probably always be the head of my main army, with the faction heir always commanding the second army. Of course however, with the shorter lifespan after awhile those two armies may get mismatched with the second army now becoming the faction leaders and giving my new faction heir the original main army. I'll use them like I do now, more of a flanking force who obviously moves all over the battlefield to keep lines from breaking. For melee generals I'll probably use them more as shock units and throw them into melee quick. I'll still flank with them when the need arises.

have they said wether some generals will be on horseback and if some wont be?

[SturmChurro]

have they said wether some generals will be on horseback and if some wont be?

I meant foot* generals.

Yeah, I think somewhere Jack confirmed that, if I remember correctly. The Suebi in the last Rally Point were foot generals I think.

[Sun Jetzu]

I meant foot* generals.

Yeah, I think somewhere Jack confirmed that, if I remember correctly. The Suebi in the last Rally Point were foot generals I think.

I wonder what type of advantage a foot general will have compared to one thats on horseback. Or will it only be a disadvantage?

[SamueleD]

I meant foot* generals.

Yeah, I think somewhere Jack confirmed that, if I remember correctly. The Suebi in the last Rally Point were foot generals I think.

I had understood that each faction has a variety of possible general units, and I hope so, I'd hate to be stuck with foot generals.

Talking about sieges, who want the AI to actually understand when an assault is over and retreat???

It pisses me off that all the sieges i win end with the enemy army annihilated...i expect that after i routed all their enemy unit they continue to use the archer till the ammo are depleted and then retreate( unless they have the means to win)

It all comes down to the AI ability to understand whether it can or cannot win a fight, the AI always fights to the death (I've seen it retreat and not actually rout only in Rome I and maybe Med II), even though retreat would be a better option some times. Aslo in sieges the AI does not wait for its archers to skirmish and exhaust their ammo, it starts firing and simultaneously scale the walls, often hitting its own men and never playing its skirmish advantage.
I open battles it can usually attack decently (ignoring the suicide cav and gens), but it's defensive tactics are way too conservative and too easily exploited, it seems unable to understand when standing on a hill to get its units singled out and destroyed or just massacred with arrows is a bad choice, and always counter-attacks when it's too late.

I do not expect complex strategies from the AI, they would require a theory of mind and a lot of planning, but I would really like to see it use those basic things and make those basic decisions that would make it survive better, it has already been improved a lot, I hope this path continues.

I wonder what type of advantage a foot general will have compared to one thats on horseback. Or will it only be a disadvantage?

A much bigger unit-size, no vulnerability to spears and probably the ability to stay in the thick of the fight, dealing lots of kills and inspiring your melee line at the same time, without having to worry too much about it. A cavalry gen is much more vulnerable to spear infantry and anti-cav cav, and should not be left in a prolonged melee fight, but it can move fast to escape and to provide morale boosts where they are most needed.